Maybe you’ll be old one day too

Hockey pension_pe

“Treasurer Joe Hockey has signaled a further increase in the pension age, more welfare means testing and co-payments for medical services in a speech in Washington delivered as the budget takes shape”.

And it’s not if we didn’t see that one coming.  For quite a while now Hockey has been “priming his audience” with stern lessons about how we must “end the Age of Entitlement”.  Hopefully it’s not just those least able to defend themselves who will be at the top of the Liberal government’s agenda.  To date the cuts already announced, and often surreptitiously, do not instill me with a great deal of confidence; cuts to welfare groups including the PCYC, cuts to legal aid for Aboriginal people and has begun dismantling the GP super clinics, to name but a few.

But surely when Hockey spoke about the ‘Age of Entitlement’ he was referring to the upper income brackets, those with plenty of cash to splash on luxuries such as multiple investment properties and private this and that. . . but perhaps not.

But let’s admit it, we have been forewarned. . .

From April 2012,

Despite an aging population and a higher standard of living than that enjoyed by our children, western democracies in particular have been reluctant to wind back universal access to payments and entitlements from the state.

Quite right and bravo, Joe!  Obviously Hockey was on the cusp of announcing that he didn’t support his boss Credlin, Abbott’s fervent desire to pay ‘women of calibre’ $75,000 for bonding time with bubs.  Or perhaps he was referring to the cancellation of all upper class welfare and other lurks and perks.

But of course not.  These are the same people who add, and substantially to Liberal Party coffers. . . they are therefore a no-go zone.

The Daily Telegraph was clearly stunned to learn:

Senior government sources have confirmed that Australians over the age of 70 are also almost universally securing free or discount medicine ­because they qualify for ­taxpayer-funded concession card schemes.

A stunning 94 per cent of Australians over 70 qualify for either a pensioner concession card or a seniors health care card for self-funded retirees.

The growing number of older Australians claiming discount medicine under the PBS is a challenge for the government because 78 per cent of the cost of scripts claimed at chemists under the PBS is going to concession cardholders.

Hell, we can’t have that!  The luxury, the profligacy – *gasp* discount medicine!  Perhaps we should go back to “the good old days” and have pensioners cut their heart tablets in half to make their prescriptions last that little bit longer.  Pensioners also receive free hearing aids, plus “low cost” batteries, discounts on public transport, plus on electricity.  OMG the world’s gone mad!  It’s all the pensioners’ fault.  We have to stop it now – we simply cannot afford these oldies and their draining the dollars from “hard working Australians”.  How much was that again that Brandis was going to cost us for his new library?  How much was that again that Abbott cost the taxpayer because he didn’t fancy staying the $3,000pw temporary Canberra residence, the house that he had originally chosen?

However, and in the real world, it is important that politicians at least make a semblance of keeping their promises, and it is understandable that at times some do get broken or bent in the process of having to re-jig a government in that particular political party’s own image.  Gillard certainly paid the price for her poorly explained price on carbon, the JuLiar tag being the result.  So I wonder what the public will make of this plethora of broken promises coming from the Liberals?

In a pledge, an absolute guarantee Tony Abbott said on the night before the 2013 election:

“No cuts to education, no cuts to health, no change to pensions, no change to the GST and no cuts to the ABC or SBS.”

And election eve pledges are certainly ones which need to be believed as these are the promises on which many people base their voting decision.  To sneak into victory based on a series of known falsehoods is deception at it’s worst.

146 comments on “Maybe you’ll be old one day too

  1. One could say that our present HOR speaker is a good example of why one should not expect people to work to three score and ten.

    Would it not be more practical to offer rewards that encourage those who are capable to do so. Yes a carrot, not a big stick. A stick that always hurts the weak more.

    I fear for the well being of those on the roads and many other industries, staff by people of this age.

  2. Peak science funding bodies to have their funds cut by 20% as further attacks by this government on science continue. Something that is being widely condemned internationally.

    Then a good point was raised on a radio piece this morning, though they didn’t link this it came to my mind immediately.

    They were asking what work this government expected older people in their 60’s to do, where in many industries and sectors their age precludes them from working. And what is this government doing to address youth unemployment, which has gone up dramatically.

    The two were couched separately but I made a link. Surely having older people work longer increases youth unemployment as they take away available jobs for young school leavers to move into?

    So increasing the pension age to save a false holy grail of a surplus is self defeating as it increases the cost to the government, mainly at the State level, by increasing youth unemployment, drug addiction, alcoholism and crime.

    Taking away the benefits to the young unemployed or having them work for well below subsistence wages, as this government is doing, is also a false saving as it also leads to increased crime and social decay.

    Never has a new Federal government screwed things so rapidly as this one and they are set to continue their decline as the worst government ever.

  3. Hard working Australians are entitled to . . . . .
    It is an aging population Sludges soon we may all live to 100.
    It is unaffordable and I know this word is unknown within ALP.
    Even ALP recognised this when raising the pension age in recent times. You
    all kept quiet on that one as part of your hypocracy policy.
    Even huge spending cuts and huge Tax increases would not get over this hump.

    ps WA senate result just another example of what I call ‘ the dinosaur function
    of Labor ‘. Factions do a deal – you get 2 dud candidates at 1 & 2 , probably
    lucky to get even one Senator elected. Very poor result for Major Parties at
    least the Liberals got 3. Their No3 a retired General and a woman , my guess she
    Has a lot to offer in the Senate!

  4. No, we didn’t keep quiet, Voyager. And neither did the then opposition. They were livid at the suggestion.

    If you want to see hypocrisy, look no further than the party you’re in love with.

  5. Mobius, another item is that women in their 60’s especially have had almost no chance of accumulating anything resembling adequate superannuation. When I started my working life, superannuation for anyone but the upper classes was almost non-existent, and even the very few women in well-paid jobs did not have super’ available to them. Yet I hear young people squeal..why didn’t you save for your retirement! Save, how? With what?

  6. One of the most unaffordable rorts is the partial pension, with benefits, for “self-funded” retirees. They are also eligible for the Seniors Card with its benefits which ordinary pensioners aren’t entitled to.

    It would seem the more you have the more you are “entitled” to. .

  7. Joy and,

    It would seem the more you have the more you are “entitled” to. .

    Didn’t Howard once describe this as (usual weasel words) this as ‘rewarding’ his Aspirationals. To me, the greed-is-good ideal which took hold during Howard’s reign contributed in no small way to the sense of entitlement now held by so many of the more well-to-do. Hockey was right about ‘entitlement’, only it seems that the Libs are going to make the far less ‘entitled’ pay..

  8. Money for property speculators, money for people with private health insurance, money for elite private schools, money for polluters &-soon-money for wealthy mums to be….oh but for the truly needy & deserving, the “Age of Entitlement” is over. This mob are so delusional & hypocritical that it’s almost a joke.

    On the plus side, though, if the polls continue to lag for the Librorts Party, then there is a very solid chance that the party will roll both Abbort & Hockey.

  9. You are absolutely correct, Carol. Weasel Howard told these people they were “battlers” which, in no sense of the word, they weren’t He encouraged their greed for his own political ends.

    A close family member & spouse, both self-employed in areas where cash payments are possible (not saying they are doing this of course), are both on partial pensions with benefits. They were travelling overseas at least once each year whilst still claiming their free car rego etc. Grrr was/am I cranky about that.

  10. To Voyager, mate, regardless of what is or isn’t unaffordable, the place to start cutting is at top, nor the bottom.

    Furthermore, society is judged by how it takes care of the vulnerable people, not by how rich the people in society can get.

  11. Cuts to the ABC flagged in the Fairfax press over the weekend. Another promise seems about to be discarded.

    What amazes me Is the number of people who still tell me : “oh well, it’s still early, let’s see how Abbott goes”. How much more do you need to see?!

  12. “Very poor result for Major Parties at least the Liberals got 3.”. Actually that isn’t known yet “Voyager on a sea of lies”. They’re still counting the pre-poll & postal votes….and working out the preferences. That last seat is far too close to call, & could still well go to Labor (as the postals were *before* News Corpse revealed the comments made by Bullock….who I agree is a complete waste of space). Note, though, that even a substandard candidate in first place still didn’t keep the Libs from seeing a bigger swing against them than Labor got-only 6 months into office & in a very conservative state. Still, trust an obvious employee of the Librorts Part-like you-to try & spin the outcome as a positive for your mob.

  13. Carol, “the age of entitlement” coming from the lips of one who will never have to worry about his future income (apocalypse excluded), makes me want to puke – something I can practically do any time I want; IBS being a part of my chronic illness.

    Still on theme, sometimes shit does happen – strong and healthy for most of my life (not so good in early childhood but recovered extremely well from that), I was struck down unexpectedly, had to access what little superannuation I had (before ‘the age of entitlement’ to withdraw super), I managed for some years on part-time work, however the older I get; the worse my chronic illness. That’s just me and I am actually far more fortunate than many people – older or younger, I manage.

    Mr Hockey and the rest of the Abbottoir refuse to understand or acknowledge that people now entering retirement age and beyond have already worked a lifetime. Whether as PAYE employees, carers or small business owners (not all managed to self-fund retirement – which requires a lifetime of above average income, BTW). We have not been especially privileged, we have to the best of our ability contributed to the wealthy country that is Australia today (would be even wealthier if the top 10% actually paid their share of taxes).

    Those who like to point out that many elderly do volunteer work – conveniently omit that fact that this work IS voluntary! People enjoy it, it is rewarding in a non financial sense (although depending on whom you volunteer for can have side benefits – I know because when I was well enough I did volunteer work) and it is a choice – there is no boss looking at the clock ready to pounce on any mistake or incident. Volunteering is a lot of fun – the dark side is being forced into work which is not rewarding, supportive is more likely to initiate premature health problems than not.

    If the Abbottoir ensures all who are obliged to pay tax, does so – THEN talk about the entitlements of aged and disabled people.

  14. Marcus – sorry but you are typical of Labors Problem.
    1. Delusion – Libs currently 11356 votes in front and polling extremely well with
    Postals etc Labor has little chance. ALP so lazy they did not even run a
    Postal/EVV vote campaign, that is so slack.Reynolds must win or I’m the
    Easter Bunny!
    2 Labor primary at 34%. But they should be very disappointed
    with the result . Dud Labor candidates , infighting as usual , Union deals to get
    No1 position as usual . Voters are sick of this. 1 Senator out of 6 is hopeless.
    3. Labor reforms just have not happened as promised. Party votes for Albo
    MHRs vote for Shorten , it is a Big Joke.
    All of this just makes winning a Federal Election more difficult. Why do I keep
    saying this? I really don’t know or care. Just feel sorry for the Basic Labor Person
    being duded by Unions and self interest.

  15. All this talk about people in retirement is happening because Superannuation does not appear to be working.

    Some people appear to be buying bigger homes than they could normally afford. Upon retirement they cash in their Super, pay off the mortgage, wipe out their Super savings and then go on the pension.

    The whole point of Superannuation was to avoid the need for pensions.

  16. If the Abbottoir ensures all who are obliged to pay tax, does so – THEN talk about the entitlements of aged and disabled people.

    Gina’s not going to like that.

  17. LOL. Voyager. Exactly what I would expect from a Librorts Party apologist like yourself. Trust me, Labor was stupid in its candidate selection, but that should have benefited your beloved Libs-especially so soon into their period in office-& in such a conservative State as WA. Yet for the Libs to have experienced an even BIGGER swing against them-especially after they went to such great lengths to win-merely highlights that they’re even MORE on the nose than Labor are.

  18. diannaart @ 10:04 am

    Listen to Hockey’s piece to air this morning. He framed the hit to pensioners and others in his budget as though he was part of them.

    The pensioners are of my era (repeated twice), so I know how they will be effected as I belong with them.

    Haha, what a joke. A privileged pollie who is on a rich public teat for the rest of their life whilst still being able to get huge paying jobs in the industries they assisted whilst in government, and he has empathy with those of his era.

    And on that another hit to pensions is there will be a crackdown on work and assets whilst receiving a pension of any sort. Again that will apply to everyone but Hockey’s wealthy people of his era and himself, who will more than likely receive huge increases to pay and pension in this term of government.

    Liberals and their supporters, the greatest hypocrites on the planet.

    And I note that not one of their supporters are addressing the three major promises Abbott made on the day before the election that he’s now breaking without pausing for breath. Promises that one political commentator stated were instrumental in getting Abbott elected and were not held to account by the MSM.

    Come on right wingers, where’s your outrage as this government breaks major promise after major promise and throws set in stone commitments out the door on an almost weekly basis? After all you showed unrelenting and massive outrage over one supposed lie but now condone dozens of them that are greater in scope and seriousness.

    Of course they will obfuscate and divert, as projection and hypocrisy are so deeply ingrained in their psyche and persona they think it’s a normal and worthwhile human trait.

  19. Marcus it’s worse for Abbott who went into bat for the WA Liberals, as did Bishop the younger. And like every other Liberal he’s gone into bat for since becoming PM he doomed them.

    They immediately go from winning positions to losers.

    And talk about Abbott tosser loser, where’s his chest beating and big noting himself to the Chinese and other overseas authorities about flight MH370 being found any moment.

    Here he was skiting overseas probably on intelligence that only he had received so was trying to hyperbolise at what a hero he is being the leader of the show and then… nothing and he disappears from the media. His being attacked overseas on his aid cuts and environmental vandalism was probably also a reason he cowered and slinked away.

    Tosser loser.

  20. Come on right wingers, where’s your outrage as this government breaks major promise after major promise

    Who cares about that ME, where’s the msm’s outrage is what I wanna know. Remember their OUTRAGE over the “She LIED” meme that THEY created over what really wasn’t even a broken promise, and their total acceptance of these major breaches of trust now?

  21. “If only there was a compulsory sort of superannuation that incremented to a substantial amount and wasn’t being constantly restricted by a party that now believes age pension is a problem

    You did not read what i said.

    Some people are buying homes more expensive than they can afford and then paying off the more expensive home with their Super payout. And then because they have no savings they go on the pension.

    Perhaps Super should be payed a a small pension every year.

    In other words it is not working like it is supposed to.

  22. And Tom the embarrassing look on Stokes and Packer’s faces is precious. Especially after the fact Packer went on a Rudd/Labor bashing exercise overseas only to find the man he’s backed is an international discomfiture.

    Of course Packer and co knew Abbott was an idiot, banked on it. Any leader with a modicum of intelligence would be difficult to steer.

  23. There’s a first for everything – I agree with Neil 😯

    Lump sum withdrawals need to be limited so that Super can work as it’s meant to.

    If only there was a compulsory sort of superannuation that incremented to a substantial amount and wasn’t being constantly restricted by a party that now believes age pension is a problem

    This is spot on too Tom R – we really need a 15% contribution for someone’s entire working life to properly fund retirement and reduce our dependence on the pension.

    Neil – most of those who’ve only had super since 1992, and have not been amongst the very wealthy who could make very large salary sacrificed and post-tax contributions under Costello’s ridiculous tax-avoidance scheme***, can’t afford to retire without a pension yet. Many ordinary workers are lucky to have accumulated much more than $200K by age 65…

    ***

    Subject to any applicable work test people will be able to make up to $1 million of post-tax contributions between 10 May 2006 and 30June 2007 which will allow people who were planning a large contribution under the existing rules to do so;
    * The $150,000 annual limit on post-tax contributions will commence from 1 July 2007. People aged less than 65 will be able to bring forward two years of contributions, enabling $450,000 to be contributed in one year, with no further contributions in the next two years.

  24. “Neil – most of those who’ve only had super since 1992

    Yes and so with time pension payouts should be coming a smaller problem not bigger. But it looks like compulsory Super is having no effect on the problem of pension blowout.

  25. Neil,

    Two reasons – Howard & Abbott governments’ limiting of contributions (we should have at least 12% by now), and allowing too much in the way of lump sum withdrawals…

  26. Yea ME, Packer looked very embarrassed. But, I don’t think he cares. All of those attending would be very happy with the way things are looking for them under this government. Less tax to pay for them, and less they have to pay their workers.

    I’m pretty sure Packer can put up with a muppet as PM if he gives them all that

  27. Howard & Abbott governments’ limiting of contributions

    That has it in one Bacchus. They have stifled it for so long, and now want to complain about it not working??

  28. “They have stifled it for so long, and now want to complain about it not working??

    I has seen people say it is not working because people are spending their lump sum payouts really quickly.

    It needs to be paid out in the form of a pension.

  29. It needs to be paid out in the form of a pension.

    For the third time Neil – I agree with you!, BUT…. we need a contribution rate of 15% to properly fund our retirement. Some can salary sacrifice over and above the compulsory rate, some can make extra contributions up to the (more reasonable) limit of $25,000 (going up to $30,000 next financial year), but most can’t…

  30. we need a contribution rate of 15% to properly fund our retirement

    It appears it needs to be repeated 😉

  31. It needs to be paid out in the form of a pension.

    I don’t disagree (but I thought it was??) But whatever happened to the almighty “choice”

  32. Read up before making statements on lump sums etc.

    Australia’s retirement income system is the most sustainable of 50 countries, according to a new survey by Allianz.

    Yes, Howard/Costello really screwed up our pensions and now Abbott/Hockey are looking like punishing pensioners for Howard/Costello’s major stuff up.

    When long term economic damage is done it nearly always come back to Liberal government policy, and we are still suffering the Howard government’s considerable failings, and will for decades to come.

  33. Even that Allianz report agrees Mö…

    Allianz Australia managing director Niran Peiris said one area the report found concerning was that Australia’s superannuation system allowed people to give lump sum contributions.

    “The report highlighted that allowing people to take all their superannuation savings as a lump sum to be used to repay home mortgages or other purposes risked leaving retirees with reduced incomes for their retirement,” he said.

    Once again, sheeted back to the Howard government. Labor was making moves in the right direction to fix some of this up though…

  34. For the third time Neil – I agree with you!,

    OK but TomR keeps butting in.

    But is that true?? People are spending their lump sum payouts really quickly and then going on the pension.

    If so no percentage (9% or 15%) would be high enough. If people get lump sums they will just spend it on overseas trips and a nicer home and then go on the pension.

  35. Bottom line – Costello stuffed it up, leaving it fraught with political danger to clean up. Labor was moving towards getting it back on track, but now we have the unbelievably incompetent morons on the treasury benches again, stuffing it up further and punishing those who can least afford it – typical Liberal ideology 🙄

  36. Don’t 100% agree Bacchus.

    The retirees in my circles, and they may not be representative, are better off having used their lump sums to pay off their mortgages.

    They own their homes, which is a huge plus in retirement. If they didn’t have it they would have to rent, which is a bigger burden on pensions than having a reduced pension because you paid down your house loan with a lump sum.

    Also the home becomes an asset if you need to go into care or sell to go into a serviced retirement village.

    Where Howard/Costello failed was allowing people to draw on their pensions for other purposes than paying off their mortgage.

  37. OK but TomR keeps butting in.

    lol me fat nasty hobbittses 😉

    But what about the CHOICE!!

    Isn’t that the libs mantra, we must have CHOICE!!

    Now, it appears CHOICE is bad?? (I don’t disagree)

  38. Bottom line – Costello stuffed it up, leaving it fraught with political danger to clean up.

    What stuff up was this?? I am not an expert in Superannuation. My understanding is that Costello allowed bigger contributions.

    Once again- It does not matter if it is 9% or 15% or 25%, if people are allowed to spend their lump sum payment they will. And then go on the pension.

  39. As Mr Burke said today. the report that Hockey is quoting has been around for two or more years. Hockey know nothing that he did not know befor the election. Did not need that audit to know.

    Labor was moving towards dealing with some of the concerns. In fact Abbott has repealed some of their efforts.

    ………………So while the Government could save some money through attacks on the living standards, dignity and relative independence on the disabled (linking the pension to inflation rather than wages growth), it should be honest that its real motive is not some ‘budget emergency’ – but an Ideological commitment to small government no matter the human cost.

    ‘Pension austerity’ needs to be considered in the context where all Australian families should benefit from the social insurance paid collectively by all of us – for the sake of our peace of mind – both for ourselves and our loved ones. And also hopefully because we care about each other as a society. This must include a robust disability pension alongside robust disability insurance.

    For those who care about distributive justice, and compassion for the poor and vulnerable, surely there must be better solutions than what is apparently being considered by Hockey and the Liberal Cabinet.

    And indeed there ARE better solutions. Superannuation Concessions could be wound back – and income tax increased on the basis of a progressive restructuring. Tens of billions could be saved here alone.

    To elaborate: It is true that tax cuts delivered overwhelmingly to upper and middle income Australians during the Howard years were recently estimated as costing the Budget around $40 billion a year alone. And as Richard Denniss has argued on several occasions – superannuation concessions have been of benefit largely to the top 5 per cent income demographic (millionaires basically), a well as the ‘upper middle class’; and more broadly are estimated by the Treasury as costing “$45 billion a year by 2015.”

    To summarise: The Government has several potential alternatives on the table they could consider – and the Shorten Opposition should be pursuing these progressive options also.

    First: Wind back superannuation concessions for the wealthy and the upper middle class, saving tens of billions.

    Second: Restructure personal income tax. Perhaps allow bracket creep in the higher brackets – but INDEX the lower two brackets. And perhaps add a bracket for the highest income earners.

    Third: Increase the GST – but only as part of a ‘total package’ which includes increased welfare, tax credits or other tax cuts for lower income Australians, maintenance of exemptions on food and health, and extension of GST exemptions to funerals as well. Calibrate the overall ‘tax mix’, here, to deliver more progressive outcomes.

    Fourth: Embrace the necessity of ‘larger government’ if ‘the Australian way of life’ is to be preserved – including a fair age of retirement and protection of the most vulnerable from grinding poverty. In this acknowledge that ‘the size of government’ in Australia is already low by international standards.

    Fifth: If the Government is concerned there is an ‘incentive’ for pensioners to apply for the Disability Pension because of the extraordinarily low Newstart unemployment benefit – then INCREASE NEWSTART to respectable and socially sustainable levels – and acknowledge that while the Disability and Aged Pensions are higher – disability and aged pensioners are still living in poverty!

    Sixth: Reconsider spending priorities with ‘upper middle class welfare’. Specifically, reconsider the structure of ‘Paid Parental Leave’, and impose tighter means tests of Private Health Insurance Rebate payments.

    Budget pressures also need to be considered in the context of a growing infrastructure crisis……

    http://www.onlineopinion.com.au/view.asp?article=16212&page=0

    The simple truth is, we are once again being conned.

    After listening to ABC local during the night, not many are being taken in. Dislike of Abbott’s policies was on display.

    I suspect the public is not as stupid as some would like to believe.

  40. To elaborate: It is true that tax cuts delivered overwhelmingly to upper and middle income Australians during the Howard years were recently estimated as costing the Budget around $40 billion a year alone

    See it is comments like this why i say you people are dishonest.

    If this is true Mr Tristan Ewnis why did not Labor change this??? They had the numbers to get this through Parliament.

    Furthermore Swan not only do nothing but increased the tax cuts and then bragged about it.

  41. Labor did begin to reverse much of what Howard and Costello did. Yes, and what they did, was among the first things that Abbott repealed, straight after being elected.

    Every action that Gillard took, was met by screams from Abbott and his cronies.

    Whether you believe it or not, I do not care. Facts are hard to ignore.

  42. Neil, why do you persist with such comments. You have been told many times over the last few years, that Rudd should not have gone ahead with

    The GFC then intervened in what come next.

    Yes there are structural problems with the budget. Sadly they are not the ones that Hockey is spruiking about.

  43. The retirees in my circles, and they may not be representative, are better off having used their lump sums to pay off their mortgages.

    I agree within limits Mö…

    What I said was, “Lump sum withdrawals need to be limited so that Super can work as it’s meant to.

    Note: limited not banned altogether. In the case you mentioned, I wouldn’t like to see someone able to pay off a mortgage on a $2 million+ home with a lump sum from their super and then go on the pension – there have to be reasonable limits. Likewise, expensive holidays and cars should not be funded by what should be used for a retirement income…

  44. 9 May 2006

    In the Budget, Treasurer Costello announced plans to simplify superannuation. Simpler Super includes:

    – exemption from tax on end benefits for Australians aged 60 or over from I July 2007;
    – no tax on a lump sum;
    – no tax on a superannuation pension;
    – reasonable benefit limits to be abolished; and
    – transferring super between funds made easier. Implementation date is 1 July 2007.

    The abolition of RBLs and tax on lump sums, together with the ridiculously increased concessional contribution limits encouraged exactly the sort of behaviour you’re now decrying Neil 🙄

    It’s very hard to unbake a cake – what Costello stuffed up isn’t easy to undo. Labor made a start, but there’s a very long way to go. What “passion fingers” Hockey is now doing may take a couple of decades to fix!

  45. “Neil, why do you persist with such comments.

    Because it is true.

    You cannot blame Costello for tax cuts that happened SEVEN years ago.

    I hate people like Mr Tristan Ewnis. He does not even mention the Wayne Swan tax cuts from 2008-2013. But goes way back into history but IGNORES the MAY 2013 budget tax cuts.

    “”Yes there are structural problems with the budget”

    All caused by Labor. This from the PBO

    From a structural surplus in the range of 1¾ to 3¼ per cent of GDP in 2002-03, the estimated SBB moved into structural balance briefly somewhere in the period 2006-07 to 2007-08 before falling to a structural deficit of around 3¼ to 4¼ per cent of GDP in 2011-12

    Furthermore the structural deficit crap was introduced by Swan to trash Costello. Latest information gives a different story.

  46. There are many flaws in Australia’s superannuation system that make it both highly inequitable and unsustainable as Australia’s population ages. Central among these concerns is that it allows an individual to retire at 60, withdraw their super tax free as a lump sum, blow the money on consumption, and then go on the aged pension from 65 years of age. In such instances, the taxpayer is left wearing the cost of superannuation concessions throughout the individual’s working life, and then again once that same individual goes on the aged pension. It is a loop hole that must be closed, and taxing superannuation lump sums, whilst at the same time encouraging retirees to withdraw their savings as a annuity (instead of the pension), is essential to ensure the system’s longevity.

    http://www.macrobusiness.com.au/2013/08/superannuation-is-inequitable-and-unsustainable/

  47. All caused by Labor. This from the PBO

    Reverted to type Neil? Tellies porkies again? That’s not what the PBO actually said…

    Over two thirds of the 5 percentage points of GDP decline in structural receipts over the period 2002-03 to 2011-12 was due to the cumulative effect of the successive personal income tax cuts granted between 2003-04 and 2008-09. A further quarter was the result of a decline in excise and customs duties as a proportion of GDP. Significant factors driving this trend included the abolition of petroleum fuels excise indexation in the 2001-02 Budget and the decline in the consumption of cigarettes and tobacco over the period.

    Commentary on the PBO report from one of Neil’s favourite economists:

    The Libs keep saying the problem is Labor’s unrestrained spending but, in fact, it’s almost all on the tax side. The tax weakness arises overwhelmingly from Costello’s eight delivered or promised tax cuts. Swan’s main failings were to actually deliver the last three of those cuts and to not restore the indexation of petrol excise.

  48. Null of Sydney also likes to forget that a report for the IMF found the Liberals (Howard and Costello) the most wasteful government in Australia’s 200-year history.

    Shame on the Liberals.

  49. Null of Sydney also likes to forget that a report for the IMF found the Liberals (Howard and Costello) the most wasteful government in Australia’s 200-year history.”

    You sure know how to make me repeat myself but i cannot let a falsehood go unanswered.

    Firstly that IMF report was a working paper picked up by Peter Martin for political propaganda purposes.

    Secondly the Howard/Costello govt is not mentioned in that report. It is talking about ALL of Australia (Federal, State and local govt). Howard is not even mentioned. eg Beattie and Bligh creating $80B of debt in Queensland while Costello is paying off Federal debt.

    Third i know that IMF report is a load of crap because you keep mentioning it. People like you are ALWAYS attracted to falsehoods.

    Fourthly do you believe everything in the media or only reports that trash anything that may show the Coalition in a bad light??

  50. Yes cuppa, a pecis of the the IMF findings.

    The basis of the IMF in making that statement is an examination of 200 years of government financial records not only in Australia but across 55 leading economies.

    The IMF pinpointed two periods of fiscal profligacy in Australia which were both during Mr Howard’s term from 1996 to 2007. The first was in 2003 at the start of the mining boom and the second was during his last two years in office between 2005 and 2007.

    The study pointed out that number of spending decisions beyond $1 billion went up from one in the first budget during the Howard administration to nine in the last year, while the proportion of savings measure went down from one-third of budget measures to 1.5 per cent at the end.

    The IMF went on to say that apart from Menzies and Howard Australian governments have overall been prudent.

    With Abbott already spending 10% more than the previous government and being the instigator of the biggest budget decline in the shortest time ever it seems Liberal governments are going to continue being profligate and also terrible government.

  51. …picked up by Peter Martin for political propaganda purposes… IMF report is a load of crap

    Lol, talk about shooting the messenger, Null. The truth really does disagree with you Liberal people. I wouldn’t be surprised if you get hives when encountering truth and facts- an allergic reaction.

    The most wasteful government in the history of Australia – that record takes some beating! No wonder you’re touchy…

  52. I’m still waiting for the right wingers outrage at Abbott’s blatant and irrefutable lies. They are being posted across the social media and even making their way into the MSM.

    So if they right wingers were so outraged at one lie that wasn’t one why aren’t they up in arms against Abbott who has told the most lies and broken the most promises in the shortest time for any Federal government?

    If they keep ignoring Abbott’s and this government lies and broken promises whilst obfuscating back to Labor it means they are first rate hypocrites and have no credibility in anything they state. Their words are empty, meaningless and based purely on blind ideology and not any lucid thoughts or facts.

  53. If the right wingers are going to be consistent in their reactions, compared with Julia Gillard’s one broken promise about the carbon tax, Abbott’s litany of knowing lies and backflips should lead to the end of life as we know it.

  54. “Lol, talk about shooting the messenger, Null. The truth really does disagree with you Liberal people.

    No, falsehoods disagree with me.

    Costello saved $100B in surplus budgets and had $80B in asset sales so he saved $100B + $80B = $180B over 11 years.

    Cuppa as a human you should try and be honest. Do you believe in every report??

    I know the deceit of you people. I know you do not have a conscience and have no care for the truth.

  55. Null,

    Be honest. Costello was the beneficiary of the biggest influx of tax revenue in this country’s history. Yet he left $58 billion in gross government debt and the budget in structural deficit.

    Labor had to borrow money the moment the GFC threatened. Why do you think that was, Null? You think they WANTED to borrow money? Of course they didn’t, but they HAD TO because the Liberals left public finances threadbare after spending their way through biggest burst of global prosperity in human history.

  56. And around and around and around we go.

    And if Costello had run $40B surpluses instead of the $20B he ran you would have invented some other nasty things to say.

    Most probably have been saying we should have no surplus budgets but spend on this that or whatever.

    Why don’t you admit the truth for once. You are a hate filled bigot incapable of telling the truth.

  57. They wasted the proceeds of the biggest influx of tax revenue in the country’s history… Then they left the budget in structural deficit and their labor successors had to go into debt to get the money to meet the GFC challenge.

    Shame on the Liberals.

  58. No structural deficit in 2007. The best definition of a structural deficit is this

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Structural_deficit

    Some economists have questioned the distinction between cyclical and structural deficits. They contend that there are too many variables involved to allow a clear distinction to be made, especially when dealing with current circumstances rather than retrospectively, and suggest that the concept of structural deficits may be used more for political purposes than analytical purposes”

    Did you ever hear about structural deficits before 2008??

    The Structural Deficit crap was invented by Wayne Swan to trash Costello.

    Shame on you as a human being Cuppa for being so dishonest. It is people like you why this planet is so dishonest.

  59. By Leith van Onselen

    Macro Business, 27 May 2013:

    Little-by-little, inch-by-inch, the common misconception that the Howard/Costello Government were fiscal superheroes is unravelling and the truth is being revealed.

    The latest salvo came from the Sydney Morning Herald’s economics editor, Ross Gittens, who published a well reasoned article on Saturday arguing that the lion’s share of the current budget deficit stems from tax and spending decisions undertaken by the former Howard/Costello Government, which moved the Budget into structural deficit, causing revenues to collapse once the once-in-a-century mining boom began to subside

    http://www.macrobusiness.com.au/2013/05/the-secret-of-the-howard-governments-surpluses/

  60. George Megalogenis, 16 May 2009:

    Coalition faces a ruinous record

    …the budget was shot at the time of the [2007] election because too much of the revenue windfall from the resources boom had been handed back as tax cuts and increased spending.

    “The structural budget balance deteriorated from 2002-03, moving into structural deficit in 2006-07,” Treasury said in budget paper No1 on Tuesday night.

    http://web.archive.org/web/20090518153345/http://www.theaustralian.news.com.au/story/0,25197,25489387-7583,00.html

  61. cuppa just from reading your posts I see that Neil is running a diversion again, harping back so as not to face Abbott’s continuous litany of blatant lies.

    He does this all the time when he’s faced with a failure of a Liberal. There is no greater proof of how bad the Liberals are than their supporters, especially Neil, having to constantly hark to Labor whenever a Liberal failure, lie, deceit or broken promise is raised.

    In doing so they constantly confirm how bad Liberal governments and pollies are.

  62. ME,

    Null is sour and now getting personal because his heroes are shown up as pretenders. When cornered with the truth, his type fights and spits – anything rather than accept truth and facts.

  63. “Ross Gittens, who published a well reasoned article on Saturday arguing that the lion’s share of the current budget deficit stems from tax and spending decisions undertaken by the former Howard/Costello Government

    Load of crap. But if true easy to fix. Just reverse the tax cuts.

    Not only did Swan not reverse the cuts he increased the tax cuts.

    Just admit the truth. Large numbers of people hate the Coalition and tell lies about them.

    http://www.budget.gov.au/2013-14/content/overview/html/overview_41.htm

    The Government has delivered $47 billion of tax cuts in our first four years since coming to office. In addition, we have provided further tax cuts as assistance for the cost of living impact of the carbon price from 2012‑13. Even after accounting for the small increase in the Medicare levy in 2014‑15 we will be delivering total tax cuts of around $20 billion a year over the next four years compared to the 2007‑08 tax scales.”

    WAYNE SWAN

  64. Howard’s pattern of big spending was what you’d expect a government to do to pull an economy out of a downturn … but he was doing it during the boom point of the economic cycle. No idea!

    George Megalogenis, 12 September 2009:

    Welcome to structural deficit-land

    …Treasury advised that the final term of the Howard government was a doozy because “the recent growth in spending stands out along with the growth in spending under the Whitlam government in 1974-75 and the increased spending following the recessions in 1982-83 and 1990-91”.

    http://www.theaustralian.com.au/news/opinion/welcome-to-structural-deficit-land/story-e6frg7ex-1225772087943

  65. yes and from your link

    It is extraordinary that the (Rudd) government went to the lengths it did, which included concocting a new measure of structural balance to try to show that there was a deficit in the last years of the Coalition government,” Costello said.”

    It is amazing the lengths you people go to to trash your fellow Australian citizens who vote differently to you people. Constructive criticism is great.

    But you people are the masters of deceit. After all these years it never ceases to amaze me how deceitful ALP voters are.

  66. If you want to tell lies that is on your head. Constructive comments are always welcome.

    But once again no-one had heard of a structural deficit in 2008 until Rudd/Swan went to great lengths to try and trash Costello. Shows more about Rudd/Swan and the ALP than anything else.

  67. Null,

    The Treasury department itself used the term “structural deficit”. Stop telling lies please.

  68. “The Treasury department itself used the term “structural deficit

    And who instructed Treasury to investigate this relatively new measure of structural balance??

    Rudd/Swan did this to trash Costello.

    And Treasury comes out with a new result everytime they try and measure structural balance. The result put into the Swans 2010 budget is different to what they now say.

  69. Yes but it was not used in Australia until relatively recently. I doubt if anybody had heard of the concept until Rudd/Swan instructed Treasury to try and trash Costello. I gave this link earlier

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Structural_deficit

    They contend that there are too many variables involved to allow a clear distinction to be made, especially when dealing with current circumstances rather than retrospectively, and suggest that the concept of structural deficits may be used more for political purposes than analytical purposes

  70. Notice how Null vilifies:

    The IMF
    Ross Gittins
    The Treasury Department

    and anybody else who criticises the Liberals… but he never finds fault with those who put the budget into structural deficit – Howard and Costello, the most wasteful duo in the history of Australia.

    Shame on the Liberals.

  71. Federal cabinet Is expected to sign off on Badgerys Creek tomorrow. Money flowing from budget to begin next year.

    Another oldie died, Brian Harradine.

  72. Why not tell Neil, if he will find the answers to all his allegations in the archives. Many times in fact,

    Time to move onto today. It is now Abbott in charge. Yes, the days of Rudd and Gillard are now what seems long in the past.

    Maybe we should just ignore, until he comes up with something new. Just an idea.

    To much going on, to waste time on the likes of him.

  73. I gave this link earlier

    No, what you gave was an incomplete quote from a brief paragraph titled “criticism” that had been tacked onto the very end of a Wikipedia article on Structural Deficits. It says that “some economists” criticise the concept, without saying who these economists are or how many of them there are.

    There are always economists disputing almost every concept; that you’ve found reference to some unnamed dissenters is not important, and doesn’t on its own disprove the premises of Structural Deficit.

  74. Yes but it was not used in Australia until relatively recently.

    Horsey poo Neil. Economists have been arguing these terms for decades. The big change has been basing the structural balance concept on the (flawed) concept of NAIRU in the 70s.

    Time for some more study Neil? 😉

  75. Howard pork barrelled to stay in power,(that’s a fact).. like all Lib’s he was only thinking of himself, ‘the individual’ and his place ‘n power on the neo-con totem pole, both then and into the future, his and Costtalotto’s legacy will always be profligacy, erosion of the tax base with cuts to the well off ( the structural deficient creation, NoS 😉 ) , large expensive government ( quite the opposite of the mantra),vote buying upper class welfare, ignoring/dismantling of Keatings long term fiscal reforms (increasing super to 9% then 12% etc which would of went a long way towards solving the boomer situ[ though we have one of the lowest ‘spends’ on oldies pensions per GDP]), selling profitable public entities and the gold( to the general publics detriment), getting us involved in war(s) that were nought to do with us and on and on…. in short, he bribed and lied and manipulated …ALL just to be PM, i.e. he put ‘his’ history before Australia’s- to the detriment of Australians…… in other words, a typical Liberal Party member. 😡

  76. LOVO

    you said this- “erosion of the tax base with cuts to the well off ”

    What do you think of these tax cuts??

    http://www.budget.gov.au/2013-14/content/overview/html/overview_41.htm

    The Government has delivered $47 billion of tax cuts in our first four years since coming to office. In addition, we have provided further tax cuts as assistance for the cost of living impact of the carbon price from 2012‑13. Even after accounting for the small increase in the Medicare levy in 2014‑15 we will be delivering total tax cuts of around $20 billion a year over the next four years compared to the 2007‑08 tax scales.

    In the May 2013 budget WAYNE SWAN even has a Table comparing his even bigger tax cuts to Costello’s

  77. it was not used in Australia until relatively recently

    Australia wasn’t plunged into Structural Deficit until relatively recently.

    What do you think of these tax cuts?

    Ridiculous. But, who was the idiot who came out on the first day of an election and promised them. Yes, Labor should have reneged on them, but the initial promise was symptomatic of Howards game play in winning office. And why we now have a structural deficit.

    The libs blocked almost everything Labor tried to implement to correct the imbalance, especially when it came to winding back middle class welfare.

    I wonder how much better the books would look should the Mining Tax and Carbon Price remain on them? I haven’t seen any reporting in that direction.

  78. The libs blocked almost everything Labor tried to implement to correct the imbalance, especially when it came to winding back middle class welfare.

    They certainly did. They cried “class warfare!”, a classic piece of Right-Wing Projection given their own current activities.

    Meanwhile Limited News joined with the Liberals in opposing Labor. Who can forget that infamous front page cartoon in the Australian depicting Gillard and Swan as communists marching under the hammer-and-sickle flag.

    So we had the Liberals, plus the media, opposing measures to correct the structural deficit imposed on the Budget BY the Liberals.

    Even now they are seeking to abolish income measures that, if left in place, would help address the structural shortfall.

    Everything they do shows they are happy to see the ‘income’ side of the ledger remain in structural deficit.

    Shame on the Liberals.

  79. Cuppa, without a doubt the Liberals under Abbott did everything possible to stunt Australia’s growth and wellbeing, via absolute obstructionism. It was nothing to do with what was good (or bad) for the country, but all to do with their own selfish ends. The worst opposition in history, because they put themselves and their own political ambition ahead of the country and now the worst government in history – and for exactly the same reason.

  80. Tom R, the same way6 that the Greens and Coalition Opposition undermined all that Labor attempted when it times to asylum seekers.

    I get amusement out of Houston now leading Abbott’s manipulation of the Malaysian lost plane. The same man’s who headed the Expert Panel and their findings. Maybe if the Malaysian Solution, and later the findings of the expert panel was allowed to proceed, we would not have the cruel, expensive and sadistic solution now in place.

    This PM uses all that he comes in contact with, including the public.

    He is leading us to disaster, Disaster on all fronts.

    It is not only us so called rusted on, misguided Labor supporters that believe this. It includes many on his own side. It appears the Nationals are xlise to revolt.

    Why have then Badgerys Creek announcement today. Yes, even money in the budget to begin immediately.

    Sorry, their is more to worry about, than history, and who is to blame in some people eyes. If this is one’s problem and interest, find a history blog. More to your liking.

  81. Peter Martin bemoans the cost of the pension..

    The full pension package now amounts to $21,900 for a single, and $33,000 for a couple.

    Once in the ballpark, the Newstart unemployment allowance languishes at an impossibly low $13,300.

    Should it be any other way? People on Newstart are able bodied workers who are (at least on the surface of it) capable of taking any job which comes their way. For people on the full pension, they have finished their working lives and extremely few have the potential to get jobs or upskill at any time in the future.

    http://www.smh.com.au/comment/why-our-pension-scheme-is-too-generous-20140414-zqui8.html#ixzz2ytlAFRqt

    I note that the Liberals have gone quiet on the suggestion that pensioners living in houses valued over $1M should be forced to sell. Perhaps the visual of dear old granny being dragged bodily from her little inner-city fibro or dragged screaming from her shingle roof country shack (her father was a local pioneer), might have been too much even for the Liberals.

  82. “The libs blocked almost everything Labor tried to implement to correct the imbalance, especially when it came to winding back middle class welfare.

    ???????????????????

    The ALP/Greens Coalition had the numbers to get anything they wanted through both houses of Parliament.

    I am sure the Greens would have voted for a tax increase.

    So we had the Liberals, plus the media, opposing measures to correct the structural deficit imposed on the Budget BY the Liberals.”

    No structural deficit in 2007. Treasury keeps changing its numbers re:alleged structural deficit, a concept invented by Rudd/Swan to trash Costello. This is what Treasury said last year which was different to what they said in 2010 and may be different if they have another go.

    From a structural surplus in the range of 1¾ to 3¼ per cent of GDP in 2002-03, the estimated SBB moved into structural balance briefly somewhere in the period 2006-07 to 2007-08 before falling to a structural deficit of around 3¼ to 4¼ per cent of GDP in 2011-12

    Structural deficit only occurred under LABOR if such a concept can be measured accurately.

  83. Keep in mind, raising the pension age is nothing more than a diversion. Even Labor’s rise to 67 does not come in until 2023.

    It is the changes made by Howard that should be kept centre and front. Yes, Howard was good at buying those votes. Already a massive loss of support for Abbott in this age group.

    Today we have Bradgery’s Creek.

  84. Interesting that O’Farrel was against the Badgerys creek when Labor were wanting it, but now has rolled?

    Either way, it is beyond time.

    I see nil forgets why the previous opposition leader was referred to as “Dr No”

  85. Structural deficit only occurred under LABOR if such a concept can be measured accurately.

    I think you also misunderstand the term “inherited”

  86. Neil, you confuse me. On one hand you say Labior was a big spending, big taxing government. Then you say they are guilty of making massive tax cuts. Please tell me, what do you really believe.

    We all know the truth, Labor was not a high taxing and spredthrift government. In fact the opposite was true.

    In MHO, it is the pensions that are too high. They amount does give one a reasonable life, as long as you own your home.

    What is wrong, is that one can receive a $70.000 tax free income, as well as a health cars and pension. Something wrong there.

    Why should a struggling family, on less income have to pay tax, if these people do not.

    It is said the rebates and other things given to superannuation, is creating a bigger government bill, than what is actually paid out on pensions.

    Tim for Abbott to begin repealing much of what Howard pout in place.
    It is not fair that the fully funded pensioner pay the price. They received very littler under Howard.

  87. Well only a couple more days, we will have the royals.

    I wonder if Abbott is going to accompany them to the Blue Mountains, and the bushfire areas, Did not =bother earlier this year. Well did ot bother to see the people. I do not count a mid night visit to some firefighters.

  88. I wonder how much the money paid to pensioners actually add to the economy. It would be my guess, when it comes to those on full pensions, that money would be quickly spent.

    Yes, spent, keeping others employed.

    The time many spend on New Start, until they reach spending age, have little to spend.

    I am fed up hearing only what welfare costs. Never hear of what it saves,.

  89. On a Lighter Note, ABBOTT has actually kept a Promise He has “created ” One Million new Jobs, that’s the good news the Bad news is You have to move To Japan Or south Korea. With the Pensioners he has had another Captains call Make them into 457’s Too easy ( actually it was Gina’s idea, and Peta OKayed it )

  90. And any bets about trotting out Marji and the Girls and any other Ladys who happen to be Lolling Around for a Photo with the royals, Look For Peta she will be in the Picture some where just Like a “Wheres Wally ” snap. Would they actually Dare to take on the Grey Army ,>

  91. You must be Over 7 ft tall cos there is so much s..t coming out of you

    Why are the people with the social conscience always so nasty??

  92. Why are the people with the social conscience always so nasty??

    Perhaps it’s the result of an anxiety?

  93. I have commented on three issues.

    1. Looks like Super is not working because people are spending their Super payouts on mortgages, cars and overseas trips and then going on the pension

    2. alleged tax cut problems could have been easily fixed by Swan especially after the 2010 election but Swan actually increased the tax cuts and then bragged about it

    3. Structural deficit problem did not exist until 2008 if such a thing is possible to measure accurately. The concept was initially introduced by Rudd/Swan to trash Costello. It is amazing the lengths ALP supporters go to trash fellow Australians who vote for a different party

  94. Abbott failing on so many fronts now it’s hard to keep track of them.

    Looks like Australia is going to be in deep poo if it goes to the next round of global warming talks in 2015 with the wholly inadequate and sham policy it has in place.

    It was pointed out this morning that Ecuador and Chile are doing far more to mitigate carbon pollution than Australia is and that Australia is trashing science.

    How to send a country backwards in the shortest time possible. Put he biggest dunderhead you can find in charge of it and hand over all responsibility for running the country to vested interests who don’t care one iota for anything but their bottom lines.

  95. So all this talk of pensions and extending the retirement age is moot at the moment as Abbott is destroying the future for retirees one way or another anyway.

  96. The concept was initially introduced by Rudd/Swan to trash Costello.

    As was pointed out for you above nil, the ‘concept’ had been around for a long time before howard made it a reality

  97. So all this talk of pensions and extending the retirement age is moot

    I get the feeling it is distraction 101

    Which is why I wish Labor weren’t running so hard on the “promise” angle yet. Wait until it is done, then go hard. I can see tabot stepping in and squashing it, in the name of “keeping his word”

    Labor seem to play into it all the time.

    Much like my suspicion for the airport (which is a good move btw) being flagged today. the abc had a couple of damaging stories last night, but they were swept away with leaks of an imminent airport deal.

    I wonder what the backlash would be should this not go ahead?

  98. As was pointed out for you above nil, the ‘concept’ had been around for a long time before howard made it a reality

    Then why didn’t Treasury point it out to Costello??

    Anyway i think Treasury has had three goes (after being forced to by Rudd/Swan) at measuring the alleged structural deficit and got three different answers.

    Latest data by the PBO says the budget was in structural balance in 2007-08 if you can trust Treasury. Most probably too difficult a concept to measure accurately. But we have one now thanks to Swan and it is a whopper so much easier to detect.

  99. Then why didn’t Treasury point it out to Costello?

    I seem to recall Treasury being studiously ignored back in the Howard years, and quite often Costello was too when Howard got around to buying his vites

  100. Tom I don’t know why you keep responding to Neil. You know, as you hinted, that all he is doing is constantly harking back to Labor as a complete distraction at just how bad this government is doing and what a failure it is, especially its leader.

    With absolutely certainty Neil will bring up a Labor point and just keep harping on about it, no matter what facts and data you point out to the contrary.

    It is what Neil always does and will always do when it comes to mindlessly defending his beloved Liberals. He can’t defend their actions so he does it by constantly attacking Labor as an obfuscation.

    There is no greater proof of how bad the Liberals are in that Neil cannot defend them without a diversion to Labor. Neil has done me that one favour, given me absolute proof the Liberals are the worst and most vitiated party this country has ever seen and will ever see. Neil proves it just about every time he posts and attacks Labor instead of addressing the Liberal party itself.

  101. dinnaart I do watch that program and sit through Steve Price. It’s a pity that Charlie Pickering has left for he had Price’s measure every time.

    Steve Price is no different to all the other mouthy right wing commentators out there, a bit more sedate but just as notional as the rest, and as always full of bullshit.

    Like just about all right wingers he can’t defend his party or ideology on facts and lucidity so like the rest resorts to baseless attack, diversion, deceit and obfuscation.

  102. There is no greater proof of how bad the Liberals are in that Neil cannot defend them without a diversion to Labor

    Some people has said good things about Abbott. I got these from Bolt.

    Channel 7 boss Kerry Stokes:


    We had a prime minister who spoke Mandarin and our relationship tanked in six months… Now we have a PM who speaks people and we have a new relationship in six months.

    Crown Resorts chairman James Packer:

    From the perspective of trade and business investment, the trip was extremely beneficial for Australia. The Prime Minister and trade minister Andrew Robb have done an outstanding job. They have set a benchmark for future governments.

    CSL CEO Peter Perreault:

    He was genuine and engaging with the foreign leaders and has established a great new start for Australia in north Asia.

    Tad Watroba, executive director of Hancock Prospecting:

    Tony handled himself very well and came across as a genuine bloke. There was a visible difference from the previous leadership.

    Packer again:

    I think the truth is Australia’s relationships with China, Japan, India and Indonesia all went backwards over the last five years… When you go round and lecture people — I think you’d know who I’m talking about — some people don’t take it that well.

  103. We had a prime minister who spoke Mandarin and our relationship tanked in six months… Now we have a PM who speaks people and we have a new relationship in six months.

    That really just highlights how stupid these over paid under performing CEO’s really think we are.

    We had a great relationship with China before tabot came along. That was even with tabot and his cronies playing red knech wonderland games and doing their best to piss them off drom hte background. I recall the howls of outrage from hte conservatives when hte Labor Government did any deal with China, all about protecting our national interest. Now, they want to give it away in order to geta deal signed

    Hypocrites

    Tom I don’t know why you keep responding to Neil.

    Good point ME. Guess I’m a sucker 😉

  104. Speaking of packer, I read this from Bushfire Bill from a link here

    http://www.andrewelder.blogspot.com.au/2014/04/good-news-for-confused.html

    The previous negotiations couldn’t have been anything to do with Labor, because Jamie Packer said Labor had wrecked our relations with Asia. He runs casinos, so he would know. Nope, it must have been someone else doing all that hard horse trading.

    http://pbxmastragics.com/2014/04/13/theres-a-whole-world-out-there-or-the-joy-of-walking/comment-page-1/#comment-129657

    The whole comment is worth the click. It sums up our media’s tabot fawning perfectly

  105. What did i say was wrong?? This is what the PBO is saying as of 2013

    “The PBO’s analysis suggests that the budget has been in structural deficit since 2006-07 or 2007-08 and that, while declining, the structural deficit will persist at least until 2016-17

    And it is different to what they said in 2010. And most probably will say something different in 2015. This whole structural deficit crap was used for propaganda purposes by Labor

    You people latch onto anything that trashes Costello no matter how improbable.

  106. With absolutely certainty Neil will bring up a Labor point and just keep harping on about it, no matter what facts and data you point out to the contrary.

    Nailed it in one Mö… Even after TWICE using words from his own article to debunk his c#@p, he still comes back with exactly the same, now disproved, comment…

  107. A report out shows that the total fallout from Abbott destroying the car industry in Australia will be 200,000 jobs and a loss of $45 billion.

    Labor saves 200,000 jobs and billions because of it, along comes Abbott and in the shortest time on record has the biggest budget decline in the industrialised world whilst destroying industries and the environment at record rates.

  108. Been out to a fitness group at the local Seniors Club. Yes, they are now listening to whar Abbott is about., Not well accepted, if I might say so.

  109. I noticed that Costello was so popular, that he was swamped with job offers after leaving parliament.

    I also noticed that our previous woman PM was offered many jobs, across the world. Even Rudd has managed to pick up a job or two.

    I wonder who would hire Abbott when his term as PM is over?

  110. Nailed it in one Mö… Even after TWICE using words from his own article to debunk his c#@p, he still comes back with exactly the same, now disproved, comment…

    Still not sure what your point is. The PBO says the budget was in structural balance in 2007-08 if it is possible to measure such a concept.

    Budget was in Structural surplus under Costello and was declining from 2002 however according to the PBO but did not reach structural deficit until Labor was in power.

    This whole concept was only talked about because Rudd/Swan and Labor supporters thought they had a gotcha on Costello. People no longer talk about it.

  111. Well obviously people DO still talk about…… only the blinkered to Howard’s failure’s and Costtalotto’s failure’s no longer talk about it. 😡

  112. Still not sure what your point is.

    Don’t dishonestly cherry pick Neil… From the same PBO document you’re quoting from:

    Over two thirds of the 5 percentage points of GDP decline in structural receipts over the period 2002-03 to 2011-12 was due to the cumulative effect of the successive personal income tax cuts granted between 2003-04 and 2008-09.

    Now I know you pretend to be a bit slow at times, but I’m sure even you can work out that “> two thirds of the 5 percentage points of GDP decline in structural receipts” being due to tax cuts given by Costello, and stupidly promised “me-tooed” by Rudd in the lead up to the 2007 election is the main source of the problem 🙄

    Another ¼ of the decline is due to excise receipts falling because Costello removed one source of revenue (fuel excise) and people got smarter and gave up smoking…

    ie. 4.58 of the 5 percentage points of GDP decline in structural receipts is directly attributable to Howard government policies – the source of the structural deficit as seen by the PBO.

    Basically it’s all BS though, because it’s based on the flawed NAIRU concept, which is very “flexible.” I’ll leave you some homework to find out why…

    Now go away and think about ‘why the Abbott government is the best thing since sliced bread WITHOUT referring to Labor.”

  113. the biggest budget decline in the industrialised world whilst destroying industries

    Yes, but by destroying our car industry, he was able to twist Japans arm into lowering their Beef tariff to only about 20% 😯

    The Indies from the last Parliament were right about one thing at least. This guy cannot negotiate.

  114. “Over two thirds of the 5 percentage points of GDP decline in structural receipts over the period 2002-03 to 2011-12 was due to the cumulative effect of the successive personal income tax cuts granted between 2003-04 and 2008-09.

    OK the structural surplus was declining but was in balance in 2007-08 and was in deficit under Labor if it is possible to measure.

    But it just reinforces my distrust of Labor.

    All this structural deficit investigation done by Treasury was because the ALP thought they had a gotcha on Costello.

    It is amazing the lengths you people go to trash a human beings reputation just because he votes differently to you.

    And to some extent you people have succeeded. Some people now think the Costello surplus budgets were structural deficits. Like i said, Labor is the master of deceit.

  115. OK the structural surplus was declining but was in balance in 2007-08 and was in deficit under Labor if it is possible to measure.

    No Neil. You’ve got that wrong, but I want you to realise why yourself. Are you up to it?

  116. If there is one thing that ‘one’ can be sure of in relation to NoS…… HE IS UP TO IT!!!!! 😛 …… and by the by and by NoS… black is the new white….. no really 🙂 …. ewe k-now it’s true 😉 *bleat* …. about as true as ‘ everyone is living to a ton these day’s’ 😆 ( Gee I do so hope that that was ‘one’ of Control freak Credlins.. 🙂 *grasp*- *grasp* slurp 😀 )
    NoS, Howard don’t give a toss about you… not then… not now…. not eva….. Howard only gives/gave a toss about Howard…. and you laud him for that. 😯 He pork barrelled, lied and misrepresented his way into govt. and in so doing created an ‘structural deficient’ in the tax base that has, along with the tax rorts, loop holes and subsidies, undermined OUR present day tax receipts,-now and into the future…..and…. and… he couldn’t bowl to save his life 😈 or his seat. 🙂

  117. Nil of Sydney @ April 15, 2014 @ 3:12 pm “What did i say was wrong?? ”

    Everything! Ha Ha Ha!
    Everything you say is sad and demented. You really don’t believe a word you are saying, and just poking. If you are not, then you are a member of the sub-human species called a Psychopath or a Sociopath, which is not genetic, but a psychological disorder, which shows you only show empathy to yourself and any who are doing what you specifically agree is correct for your own advancement. Every word you type continues to offer everything in the way of confirming your malady. You’re a Malison, through and through.
    Please, if you are on fire, don’t expect me to piss on you.

  118. As I’ve said many times before Abbott is a protected beast by Murdoch press and shock jocks. Until we get some powerful force to put a sock into Abbotts/Hockey’s mouth(s) and to bring them down a peg or 2, it will continue at admorziam.

  119. ……….

    And another thing…

    ”If people don’t know what you’re doing, they don’t know what you’re doing wrong.” Seems the Napthine government has been taking a leaf out of Sir Humphrey’s book when it comes to open discourse in public life. Just like the Yes Minister character, who turned obfuscation into an artform, the Premier’s much lauded appointment of Victoria’s Freedom of Information Commissioner appears to have increased confusion and done little to help Joe Public gain access to information that is rightfully theirs.

    Turns out this new and improved ”transparent” style of government means more than a year later people are waiting longer, political interference is still rife, and an ongoing culture of secrecy prevails. Could it be that in an age of spin and ”staying on message”, too much freedom is a burden?

    Read more: http://www.theage.com.au/comment/the-age-editorial/science-funding-cuts-are-vandalism-20140419-36xlf.html#ixzz2zOfjyVRG

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