What happened to the Carbon Tax?

From The Australian rossleigh of The AIMN found this interesting quote:

“The Prime Minister said cabinet had today signed off on the legislation to rescind the carbon price, which would ideally occur at the end of the financial year.”

I only have one thing to say: Wasn’t it supposed to be a “carbon tax”? After all, that’s what Tony Abbott had been calling it right up until the election.

Funny how it’s now a price, according to him. Mind you, that’s what we’ve been saying all along.

Carbon tax pledge

168 comments on “What happened to the Carbon Tax?

  1. I was going to say,”This is his first lie.” Of course, being Tony Abbott, he had a head start –
    Tony Abbott LIE No 1. “I will not form a minority Government” He then formed Government with a coalition of Libs, L-NP, NP. Which is a minority Government since no single party has a majority! He now aims to make the Senate friendly with a coalition of ragtag Independents.
    So removing a Carbon Price is his second lie. Or is it his third? After all, the boats have not stopped.

  2. In order to meet his 5% reduction target, as required under the Kyoto Protocol, TA should first launch his regreening (carbon soil sequestration) programme. Then we should make a scientific assessment of this programme, to see how much it helps to achieve the target.

    This should be labor’s top priority now, to hold him to this part of his promise.

  3. Tiny Abbott, the greatest waste of oxygen and a dreadful emitter of CO2. Can we do a carbon sequestration experiment with him, by burying him really deep and see it it works? Please?

  4. It is a cost on carbon emitters. Only on the largest emitters.

    That is NOT all Abbott is repealing. He is repealing measures put in place, funded by the big emitters of carbon, to allow industry to move to renewals and cheaper power, long into the future,

    In the long run, the cost of power to all, will be cheaper.

    It is the change over that is expensive. The ongoing cost, is cheaper.

    A little like the NBNCO. A little costly in the beginning, and much cheaper in the long run.

  5. Yep what you posted bythesea was rubbish, thanks for telling us that but you didn’t need to.

    How about you tell us as the rest of the world moves to carbon pricing and cap and trade systems Australia is the only country rescinding those measures, or to use Abbott’s religious tones, repenting?

    Can you explain to us when Abbott was in opposition he said that he would not support carbon pricing unless other countries also did so, which they did, though Abbott lied at the time as he always does?

    Can you explain that Abbott saying he will not go it alone is now going it alone? More lies?

    And please explain Abbott’s suppository of hallucination repent?

  6. So Techinbris would like to see our elected PM dead and buried. Tread very cautiously Techknob….calling for the assasination of a Pm is a serious offence.

    yajustgottalaughatthisidiotsfoolishhatred 😉

  7. silkworm, agree one hundred percent. Make sure all know what is being repealed. Make all know what he intends to replace it with and when.

    Hold him to that 5% reduction promised. Abbott is already backing away from that.

    I do not believe we will ever see the birth of DA.

    I say that, because much that is being repealed, could be, as the Telegraph say, be merged with CEF.

    Abbott likes to give the impression, all that he is repealing is a toxic tax, which by his own figures is going save households ten dollars a week.

  8. So Summo you can point us to where you were just as vociferous against those who wanted all sorts of deaths for Gillard, some who posted here?

  9. So putting her in a chaff bag and taking her out to sea, is OK.

    Plotting to use the courts, to bring down the speaker of a duly elected government, with the hope of bringing it down, is OK.

  10. To quote you ME…past history. We’ve moved on, remember?

    yajustgottalaugh :0

    Multiple choice exclusively for you ME… “there will be NO WHAT TAX under a Govt I lead”
    a) Sex
    b) bullshit
    c) lying
    d) carbon
    e) union

    Ring MT for the answer…it really gives him the shits

    again……………………………..

    yajustgottalaugh 😉

  11. Will not even save that much.

    Already have solar. Have low electricity use. Good insulation, thanks to Rudd.

    Expect the pension to go backwards under this government.

    I do not believe my kids, with much bigger power bills will even notice the ten dollar savings.

    Would rather have the CEF legislation and all that goes with it.

    Many firms have already, thanks to the money they have received, halved or even better, their power bills.

    Also, it has created work for many, building the wind and solar farms across the country. Yes, and it has not even got into full stride yet.

    Must say, I like this toxic tax.

    Many of those firms, that Abbott pulled his stunts in, were found to be lying, when it was revealed that most has received assistance, updating their infrastructure, leading to much smaller power bills.

    Abbott’s campaign is based on lies.

    The cost to families has been small. In fact, less than the compensation all received.

    The economy has not collapsed, in fact has grown since the introduction of the so called toxic tax. Cost of living has been stable.

    Yes, Abbott can shout and rave all he likes, but he cannot put forwarded proof to back up one statement he makes.

    Even the $550 savings per annum does not add up. On top of that, any savings, no matter how small, will not emerge for two years.

    .

  12. No, the HSU now have their books in order. Will be in a better position, once the get Kathy Jackson to court, forcing her to pay back all she has ripped off over a decade or more.
    It is Williams and Jackson that have been living in luxury and high lives, not Thomson.

    I will never see any $10 from Abbott. It is little better than a mirage.

    As for familiars, wiping out the School Kids bonuses twice a year, will cost them more.

  13. BTW Dummo, it is not the MT here, but one of those you worship. Thought I’d clarify that for you. You need all the help you can get! What a tragic fool.

  14. … a Rose by any other name. The Carbon Price/Tax/Impost/Lie will continue to haunt labor. Which way is Shorten going to jump. Will he repent on behalf of Gillard. It is nice that most of the culprits will be in the room when Parliament sits so all Tony has to do is point. Look there is the $300 going to $370 Billion dollar man (Swan) Look there is his little helper Rudd who helped spend the $370 Billion. Conroy and Wong will get the same attention in the Senate from Abetz. Conroy and the NBN debacle will just keep on giving for Tony. Same with Border protection which way will Shorten jump? Fair dinkum Abbott will have bundles of wedges under each arm when he strolls into Parliament next month. The nightmare for Labor ain’t ending any time soon.
    Sant Elmo.

  15. The attempt to abolish/repeal the legislation which put a price on carbon emissions will be a big test for the ALP. We shouldn’t forget that Rudd’s ‘retreat’ was a significant milestone in his ‘fall from grace’. If Shorten cuts and runs, he’s finished. Or at least he ought to be.

    On a daily basis, they must develop (and repeat constantly) a simple explanation of why it’s necessary to put a price on carbon. And do so on a scientific, future-oriented basis rather than a short term fix.

    Pursue the high moral ground. Provide leadership. Be visionaries. Try strategy over tactics. It’s what the ‘base’ wants.

  16. Dear oh dear, Tweed hasn’t kept up. Very, very slow. The budget crisis has disappeared. It’s why Hockey is now in the business of borrowing much, much more. Increasing the debt as of this moment.

    Joe’s accepted ‘reality’ but Tweed’s now simply a figure of historical fun. Hilarious!

  17. Does Abbott not understand, there is nearly half the voters who supported Labor or the Greens, One would think, be believes all voted for him.

    Does he not understand, there is only a small percentage between winning and loosing.

    Half the votes, Labor lost, did not go to his party.

    Mr. Abbott prove people hate the tax. Prove that most do not want it.

    Better still, prove that many even care.

    We see, Queensland is no longer into justice, but punishment.

    Wonder why they believe it will work.

  18. Col, Labor cannot walk away from it. The truth is, it is the right thing to do. Most other countries, do not have the deniers this country has. We are out of step with most of the world.

  19. I have been perusing comments on other sites, such as th ABC and Guardian.

    None impressed with Abbott’s antic. The one calling on repentance went down like a lead balloon.

    Abbott might get his public response and pressure, but it looks like, it is not what he is expecting.

    I presume that Abbott has put Mirabella to work, to round up the troops, those she took to Canberra and into the house to disrupt QT.

    Was not that successful last time. Expect less this time.

    One thing for sure, it one can always predict Abbott’s punches. No wonder he was never known as a skilled boxer, but just a slugger.

    Can never imagine Abbott playing poker. He would lose every hand.

    Could Victorian government be in danger of falling? Mr, Geoff Shaw is one propping the government up.

    Then, as some tell us, the only baddies are to be found in Labor.

  20. Tweed, how are the likes of Wong and Conroy to get attention from Abetz. One needs to have senate hearings for that. Something Abbott hopes to avoid. No budget estimates until next year.

    Any reports release on the NBNCo, including those since the election, show Conroy and Labor to be telling the truth.

    Same goes for what the Treasury has released. Things were better than Wong was predicting.

    The economy might be going backwards a little now, as the dollar is creeping back up. Also, most of Abbott’s actions up to day 28 of his government, has increased the deficit.

  21. Labor cannot walk away from it

    Yes they can but they ‘ought’ not to in my opinion. Take into account that Labor’s recent track record’s been about ‘short-term’ fixes and, as I recall, one ALP Member from South Australia, recently advocated that they should just do that. Remember also that not all Labor Federal Members are convinced by the ‘science’.

    Most other countries, do not have the deniers this country has.

    I would dispute that. As someone who travels overseas on a regular basis, I ‘know’ that such generalisations are problematic. For example, I recently was on a Tour that included Serbia, Montenegro, Croatia, Slovenia and Bosnia Herzegovina and I did so in the company of several US citizens, including one who was an FBI agent.

    Generally speaking, most of the US people were of the view that global warming was not a problem. One couple from Colorado, for example, who listened intently when I argued that he/she could expect ‘wild weather’ in the years ahead agreed that their child who was a science major was presenting the same viewpoint, but they were not really convinced.

    Before they/we returned home they lost their home in the Colorado ‘wildfires’. Mugged by ‘reality’ big time.

    China is convinced. Europe certainly is. The USA much less so.

    Be careful of generalisations re people’s views while at the same time one must also understand that the ‘science’ is in.

  22. This is a good article.

    ………..Holding a double dissolution before 1 July faces two potential hurdles. First, there is a timing problem. The Senate is perfectly entitled to scrutinise bills, including sending them off to committees for public hearings and the receipt of expert advice. Once this is combined with the three month delay between bills, the process can become quite drawn out.

    The Government would run a great risk in simply categorising a bill as having ‘failed to pass’ the Senate, just because the Senate took time to scrutinise it. The Whitlam Government tried this in 1974 but the High Court later held that one of its bills was not a valid double dissolution trigger because the Senate had not been given adequate time to scrutinise it. Fortunately for Whitlam, he had plenty of other triggers to rely upon. If an Abbott Government was relying on a single double dissolution trigger, it would have to be very careful indeed.

    Secondly, there is a constitutional question as to whether a double dissolution could be held before the 1 July changeover, given that new Senators have already been elected. It could be argued that a double dissolution is intended to resolve a deadlock between the Houses, but once the Senate’s composition changes on 1 July, such a deadlock might no longer exist. The Governor-General might contend that to decide upon the workability of Parliament, she would need advice from the Prime Minister on the workability of Parliament under the changed composition of the Senate after 1 July 2014. Further, people who had been elected as Senators, to commence office on 1 July 2014, might contend that their election could not be wiped out in this manner…………..

    http://blogs.usyd.edu.au/cru/2013/09/from_simple_disillusion_to_dou_1.html

    There are many reasons that Abbott would not be able to call a DD. He is only bluffing, sounding tough, when he says he is willing to go that far.

    More is needed than having a bill rejected twice. He would have to put a yes man in as GG first.

  23. While one can never know the future, it’s fairly obvious that there will not be a double dissolution on the, presumably, failure to repeal the carbon price.

    The technical reason for double dissolutions is soon forgotten during the subsequent ‘campaign’. And at the moment the ALP is in a much better overall position than is was going into the last election.

    In short, it ain’t going to happen.

  24. An aside. What is it with the far right now, that they have to destroy any achieve,made by the left.

    What is happening in the USA, is to destroy everything Obama has done. To wipe out any trace of his presidency.

    We see the same here. A new government with what seems like one agenda, to wipe from history the last six years, especially the last three.

    Much of what this government is repealing does not make sense in any form.

    Take the CEF suite of legislation,. Much of it, is similar to what they say, they will replace it with.

    Yes, there are many similarities between the aims of CEF and DA.

    The biggest difference is how it is to be funded.

    The other big difference, is much of DA is based on dubious science. Could work, but is not proven.

    The aim of the CEF is to make power produced by fossil fuel dearer.

    Yes, Abbott is right when he says that. What he does not say, is the other half of the equation,.

    That is to make power produced by renewals cheaper. Yes, cheaper, more efficient and cleaner. Not a bad aim in anyones language.

    Nothing toxic about that desire.

    “………..If the U.S. breaches its debt ceiling this week, bringing with it the global financial panic economists predict, leaders of a little-known far-right movement called Christian Reconstructionism can claim partial responsibility. Their goal: to eradicate the U.S. government so that a theocratic Christian nation emerges to enforce biblical laws.

    That’s right — laws out of the Book of Leviticus prohibiting adultery, homosexuality, and abortion, with penalties including death by stoning.

    The key leader of this movement is Gary North, founder of the Institute for Christian Economics in Tyler, Texas. He’s a long-time associate of Ron Paul, intellectual godfather of the Tea Party movement — the very people responsible for Congressional deadlock over the government shutdown and debt ceiling debate.

    Paul and North go way back. North served on Paul’s first congressional staff in 1976, and North describes himself as Paul’s “original staff economist.” Earlier this year, Paul announced plans for a curriculum for home schoolers that will teach “biblical” concepts. The director of curriculum development for the program? Gary North.

    In an Oct. 4 column in The Tea Party Economist, North describes government default as a “fake threat.” So it can’t be a surprise that the Tea Party caucus isn’t taking government default seriously.

    And what of the connection between this group and Republican Senator Ted Cruz of Texas, who almost singlehandedly created the government shutdown and debt ceiling crisis?

    Cruz is the son of Rafael Cruz, a Texas pastor who directs Purifying Fire Ministries. According to a biography page for the True the Vote summit in April 2013, Rafael Cruz became active in politics during the 1980 presidential campaign, joining the Religious Roundtable, founded in 1979 to involve conservative Christians in politics. “The Religious Roundtable was a Judeo-Christian organization that mobilized millions of Christians all across the United States and helped elect Ronald Reagan,” Cruz said. “It was a precursor of the Tea Party, even before the Moral Majority.”

    What to make of all of this? For the last few weeks Tea Party-leaning members of Congress have been described as “kooks” and “crazies” by the Washington establishment, liberals, moderate Republican leaders, and the media.

    The name-calling might be satisfying to those who oppose the Tea Party, but it’s entirely untrue. These are people who are patient, determined, deliberate, and rational.

    I know this because I spent many years as a reporter covering religion and politics, more than four of them in Texas. So I’ve been watching conservative Christians for a long time, since the era of the late Jerry Falwell’s Moral Majority, to the days of Pat Robertson’s early Christian Coalition, and on to the culture wars of the 1990s and early 2000s.

    During the years I covered religion, I watched politicking creep into evangelical congregations from New Jersey to Pennsylvania to Texas and beyond. In New Jersey, I interviewed the state coordinator of the Christian Coalition who in those early days revealed to me the movement’s stealth plan to “take over” the Republican Party, “precinct by precinct.”

    Later, when I was working in Dallas, I wrote another story, this time about a movement to “take down” the nation’s public schools, promoted by the Alliance for the Separation of School and State, among other groups. As it turns out, Ron Paul was one of the signers of the group’s proclamation to “end government involvement in education.”

    Then there were the annual meetings of the Southern Baptist Convention, America’s largest Protestant denomination, which during those years was engaged in an epic battle between conservative and moderate factions. At the time, a group of fundamentalist Southern Baptists had hatched a plan to “take back” the denomination. Over about 25 years, they prevailed.

    At one such meeting in the Superdome in New Orleans, a distraught pastor told me he believed something darker than a desire for conservative theology was driving the battle in his denomination, and he handed me a sheaf of papers describing Christian Reconstructionism. He claimed that the fundamentalists wanted to use the denomination as a launching pad to bring down the federal government and usher in a Christian nation ruled by biblical laws.

    Was it true? I didn’t know. I kept the file and referred to it occasionally in the following years as I reported on the Religious Right.

    Recently, however, I came across a line from North’s book Unholy Spirits that gave me pause. He wrote, “The ideas of the Reconstructionists have penetrated into Protestant circles that for the most part are unaware of the original source of the theological ideas that are beginning to transform them.”

    And then there are newsletters stretching back to 1977 on Gary North’s website, describing “guerilla tactics” and “bottom-up theocracy” to achieve Christian Reconstructionism’s goals.

    The unifying principle of all these data points: a long-term covert plan of destruction for the Republican Party, the nation’s public schools, the nation’s largest Protestant denomination. And, of course, for the nation itself.

    But why? In his 1991 book, Christian Reconstructionism: What It Is, What It Isn’t, North writes, “Reconstructionists… do not believe that the will of the political majority is the final law in society.” They believe that the Bible is.

    In order to make their vision of society a reality, they are willing to wait a long time and to engage in politics to make it happen. “We are to work at our callings and wait on the Lord to place us in positions of influence in his time,” according to North’s book.

    Once in power, they assert their brand of Christianity: “Christian Reconstructionists further insist that Jesus Christ is Lord of political leaders,” he writes. “All political leaders are directly responsible to Jesus Christ in the discharge of their public office, as well as in their private lives… Practically, this means that political leaders should seek the guidance of Scripture in framing their political positions and programs.”

    Interestingly, Reconstructionists don’t seem to care about actually holding onto power in the conventional sense: “The purpose of getting involved in politics, as Reconstructionists see it, is to reduce the power of the State,” according to North’s book.

    And they are willing to wait to get what they want. “History is with the Reconstructionists as they advocate a return to God’s law as the standard for righteous living, for the individual in self-government as well as elected officials in civil government,” North writes.

    That is what makes the debt ceiling debate so chilling. The Reconstructionists have waited a long time to be in powerful positions. And now that they possess power, they are perfectly willing to use it to “reduce the power of the state” so that the God of the Old Testament can swoop in to rule the Christian nation they believe will result from chaos.

    And from where they sit, blowing up the financial system is a pretty good way to make it happen….”

    http://www.huffingtonpost.com/deborah-caldwell/christian-dominionism-debt-default-_b_4097017.html

    Another worry is the length of time, that Hockey has been in the USA, soaking up Tea Party economics. It appears that Cormann has also spent an extended study leave there.

  25. “………….Travelling abroad, Tony Abbott has been saying things very different from what we have heard from him in Australia. There are two ways to interpret this. One is to praise him for suddenly becoming a statesman, putting the national interest over petty domestic politics. The other is to see him as weak, unprincipled and insincere. The first interpretation has prevailed among Australia’s kind-hearted commentators. But our regional neighbours are not so generous and they will incline to the second interpretation. So Abbott’s diplomacy is off to a shaky start.
    Abbott has made two mistakes common among domestically oriented politicians when high office thrusts them into foreign affairs. One is to think that diplomacy means avoiding disagreements by saying what you think your interlocutor wants to hear. This gets you into trouble when different people want to hear different things. This was Julia Gillard’s problem…..”

    Read more: http://www.canberratimes.com.au/comment/abbott-walking-tricky-tightrope-on-diplomacy-20131014-2viqg.html#ixzz2hot7WzsW

  26. I would expect every Catholic Mass this morning to be fully attended, with Laborites repenting as Abbott demanded.

  27. I see that The Nasty Party is sending all their key players over for mental realignment by those who control the Tea Party. Didn’t the same thing happen when the lying Rodent was in power?
    OMG! It did! And they came back sprouting the biggest load of distorted, another Universe, load of tripe that I had ever heard. Guess what we are going to be hearing from those who come back from the USA? FANTASY! DREAMS! OOooooo!

  28. The Carbon Tax has been an absolute loser for Labor since day one.
    And a major contributing factor to Electoral loss. Abbott made it clear
    what he would do with it , he is just fullfilling his promise to Australians.
    He most definitely has a mandate to do so – no ifs no buts!

  29. Issues polling tells a different story:

    Three out of five Australians don’t want to scrap the carbon tax if doing so damages government revenue, according to polling undertaken exclusively for Fairfax Media.

    The automated phone poll of 1369 people was conducted last weekend and revealed 62 per cent of respondents wanted to keep the price on carbon and 38 per cent wanted it removed even if doing so damaged revenue.

    http://www.smh.com.au/federal-politics/political-news/most-want-to-keep-carbon-tax-poll-20130713-2px4d.html

    Concern over the economy and jobs overshadowed the ‘carbon tax’ and other issues, voters were split on repeal and there was more support for the Coalition honouring their promised pollution reduction targets than repealing carbon pricing, a national exit poll has found.

    http://www.businessspectator.com.au/news/2013/9/9/policy-politics/carbon-tax-not-big-issue-election-poll

    So much for this “mandate” c#@p being peddled by the mindless disciples followers of the Abbott 🙄

    REPENT all ye sinners! 🙄 FFS!

  30. Of course, the other issue is IF the Abbott is claiming a mandate now, why then did the coalition and all their disciples followers not support Rudd’s ETS after the 2007 election. Hypocrisy, they name is Liberal 🙄

  31. The Carbon Tax has been an absolute loser for Labor since day one.

    You keep telling yourself that Voyager. And your Tory cohort.

    If there was a choice at the last election, the carbon tax/price issue was effectively neutralised.

    What is going to be quite entertaining now is watching endless Abbott replays of the last 3 years screeching “Election Now, damn-it!” but now mentally making the sign of the cross every time a journalist asks about a double dissolution.

  32. He most definitely has a mandate to do so – no ifs no buts!

    Whether he has a ‘mandate’ or not will, as always, be determined by the numbers. Currently he has the numbers in the HoR but probably not in the Senate. Whether he can win over the new crop of Senate ‘ferals’ post July 2014 remains to be seen but given his track record as a ‘negotiator’, the odds are against him. One wonders whether his ‘arse’ is still on offer?

    ‘Mandates’ by the way are always in the eye of the beholder. The concept has no legal or constitutional basis. Just a political mantra.

  33. MJ, what is going to be interesting, producing the proof, that it is firstly hated by all, has cause the economy to collapse and does not work.

    Will be an interesting exercise.

    It will be a greater outcome, if Abbot can proved his Direct Action will do the job, does not cost more. and is based on proven science.

    We will have to wait and see, how many Mirabella can get out into the streets. That is presumption on my account.

    At some time. the penny will drop what Abbott is talking about, when he keeps saying “toxic tax”.

    Most will realise they are not paying it, and that there have, in the short time, it has been in operation, gains made.

    it is not about a toxic tax.

    It is about how we address carbon emissions, that the science is saying, destroying the atmosphere of the world we live in.

    Yes, interesting times ahead.

    Abbott can talk about his imaginary toxic tax, the rest of us can address the real issues.

  34. So much for this “mandate” c#@p being peddled by the mindless disciples followers of the Abbott

    “being peddled”. LOL. In Abbott’s case, perhaps ‘pedalled’ might be the more appropriate homophone.

  35. In the studio with Ross Garnaut, ABC The Business, 2 July 2013
    ( https://sites.google.com/site/carbontaxmyths/ )

    “We don’t actually have a Carbon Tax. What we have is an Emissions Trading Scheme with a fixed price for first three years. The original CPRS based on my recommendations back in 2008 had a fixed price for a shorter period.”

    And since there’s so much confusion:

    Explainer: ETS vs Carbon Tax vs Direct Action (http://goo.gl/9fotFM)

  36. What does one think about the privatising of HECs that has been proposed?

    http://au.news.yahoo.com/a/19408705/libs-to-clear-23b-hecs-debt/

    ………..Abbott’s inquiry into the state of the nation’s finances.

    In a move that could boost the Budget bottom line, up to $23 billion of outstanding Higher Education Contribution Scheme debt would be effectively privatised under a plan that has already won support in some financial circles.

    The Government’s Commission of Audit, which is just days away from being announced by Treasurer Joe Hockey, is also likely to consider a British-style sale of Australia Post. The Treasurer promised the commission, modelled on a similar audit conducted by the Howard government in 1996, would look at what governments can do for people that they can’t do “and no more”.

    In an interview in the US yesterday, Mr Hockey said the debt ceiling crisis facing America was clear evidence that governments had to deal with their fiscal pressures as quickly as possible.

    “The world must live within its means and you cannot wait until five minutes to midnight to deal with fiscal pressures, you cannot wait until five minutes to midnight to deal with the massive debt burden left by previous generations,” he said.

    In the lead-up to the election, Mr Abbott claimed the country faced a “Budget emergency” but the co…….

    We now have some idea of what Hockey and Cormann are doing in NY.

  37. You have to laugh at the hypocrite right wingers like VOYAGER, who when posting, often couch terms in absolutes of, “end of argument”, “finished”, “no ifs or buts” etc. but when it’s the other way round the absolutes disappear and vagueness abounds, plenty of ifs and buts then.

    And how can Abbott have a mandate for something he lied over from the very beginning. It hasn’t been a loser for Labor or Turnbull from the beginning, it was made to appear that way by a constant stream of lies told by Abbott and abetted by the MSM, just as he is still lying through his teeth over this and his DAP, which will end up being a token skeleton of what he’s promised.

    All Emissions Reduction Schemes cost, that’s not the point, but by far the consensus is that a DAP scheme is the least effective and the most costly option.

    Turnbull’s blog has a good explanation on the different schemes and on the issue of the cost makes the obvious point above, DAP is going to cost a lot more than an ETS for a worse outcome.

    The point he doesn’t make in his blog is that DAP will also make us a pariah on the world stage and engender penalties to our trade because of it. Even worse for us if what Turnbull has stated is true, is that DAP is the scheme you propose when you don’t intend to follow through and have a scheme at all.

  38. This is what it is about.

    Mr. Abbott is either lying, or is in complete denial, if he believes otherwise. It is not about a toxic tax, that does not exist. It is about repealing all the CEF legislation, that deals with carbon emissions.

    “…………Even with a price tag of almost $3 billion, it’s hard to find a scientist who believes that ”direct action” will come anywhere near its target, a fact conceded by Abbott during the election campaign.
    One may be tempted to hope this will prompt a rethink among Coalition frontbenchers. Surely Turnbull, who staked his leadership on an emissions-trading system, must be feeling uncomfortable. But reducing emissions is only a secondary goal of the Coalition’s policy. The main game is to continue to play politics with climate change.
    Abbott has begun howling at my Senate colleagues and me that the election gave him a mandate to get rid of carbon pricing. Of course, the rules of election mandates didn’t apply to him on emissions trading, the mining tax or any other issue when he was opposition leader.
    What Abbott doesn’t understand is that Labor’s position on carbon pricing has been consistent for years. We believed in pricing carbon when we had Howard’s support, and we believe in pricing carbon, despite Abbott’s opposition.
    But, most importantly, our climate policy isn’t based on politics. It’s based on the national interest.
    This interest is tied to a healthy environment and a healthy world. It means keeping Australia competitive while also contributing to a global climate solution. A carbon-pricing policy that cuts emissions and creates clean-energy jobs is in our national interest…..”

    Read more: http://www.canberratimes.com.au/federal-politics/political-opinion/fighting-global-warming-requires-policy-not-politics-20131013-2vgud.html#ixzz2hqJxcmu8

    As for the call for DD. That is pure nonsense, and unattainable for Abbott. There is simply not enough time.

    Abbott cannot create the mechanism for one.

    All Abbott wants, is the perception, out in the community, that Labor and the Greens prevented him from repealing that toxic tax.

    Does not want to tell us, what he will replace it wit. Well at least tell us more than his magic words, Direct Action.

    I would have more trust, if he also put that legislation on the table. If he has so much faith in it, why not?

  39. :He most definitely has a mandate to do so – no ifs no buts!”

    If he can get it passed both houses, yes he has. I suspect at this time, that is not the case.

    No other mandates exist.

    What Abbott now has to prove there is a majority out there, that voted for him, because of his promised too repeal a toxic tax.

    He needs to prove, it is unpopular, has destroyed the economy and is not working,

    He also has to prove how better off each household will be, if he is successful.

    Screaming, I won, I have a non existent mandate, proves nothing.

    In other words, he still has to justify his proposed actions.

  40. Flip flop’n flim flam man. He will blame Labor and then use Labor policy because he has none of his own. One wonders if he will try and privatise CC. 🙄

  41. I think there is a certain amount of desperation in Coalition ranks. interviews I saw last night with both Abbott (repent ye sinners) and Pyne (if they don’t repent they’ll be in opposition forever – I thought that was what Pyne wanted) showed they are clinging to their ever increasing nastiness and vindictiveness as the only answer to their problems.

  42. the funniest thing about bythesea’s byline, Mobius, is that we all know who will have the last (bitter) laugh on climate change.

  43. “Mr. Abbott is either lying, or is in complete denial”

    He knows he’s lying about ‘Carbon Tax’ – after all, it was a deliberate strategy to re-tag ALP’s ETS as ‘Carbon Tax’ since 2010 election (and hence crate the ‘carbon tax lie’ myth). He’s probably (still ‘crap’) in denial on Anthropogenic Climate Change…

    Is Abbott going to “repent” on his ‘Carbon Tax lie’ Big Lie…:

    Gillard Promised ETS or CT? ETS goo.gl/o5Aiq8
    Implemented ETS or CT? ETS goo.gl/9fotFM

  44. “(Abbott) most definitely has a mandate to do so – no ifs no buts!”

    Mandate shmandate – the only ‘mandate’ Abbott has is to form a Govt and then negotiation with the Senate to push his legislations thru. He knows how it works…:

    ‘Opposition, too, has promises to keep, Tony Abbott, December 5, 2007’
    ( http://goo.gl/f4w4Ki )

    “Nelson is right to resist the intellectual bullying inherent in talk of “mandates”. What exactly is Rudd’s mandate anyway: to be an economic conservative or an old-fashioned Christian socialist? The elected Opposition is no less entitled than the elected Government to exercise its political judgment and to try to keep its election commitments.”

  45. makes me wonder what the governments of the world would do if aliens invaded, or a huge meteorite was hurtling our way and was going to destroy us all. In the movies, the Amreicans always saved the day. I wonder what would happen in reality, now that we know we have a direct threat to the future of humanity?

  46. VOYAGER October 16, 2013 @ 9:08 am
    The only mandate that exists in the Australian Parliament is for a elected Representative to represent the Constituents of that Seat in the Parliament and nothing else. Nothing about political parties or anything else. Stop listening to Corporate Media Voyager. They lie! If you haven’t figured that one out yet, your extremely gullible.
    But also Voyager, what is your favorite number? Eleventy? WOW! I would have thought it as it came from one of yours.
    Smile, because you should, because your told to!
    Why? Because your a fiscal emergency. Didn’t you know? Oh, I think it got lost…..somewhere, or they forgot about it, or if you didn’t, your lobotomy is still in the queue.

  47. But that’s it Ian, they are immediate tangible visible threats that the right love riding in on the back of to proclaim themselves heroes, after the real hero work is done of course. Abbott’s fire fighting for example, and Howard was famous for the creating crises he would resolve in a fanfare of tax payer funded propaganda.

    CO² as you know from scientist Abbott is invisible and weightless so doesn’t constitute a threat he can ride his white steed in on to play savior of the nation. The visible consequences of increasing extreme weather events can be dismissed as natural whereas an alien invasion might be a natural even to the invaders but cannot be passed off as one by the likes of Abbott.

    But notice in the old disaster movies, Tower Inferno, Earthquake, Poseidon Adventure, Jaws etc., there’s always one nasty SOB, usually wealthy and greedy, always a conservative, who at first is a denier and because of their position holds up attempts at prevention or mitigation. When the disaster hits and can no longer be denied they are the first ones to demand to be rescued at the cost of everyone else. They usually die horrible deaths.

    I have no doubt when the disasters become so prevalent, and the severity and number of weather events cannot be explained away as natural, it will be the deniers front and centre demanding governments take action and that they should be given money for the hardships they are enduring. They will also blame previous progressive and environmental parties for not doing enough when they had the chance.

  48. “………………..That creates the bizarre and untenable scenario that Australia seek to broker a deal between China and the US on the importance of climate action while having no policy of its own. Climate policy and carbon pricing is not Labor’s Achilles Heel, it is most certainly Abbott’s.

    In just the past week, the world’s major international economic institutions have lined up firmly in favour of a carbon price. China, Australia’s biggest trading partner, is headed down the same path.

    The OECD says consistent carbon pricing must be the cornerstone of government actions to tackle climate change. “In our view, any policy response to climate change by any country must have at its core a plan to steadily make carbon emissions more expensive while, at the same time, judiciously giving non-fossil energy and energy efficiency an advantage at the margin. This is fundamental,” said Angel Gurria, the secretary of the OECD.

    The OECD’s position was supported by both the International Monetary Fund and the World bank. IMF chief Christine Lagarde said the key to addressing the problem is to “get the pricing right” and to gradually phase out and remove energy subsidies that amount to $485 billion globally. “If the price of fossil fuel is right – because it incorporates the negative externalities (a carbon price) – then it encourages investment in cleaner fuels without the need for subsidies,” she said….

    http://reneweconomy.com.au/2013/bill-shorten-can-make-tony-abbott-look-silly-on-carbon-pricing-87571

    Once again, it is not about a toxic tax, that does not exist.

  49. Ian October 16, 2013 @ 1:55 pm
    The Americans Wealth Elite would quickly move into Shelters and come out after the dust has settled ready to carry on as before.
    Alas, because they didn’t want to share the shelter with those they consider contemptible, they suddenly come to realize there is no one to do the work of looking after them and have to come to grips with how to survive a medieval existence of life in an agrarian Society and deal first hand with a climate in upheaval from the meteor strike and Global Warming too.
    Break out the violins of unsympathetic sympathy. Doesn’t one’s heart bleed for them? No? No.

  50. ……..It should be remembered that the US leadership also supports carbon pricing, but is only prevented from doing so by the extreme right of the Republican Party, the Tea Party nut cases, and those that owe their position to backing from the fossil fuel industry. It is from these ultra conservative groupings, and their local equivalents in his own party, Australia business and the media, that Abbott takes his cue………….

    http://reneweconomy.com.au/2013/bill-shorten-can-make-tony-abbott-look-silly-on-carbon-pricing-87571

  51. Mö, have you noticed Word Press has a whole range of words that don’t exist all around the subject to do with Neo-Cons? It keeps coming up with some really weird suggestions as if trying to move you away from the subject?
    I have proof read at times knowing all is really correct, but when it comes up, words are concatenated or changed.

  52. Fed up @ 2:17 pm

    This is an important point as the countries that are lining up to implement carbon pricing mechanisms are also lining up to impose trade barriers and tariffs against countries they deal with who don’t have any carbon pricing mechanism in place.

    Big business in this country, especially the energy intensive and fossil fuel industries, believe that by not having a carbon price imposed on them will give them a comparative advantage against those nations and businesses that do, but there is no way carbon pricing nations and businesses will give Abbott’s Australia a free ride on this.

    The other point that Abbott will bury is that the prices imposed by Australian businesses because of the carbon price will not be reduced by the full amount. Some big businesses have already intimated they will not be reducing their prices by the full cost imposed on them by the carbon price as they gouge back the money already paid for it.

    Then there are those businesses who invested heavily in costly efficiencies and renewable energy to reduce their carbon emissions, and were subsidised by the previous Labor government for their efforts. Under Abbott’s proposal they will find themselves comparatively disadvantaged by competitors who will be polluting to their hearts content.

    Abbott’s heading into a mess of his own making but one that Australian tax payers will end up bearing the immense cost for.

  53. ME. that question that was asked of Abbott, yesterday, the one he could not recall what the leaders he had met said, is indeed important.

    The matter must have been raised. There is no way, he would nt be able to recall what was said, or not said for that matter

    When he told China. Australia was open for business and China would find it cheaper here now, that he was removing the toxic tax, made me laugh. One would think, that China would be in agreement with his actions.

    We are being conned, left, right and centre.

    I think I owe Ian an apology. .I am really glad, in this case, to be shown up as having it wrong.

    It is not a bout an non existent toxic tax.

  54. Those businesses, that do not adjust, to cleaner, more efficient technology might find them selves out of the game completely.

    I believe this is so in the Aluminum Industry, where the technology and production methods have changed completely. New mills, are cheaper to run, use clean technology. Cheaper to build.

    We already have meat processing plants, thanks to CEF, that have reduce their power bills, in one case to nothing, adding to the grid, not taking from it,.

    Same goes for a winery ot two I believe. The biggest winners seem to be piggeries.

    I have seen local pie factories, that now have every inch of their roofs covered in solar panels.

    it is not about an non existent toxic tax.

    .

  55. ME, I believe those who have invested, with the help of CEF bodies, will still be ahead. Far ahead I believe.

    The ones who will suffer, are those who have missed out. Like many of us, who will never see the NBNCo.

    We need this to be a one term government, to save some of Gillard’s silverware.

    That is a possibility, we should not throw out.

    History shows, that most governments do win second terms, but with vastly reduced maturities.

    This government does not appear to be getting the usual honeymoon, putting it behind the eight ball.

    The more Abbott and Co, hide in the bunker, the quicker the public will lose patience with him.

  56. Where was our illustrious all last weekend, Sitting in a fire truck, it seems that did not get called out;

    .the boats, Budget emergencies, repealing the Carbon Tax and single-handedly saving Australia from Labor’s excess, in the nick of time – was up to last Sunday, wonder no more…

    THERE would be very few world leaders, if any, who run their country from the cabin of a fire engine.

    But that’s exactly where Australia’s affairs of state were being managed last Sunday as Tony Abbott waited for the call-up.

    Having rostered himself on for volunteer bushfire brigade duty at the weekend, the Prime Minister woke to learn of potential fires in his district of Davidson on Sydney’s northern beaches.

    He dutifully attended the command centre, donned his kit and jumped into the driver’s seat of Davidson Rural Fire Service truck 5.

    And there he sat for the rest of the day, watching as his other units got called out to fires raging along the NSW coast.

    The licensed truck driver is reported to have become increasingly frustrated that as the calls to attend fires came in, every truck but his was despatched………

    http://pbxmastragics.com/2013/10/12/from-hatesman-to-statesman/comment-page-9/#comment-98450

  57. THERE would be very few world leaders, if any, who run their country from the cabin of a fire engine.

    But that’s exactly where Australia’s affairs of state were being managed last Sunday as Tony Abbott waited for the call-up.

    Having rostered himself on for volunteer bushfire brigade duty at the weekend, the Prime Minister woke to learn of potential fires in his district of Davidson on Sydney’s northern beaches……..

    http://www.dailytelegraph.com.au/news/nsw/tony-abbott-always-set-to-come-out-fighting-fires-that-is/story-fni0cx12-1226740600883

    Wonder where the body guards sit.

  58. “Another source said the PM was complaining on the plane all the way back to Canberra on Sunday night that he had to sit in the truck all day.”

    Does this mean he flew up from Canberra for the stunt. Wonder who pays.

  59. I thought the cap was staying, Appears not.

    “……..As well as removing the carbon price, the bills seek to abolish the legislated cap on Australia’s greenhouse gas emissions and dismantle the Climate Change Authority – which advises the government on Australia’s fair share of the international effort to reduce greenhouse gases. Instead the new laws provide for “periodic reviews at the instigation of the minister”.

    The repeal legislation will be the first item of business when parliament resumes on 12 November.

    The new Labor leader, Bill Shorten, has said Labor will not allow a repeal. Given that the Greens are also determined to keep the carbon pricing scheme, if Labor sticks to that position it would leave the fate of the repeal bills in the hands of the new Senate..”

    http://www.theguardian.com/environment/2013/oct/15/tony-abbott-insists-carbon-tax-will-end-on-1-july-even-if-senate-blocks-repeal?CMP=ema_632&et_cid=52874&et_rid=fehowarth@iprimus.com.au&Linkid=http%3a%2f%2fwww.theguardian.com%2fenvironment%2f2013%2foct%2f15%2ftony-abbott-insists-carbon-tax-will-end-on-1-july-even-if-senate-blocks-repeal

  60. Could the government be listening.

    So they now want us to design their plan.

    Maybe, they should look at what is in place now, and how they can adapt it, to fit in with the DA.

    Even the Telegraph suggested this course of action.

    Why does the wheel have to be reinvented again.

    for that to happen, Abbott will have to admit he wants to repeal more Thanh an non existent toxic tax.

    The federal government is calling for public input to design the centrepiece of its Direct Action plan for combating climate change.

    The coalition on Wednesday released the terms of reference for its Emissions Reduction Fund (ERF), the principle mechanism by which it plans to reduce emissions by five per cent by 2020.

    The fund is capped at $1.55 billion for its first three years and provides incentives for abatement activities that reduce emissions, like revegetation and improving soil carbon.

    The ‘carbon buyback’ approach promises to fund these abatement activities in Australia at the least possible cost.

    The ERF will work in conjunction with other green programs, like the Carbon Farming Initiative and the Renewable Energy Target, to achieve its unconditional emissions target.

    The government is seeking input from business and community leaders on potential sources of low-cost abatement and will consider these in a report to be released in December.

    It’s also looking for submissions on other key design features of the ERF, including baselines and contract arrangements.

    A white paper outlining the final design of the ERF will be released early in 2014.

    The government hopes to have the carbon tax repealed by June 30 next year and has released draft legislation on this for public consultation.

    The ERF would take effect from July 1.

    Submissions in response to the terms of reference of the ERF close on November 18.

    :http://www.skynews.com.au/topstories/article.aspx?id=915555&vId=4191785&cId=Top%20Stories&play=true

  61. I’m in two minds about Abbott’s threat of a DD election over the price on carbon.

    1. Abbott is grandstanding and has absolutely no intention of doing anything to jeopardise his position – after all he might lose.

    2. Abbott is completely oblivious to the fact that he might lose – the egotist in him says That Which I Shall Will Upon The People by The Fact of the Almighty “I want”, shall indeed come to pass…

    Conclusion: Abbott wants it and wants it now, the same as he wanted a new election and wanted it now when the Indies decided that Labor was the side far more likely to keep their promises, especially the NBN. This time if he doesn’t get his way on a price on carbon, he may do the deed and call a DD. Of course we all know how Abbott has great faith in the media machine called Murdoch who will twist it every which way and talk about everything except the future of this planet and our responsibility towards future generations – so it’s likely that Abbott thinks if he won this time courtesy of his media make-over, that he’ll win a DD election.

  62. Once the debate becomes about who can cut pollution the most, it can then turn to how. That is when direct action will be shown up as the rubbish that it is.

    To that end, the ALP made a monumental error today in agreeing to ‘terminate the carbon tax’. By and large, the public don’t know the difference between a carbon tax or an ETS (or any market mechanism). They know Australia has a policy, and it is a carbon tax. They don’t know what it does. They don’t know how it works. But they know they don’t really like it, because a) jerbs and b) THAT WOMAN LIED.

    Come July 1, a PUP-controlled senate will have no trouble tossing out the current laws. In fact, they will be pressuring the government to go further, and passing direct action will probably become problematic.

    Thus the ALP have a few months to try to negotiate something. They won’t do that by acceding to Liberal demands. They need to make the coalition the party of pollution. It’s not a hard sell. Everyone already knows the coalition are preferred by business and by industry (and what image does the word ‘industry’ conjure but smokestacks?), so making the connection is not hard. At that point, maybe, just maybe, the coalition would be under some pressure to have an effective policy to tackle pollution (which,

    http://ausopinion.com/2013/10/16/its-pollution-stupid/#comments

    Nicola Roxon now ion ABC 24. Saying what she believed went wrong. Putting the boot into Rudd. Is only doing it once. ABC 24. Button Lectures.

  63. DD Election ct? Big Tony’ll win that easily. BS has too many skeletons and it’s Murduch’s right to expose his arse! Shoulda gone with Albo.

    In fact it’s not too late, except the chief executioner is now in charge. That throws a spanner in the works! Ohhhhh…. Hangon, there’s plenty of lefty leeches who will ring Murdoch with some juice…all is not lost after all…pmsl

    leader number ..oh..ah…ummm..dont matter…coming right up

  64. Carol, there will be no DD, and Abbott knows it. Another stunt.

    He will not even tell us, at this last date how long the houses will be sitting. That is not the norm.

    Even if he managed to get the two votes within the time frame, there is no guarantee that any GG would OK it. He still has to prove he cannot govern. Bit hard with one bill.,

    That was tested in court, in Whitlam’s day. It was not allowed. Whitlam had other triggers as well.

    Also we would be heading into the budget period and getting close to the new Senators taking their seats.

    There is an option for Labor though. They could usher the bills through both houses quickly, voting no. In three months, they could then demand that Abbott bring therm back to be voted on. In the same position as Rudd found himself. Rudd did not proceed. Probably another of his big mistakes.

    I doubt that Abbott would chanve a DD.

    In the meantime, Labor could get out and sell what we have. As soon as Abbott moves from toxic tax, he is in trouble,.It shows him up to being a liar.

    No, it is still games and stunts.

    Roxon, laying it out, as she saw it. No punches pulled. ABC 24

  65. Summo, I wouldn’t mind a debate between yourself and FU. The rules would be 1. factual information and 2. an opinion allowed as a conclusion. A former troll here el gordo, was up to the task..are you?

  66. What do you think of the Liberals rorting Summo, with another outed today and the Murdoch media no less saying it will widen for the Libs?

    Strange how you’re quiet on this and other Abbott backflips, lies, deceits and his own rorts when you’re so vocal on petty and inane gormless nonsense against Labor. Or is it that’s all your brain can wrap it’s unbalanced right tilted neurons around?

  67. Fed up, Abbott’s problem with DD election based on climate change is that although he might make promises about Aussies being a whole $500.00 better off which looks rather pathetic when countered against Brandis’s library and the cost of Tony’s lycra.

  68. Mobius, which is of course is why Abbott has suddenly come over all hairy chested about taxing the biggest polluters – they of course have contributed and substantially to Abbott’s war chest. Abbott is all about the money..mostly to help pay his mortgage and for the kiddies silk Armani leggings.

  69. $14 billion in new gross government borrowing since the 9th of September.

    Abbott’s going for the all time borrowing record in the shortest amount of time.

    And the laugh is that on top of the $2 billion “repenting” the carbon price (that’s what Abbott called it, a price) is going to cost up front it now turns out that businesses are demanding back refunds because of Abbott’s framing of the repeal legislation. Palmer won’t support the repeal unless the back payments are included.

    That will cost another $4 billion, but I guess that’s small bikkies compared to borrowing $14 billion in five weeks and slugging charities by taking money off them to give to local councils for lights and CCTV cameras, but only very select local councils as Abbott did what Howard did in abundance, start rolling out the pork barrels.

    What an utter joke this worst of all governments is.

  70. Summo, Shorten is also the hero of the Beaconsfield Mine disaster where he showed his metal, plus was the impetus behind NDIS from the time he was elected.. which compares with Abbott whose idea of danger means wearing a rashie instead of a steamer.

  71. ME I think liberals rorting is right up there with alp rorting. They’re called politicians and obviously you trust politicians more than I. Also ME, I hope that you have never in your 60 odd years done no wrong? (I hope odd didn’t offend you. U can be rather sensitive ME))

  72. Abbott must be really bad Summo if instead of elucidating why he and his government are honest and proficient, all you can do is come out with the featherbrained crap you have been lately.

  73. CAT..don’t ever roll out the hero word, unless you know of a heroic act they’ve performed. BT is no hero, he was doing his job and being well compensated no doubt.

  74. Hypocrite Summo, utter hypocrite. But thanks for confirming you condone the Liberal party rorting and now have no credibility to criticise or accuse anyone, after all if it’s OK for your Liberals then it must be OK for everyone.

    I hope odd didn’t offend you. U can be rather sensitive ME

    Projection joke? Must be, you have never offended me, you just haven’t got the wit or nous to offend me, but on the other hand…

  75. Lame Summo, you really haven’t got it at all have you.

    Can’t defend your beloved Abbott so come here to post piddling gobbledegook as a distraction.

    When you resort to petty personal abuse as you have nothing else then we know you’ve lost it.

  76. ‘All Truth passes through 3 stages,
    – first, it is ridiculed,
    – second, it is violently opposed,
    – third, it is accepted as being Self Evident.’ Schopenhauer.

    Summo is in the first stage, but not doing much of a job at it.

  77. Summo, I know a hero when I see one. My father served at Milne Bay ww2, my son had 2 tours of the Gulf and 2 tours of East Timor. But the most heroic thing of all was my father when he passed away age 89yrs old..survived it all, he died of prostate cancer. Which reminds me: time for you blokes to have your men’s wellness checks.

  78. Shorten was called the hero of Beaconsfield because of his duty towards the families. Not once have a I ever heard of Shorten bringing up how much the families treasured his help, which compares with Abbott who thinks that spending a week each year in an Aboriginal community somehow makes up for him dragging millions from charities such as the Police Youth & Citizens Club and from Aboriginal sporting incentives..what is your justification for those actions.

  79. No disrespect CAT. My Dad did the same as did others in my family. They served in the armed forces, they fought and some were wounded, some never found, but it’d probably be best if you asked those like them and you family members about the term hero. They are the only ones who truly know what a hero is and most are quick to condemn the regular use of the word to describe someone who does something worthy. Nobody is denying BS at Beaconsfield, but hero? Please, ask the fallen and theirs about heroes before you use it. The misuse is right up there with icon. What is BS an Icon already.

  80. Summo, why don.t you put your money were your mouth ism when it comes to Abbott and DDs.

    There will not be one, unless Labor decides to rush the legislation through, allowing it to have two rejects. Yes, Labor curtail the debate and vote no, in both houses.

    If the houses follow normal procedures, they bill would be lucky to be voted on before Christmas the first time.

    Especially if the houses only sit for two weeks, and come back in February, as been leaked.

    We know they might sit from the 12’11, but not for how long.

    Abbott knows this. He is nothing but bluff. What he wants, is portray normal movement of bills through the house, as being Labor and Greens delaying tactics.

    There is no way that Abbott will be able to spring the DD lever, with the budget coming up, and then the new senators sitting. One bill might not be enough.

    Abbott seems to be listening to someone, as he said, there would be no sign of his DA until the middle of next year. Yes, he knows it will work, but it now appears, they have no idea what it will contain,. Asking the public for ideas.

    All Abbott wants to talk about, is a big bad toxic tax. This, he will not get away with. He will have to talk about what he is repealing. No toxic tax there.

    The debate then changes to reality.

  81. Summo, so why is Abbott your hero? Why are his ideals your icons? Is it his homophobia, his leering at teenage girls which turns you on (not a rumour, he stated inappropriately that he was into *body contact* with a teenage sport team, reported in the media), or maybe his rorting for the purposes of self-promotion…

  82. When one add the tax breaks we are not getting. The school kids bonus. No, families will be greatly worse off.

    That are just two things that come to mind.

    The budget next year is going to be a beauty. No way, Abbott would want DD election about that time.

    Then there is the MYEFO they are delaying to February.

    In the meantime, we look like being in for another drought, and a summer of fires. Time is not on Abbott’s side.

    Not with the USA antics. I believe they will find out how hard it is to make a budget, let alone living within ones means. .

    No one listen to Nicola Roxon tonight?

    http://www.abc.net.au/news/2013-10-16/roxon-ten-tips/5026972

  83. and Marge has not moved out of home. Left him in Bali to go on, by himself.

    Flew back to Manly fire depot, to be left sitting all day in a fire truck. Complained all the way back to Cranberry, that they left him sitting in the cabin all day.

    Wonder were the nosy guards sat.

    Might have made a bigger splash on the beach, My local paper says there were over 30 rescues over the weekend. There were many children among those rescued. Not far up the coast from Warringah.

  84. I am so glad to see the ‘debate’ is shifting back to the most important ‘thing’ happening in our world today…… which of course is ‘sloganisming’ ….:- some future samples 😉 – “Tow back the CC” ….. “Stop the Carbon bloat(s)” …. ” Ditch the Twit” and of course the futurer-ly famous lie that Tony said ” CC is crap”….. which he never said !! 😛 …. and even if he did, it’s Labor’s fault and what ‘he’ said was taken out of context!!… even though he didn’t say it!!… because he agrees with the science…. which he has always 😯 ,… after all the ‘idea’ of a Carbon Tax was practically ‘his’…. just ask him, he’ll tells ya 🙄
    I am so glad that ‘the talk’ has finally turned ( or is that returned) to CC, I am fearfull for my fellow country persons 😀 as we roll on into this summer with Tony the twit and some of his fellow state LnPee’s at the helm… 😦
    …. this could be the summer of our discontent 😥

  85. So Mr. Hunt believes there are green shoots growing that tells him, Labor will let his legislation through before Christmas. What grass are they on, I wonder.

    ABC Lateline. Answer were not that revealing.

    Unclear why the money required now is less. Something about less carbon emissions., therefore less cost.

    Could that be, Labor’s scheme have been working. If this is not true, why should the task now be easier.

    I not worried about not allowing Hunt, as Emma seemed to be having the same problem, making sense of his figures.

  86. TONY Abbott has been embarrassed by another of his MP’s expense claims just as he was trying to secretly tighten the reins on Coalition politicians’ travel.
    The Prime Minister’s chief-of-staff Peta Credlin emailed all Coalition MPs on Monday demanding they get approval at least four weeks before all overseas study trips, sponsored travel and private holidays.

    But the move has triggered dissent in government ranks, with disgruntled MPs claiming their private lives are being invaded and the PM’s office was indulging in a “power grab”.

    “It’s one thing to ask ministers and parliamentary secretaries to seek permission but for backbenchers this is just ridiculous,” one Coalition MP said.

    “These people are adults, they can make their own decisions. More experienced hands will just laugh this Stalinist move off.”

    The government was hit by yet another expense drama yesterday when details emerged of the recent expenses claims of Canning MP Don Randall, a member of the committee responsible for upholding parliamentary standards.

    The West Australian MP claimed more than $5000 on a trip to Cairns with a family member as “electorate business” on November 18 last year, only a week before he declared to parliament he and his wife had taken possession of an investment property in the city………….

    http://www.news.com.au/national-news/tony-abbott8217s-office-clamps-down-on-travel-as-expenses-scandal-continues/story-fncynjr2-1226741231926#ooid=RqOWZ3ZjpEIQ1RReti-OB-R-3WjDFcx2

    http://www.news.com.au/national-news/tony-abbott8217s-office-clamps-down-on-travel-as-expenses-scandal-continues/story-fncynjr2-1226741231926

  87. Poor Tweed seems to be the one confused as a right winger hypocrite yet again attacks Labor, who are not in power, as a way of distracting from his woeful leader and terrible government who are failing on just about every front.

    Can’t address your government Tweed so have to resort to strawmen and look over there at Labor?

  88. I am so glad that ‘the talk’ has finally turned ( or is that returned) to CC.

    It has only done so LOVO because this government knee deep in rorts with over 25% of their members involved and Ltd News saying that number will expand, and along with all their other backflips, lies and broken promises they are desparately attempting to divert attention to the only promise they look like in part keeping, repenting the carbon price.

    It is now officially a carbon price because that’s what Abbott called it in his legislation and speech announcing the release of the draft.

    Does Abbott calling it a carbon price yet calling Gillard a liar for saying she will bring in pricing now make Abbott as big a liar on that after falsely accusing her was bringing in a tax, not a price?

  89. ME, It has always been about CC

    Get up planning things for the 17/11

    Hunts confidence that Labor will wave his bills through by Christmas is unbelievable, on Lateline last night. Would not answer many questions.

    As some are saying, “it is pollution, stupid”

    Maybe Abbott can make the non existent toxic tax go away.

    He cannot make the carbon emissions that endanger the climate go away. It will still be there.

    Most experts say, for his DA to have any chance of success, another six billion is needed.

    I believe Hockey is coming home, at last from NY. Wonder what he found there to take so much of his time.

  90. MINISTERS have been ordered to seek higher approval for billions of dollars in annual grants, as the Abbott government hunts for savings amid fears of a hit to revenue in a looming budget update.

    The directive will restrict all discretionary grants as part of a wider plan to identify major budget savings outside a commission of audit to be revealed within weeks.

    While some ministers said they were being told to halt the grants, Finance Minister Mathias Cormann told The Australian there was not a freeze but a series of checkpoints on spending instead.

    The rules are being imposed as the government prepares to release its first major budget statement before Christmas, in the face of Labor accusations that it has gone silent on its claims of a “budget emergency” needing urgent action.

    Joe Hockey used a speech in New York yesterday to promise a more “realistic” assessment of tax collections, signalling that the budget revision would mark down old revenue forecasts and sharpen the focus on savings.

    As the Treasurer heads back to Australia, the government is finalising a commission of audit to examine all parts of the public sector including privatisations – with Australia Post a potential target – and reforms to billions of dollars in tertiary education fees.

    Mr Hockey and Senator Cormann sent a joint letter to fellow ministers in recent days telling them that all discretionary grants had to be approved by the Finance Minister.

    The grants are worth about $3 billion a year, five times the level of a decade ago, according to past surveys in which Auditor-General Ian McPhee has faulted both Coalition and Labor governments for poor safeguards on how the money is spent.

    At stake are ministerial decisions to hand out thousands of payments in portfolios such as health, education and human services.

    Responding to questions from The Australian yesterday, Senator Cormann said: “We are not freezing grants”, but suggested there would be new curbs on outlays. “What we are doing is applying additional scrutiny to uncommitted discretionary spending to ensure there is no waste, no duplication and that the spending aligns with our policy priorities,” he said. “While my department is going through that process, there is an additional approval step before spending can proceed to ensure scrutiny can take place. But there is no freeze.” Separate measures are also under way to add to the budget bottom line.

    The first definite cut in the Coalition savings program is a $975 million gain from a series of “redirections” of unspent money from old Labor programs. The Australian understands the government will claim the money as an “early dividend” by adding the redirections to the budget bottom line rather than using the amounts to fund other programs.

    The saving can only be booked because the government has rejected dozens of Labor’s spending promises at the federal election, including almost $200m in regional grants for local councils. Also on the rejection list is a $12m grant to a book industry innovation council – announced by Labor five days before the election – and an $18m payment to help “iconic” food brands.

    The government is claiming the savings on the grounds that it outlined its own regional grants program – also worth about $200m – and dozens of other commitments but identified separate funding for the measures. In contrast, Labor paid for its election promises by claiming $1.5bn in unspecified “redirections from existing programs” in each department in a document issued at the end of the election campaign.

    After going through the list in the weeks since the election, the government has been advised it can book $975m in savings over four years.

    Senator Cormann said the government was “repairing the budget” by booking the savings.

    “Where Labor made commitments during the campaign which were funded from a reallocation of unspent existing resources, we have been able to bank a saving, given all of our own election commitments were more than fully funded from our own savings announced before the election,” he said.

    Cabinet ministers are expected to discuss the budget outlook and sign off on the commission of audit when Mr Hockey returns from the US.

    The Treasurer told the American Australian Association in New York yesterday that the government was “determined” to bring the budget back to surplus but had to have a realistic timetable to do so. “We will have a more realistic assessment of the impact of external factors on our budget so that the revenue forecasts start from a more appropriate base,” he said.

    Those remarks indicate the government will put a more conservative estimate on future revenue, revising the Labor government’s forecasts in ways that might deepen the deficit in the near-term.

    Amid the debate over the US shutdown and possible debt default, Mr Hockey said the government would not “shy away” from tough decisions needed to prepare Australia for “inevitable” shocks. “The first round of all these decisions will feed into our mid-year economic and fiscal outlook, which I expect to release before Christmas,” he said.

    The Australian revealed last month that the commission of audit would have the scope to examine the privatisation of Australia Post, although a greater priority could be to reform the company so that its profitable parcel operations could keep subsidising its essential services.

    The audit could also consider reforms to the higher education contribution scheme. The government has about $23bn in HECS debt on its balance sheet and could “sell” that to investment banks to collect on the debt from former students, although the federal government yesterday hosed down the suggestion.

    Labor has accused the government of misleading voters over the state of the nation’s finances by claiming a “budget emergency” before the September 7 election but retreating from that rhetoric in the past six weeks.

    “I think that the Coalition has confected a budget emergency, and they are finding that’s not what they want to do in government,” Labor Treasury spokesman Chris Bowen said this week.

    Asked if there was a budget emergency, Senator Cormann said the government had inherited a budget deficit of more than $30bn this year while gross debt was on track to reach the legislated $300bn debt limit by Christmas. “Of course we inherited a budget emergency from Labor,” he said. “That doesn’t mean, though, that we should respond in a panicked and inappropriately rushed way.”

    – See more at: http://www.theaustralian.com.au/national-affairs/policy/ministers-told-to-rein-in-spending-as-mathias-cormann-cracks-down-on-grants/story-fn59nsif-1226741304318?from=public_rss&utm_source=The%20Australian&utm_medium=email&utm_campaign=editorial&net_sub_uid=5083888#mm-breached

  91. The biggest problem Abbott has, it will not save families much. In fact when one looks at the other things, that families will boi longer get, families will be out of pocket.

    …….Experts have rejected claims by the federal government that household expenses would be significantly smaller after a repeal of the carbon tax.
    Prime Minister Tony Abbott and Environment Minister Greg Hunt said on Monday average households would be $550 a year better off with the scrapping of the tax.
    Greg Hunt.
    Claims questioned: Environment Minister Greg Hunt. Photo: Alex Ellinghausen
    About $280 of the predicted $550 savings for the final year of the carbon tax – due under current legislation to revert in mid-2015 to a floating price about a third of the present level – would require businesses to pass on lower costs………
    …..Meanwhile, Mr Abbott might have a more pressing challenge than convincing Labor to abandon its carbon price: keeping his own senators in line over issues such as his paid parental leave scheme.
    Simmering resentment within the Coalition over both policy and personnel within the government, including anger at what one called ”the iron fist approach” of Mr Abbott’s office, has increased the possibility of an outbreak of ill-discipline as early as the new year.
    Some MPs blamed Mr Abbott’s chief of staff Peta Credlin, alleging she had exercised excessive influence over everything from policy priorities to public appearances by senior ministers.
    While the parental leave scheme would not start until July 1, 2015, Liberals said Mr Abbott planned to introduce legislation to establish it as early as February, raising the prospect of negotiations with the Greens in the Senate.
    The policy would mean some high-earning women, on salaries of $150,000 and above, would be paid up to $75,000 over six months following the birth of their baby.
    But the ”gold-plated” $5.5 billion-a-year scheme was bitterly opposed in sections of the Coalition who admitted to having ”bitten our lips” in the lead-up to the election.
    Nationals were most hostile, arguing the policy favoured already well-off city women…………..

    Read more: http://www.smh.com.au/federal-politics/political-news/lower-bills-wont-happen-say-experts-20131016-2vn3r.html#ixzz2hvDHHTrm

    On this, day 30, all one is hearing, is rorting, by mostly Coalition MPs. Not going away.

  92. THE Abbott government is threatening a double dissolution if their carbon price repeal bills don’t pass the Senate.
    Or are they? It was a warning they repeatedly made in opposition, and a Liberal backbencher aired it again on the weekend, but the prime minister seemed to stop short in Tuesday’s press conference.
    Only the most courageous government would take the country to the polls barely six months after winning office, about an issue few people care much about any more.
    Those historians in the moment, commentators who imbibe this week’s vibe and regurgitate grand narratives, see the carbon price as a key symbol of Labor’s fatal estrangement from the political centre. But their stories change with the zeitgeist.
    I’m yet to see a survey showing most Australians opposed to some kind of price on carbon.
    To the Coalition faithful and culture warriors the “carbon tax” is not mere policy but emblematic of the battle for the country’s soul. Hatred for it is rampant among this noisy minority but these contests leave most Australians cold.
    Like the GST the policy over a decade ago, it was potent scare campaign fodder until it was introduced, then it slowly fizzed. The scheme in place might not be effective, it might be poorly-designed, but it’s a small deal to most people’s lives.
    And the electricity price drops from “axing the tax”, after all the carry-on, will be small beer too.
    John Howard went to the 2007 election with an emissions trading scheme and Kevin Rudd in his first stint as prime minister wanted to bring in an ETS with a one year fixed-price period. His successor Julia Gillard introduced an ETS with a two-year fixed-price. She allowed it to become known a “tax”, which was bad enough—people viscerally react more negatively to “taxes” then “s…………

    http://blogs.theaustralian.news.com.au/mumble/index.php/theaustralian/comments/should_or_shouldnt_they/

  93. Hmmm, I see Murdoch is letting the Coalition know he can destroy them as easily he did Labor, by manipulation the public discourse in distorting the flow of information that the Public digest via his media holdings.
    Standard Mafia stand-over tactics, to remind the Coalition whom they must please to remain in power, by his “hint” that the reporting of the Coalition’s rorting of expense accounts will exposéd if they fail to please him.
    Gotta admire the audacity to expose himself and not care a shit about what everyone thinks. Cocksure of himself for sure.

  94. Maybe that 1980’s song “What about me” should be resurrected and sung every time Tiny Abbott shows up anywhere. He panders to that of Industry, how about our People’s turn. Let us see if this guy is a really a Prime Minister, or a Prime Miniature.

  95. Wonder if he is going to meet number one lobbyist, along with Turnbull?

    One trick Tony, leads one hopes, to one term Tony.

    His leading lobbyist will not be able to save him.

    I think the fifth estate is getting his measure.

    Now for the fight ti defend the only thing we have, that addresses man made climate change.

    Not a toxic tax, as Abbott’s. the man of slogans says, but a CEF package, that has already shown results, has not destroyed the economy, will lead to clean, renewals power production.

    Mr. Hunt says, owing to the levels of carbon being generated now, he will not have to spend as much, as they predicted when they first released their Direct Action Scheme.

    Why is that so? Could only be, because the CEF package has been a success.

    Then we have all experts saying, Abbott and Hunt need six billion more, to ghave any effect.

    Abbott says, no matter what, he will not be spending a cent more, no matter the results.

    When one looks at their calender, not much will be spent until the fourth year.

    Until Abbott can show us what is his plan, and how it works, he cannot expect the public top support him. Well at least the majority, all polling shows, still support action being taken, to cut carbon emission.

    It is not a toxic tax that is being curtailed. It is the CEF package. One that most industry, in the long run, benefits from.

  96. Fed up @ 8:16 am

    Great piece in this mornings news about how Labor’s PPL scheme is doing wonders for families and showing demonstrable benefits, especially the two weeks the father can take and the flexibility that allows the mother to give any leave not taken to the father.

    The combined mother/father scheme is showing tangible benefits to the upbringing of children.

  97. Fed up October 17, 2013 @ 12:32 pm
    If we are lucky, Tiny Abbott will be trapped out of harms way, in a truck, where damage can be minimized for the whole Country.

  98. Afraid those fires are too close at this time. Have not seen one move as fast as the one at Doyalston/Lake Munmorah. Thankfully, it has stayed on the other side of the highway.

    Have seen them move as fast as a kid, in the Central West, in the middle of summer during extreme dry times.

    Seems to have re lit from the fires of a couple of weeks ago.

  99. Did anyone watch the Melbourne interview with Gillard. Never seen such a big crowd, show what can only be called real respect even love for the former PM, Ms, Gillard. Funny how she brings the best out, in all those who have personal contact with her.

    Funny, when popular perception tells us, she is hated.

    If that is the worse Abbott receives, he is getting off lightly.

    At least no one has told him, he has a target on his forehead, and a fun is being aimed at him.No one has suggested, that his father is ashame of him.

  100. FU. Mate you have got to stop the substance abuse. Gillard was a sick joke on society and has done irreparable damage to the cause of female participation in Parliaments. The question is always going to be when considering a future female PM ….what if we get another Gillard .
    …and Michael. I say again, The Carbon Tax is going to keep on giving for Abbott long after Gillard has buried herself into obscurity in the academia black hole.
    Gillard’s Carbon Tax even eclipses Conroy’s incompetent and stupid attempt to lay fibre optic.

  101. Tweed..if I may? AND Bowen’s attempted management of boats, which grew into a $4b industry sponsored by you and I.

    School halls, $1m tuckshops, deaths in ceilings….et el.

  102. Poor right wingers, still stuck in the past peddling bullshit against Labor instead of being able to stick up for their joke of a government and clown of a leader who did another backflip.

    I wish I could feel sorry for them but can’t pity stupidity.

  103. Summo. That’s what we get for. $300 billion debt ceiling….. About to go to $370 billion. Nice legacy lefties. Thanks for your contribution…. Not.
    I wonder when Gillard will front the Victorian cops over AWU scandal and slush fund. Williamson has certainly set the benchmark pretty high. He must have been a cadet at the BLF……and a protege if Norm Gallagher?

  104. Tweed, every time you mention the debt ceiling you probably think you’ve made a telling point.

    To those of us with an understanding of how modern monetary systems actually function all you’re doing is confirming you’re an idiot.

  105. Then Tweed to prove you’re an idiot on modern monetary systems how about you tell us why the current new government has actually increased borrowings and accelerated them over and above what the previous government was doing, and further to that Hockey has stated he is planning to implement a stimulus package along the same lines as the previous Labor government?

    To show how unimportant your ranting on debt is. An American economist being interviewed on ABC Radio National about the US default said that there is no problem with US debt as all they do is print more money when it’s needed. It’s their dollar and the debt is in their dollar and they are the ones who produce that dollar.

  106. No concerns yet from Mr. Abbott about NSW fires. I believe he is too busy another stunt in Brisbane, with Mr. Cando.

  107. I am sure, if the Victorian police have been able to find anything, even with their fishing expedition, digging through lawyers files of over twenty years ago, they would have her in.

    Maybe someone can tell me, what is the great crime, that Ms Gillard is said to have committed.

    Ms. Gillard has asked the media this question, on more than one occasion.

    Can some one also explain, why the Federal Police have said, MP rorts is nothing to do with them. The responsibility lies with the finance department.,If this is so, how did they come to investigate, and charge Slipper.

    It appears that the NSW fires are not important enough for Abbott to emerge from his bunker, and talk to the people of NSW.

    We now have one death, up the road from me. I have never seen a fire move so fast. I am lucky that it jumped the highway a few metres past my home.

    When one looks at the fire map, we can only salute the fire fighters in this area. How they manage to save so many homes s amazing.

    We need heavy rain. From what I have observed, these fires have re lit from fires two or three weeks ago.

  108. Fed up, last year when we were saying that Abbott’s rush to put out the fires was a publicity stunt, the right-wingers went feral because Gillard wasn’t doing the same. A PM should do these things, they insisted.

    Now where is the new PM then? Apparently, according the the right-wingers of last year, a PM should help with putting out fires.

  109. Maybe Abbott believes, if he does not voice the words fire and weather, leading to climate, it might go away.

    Abbott’s trouble is. that no one cares about his toxic tax, let along caring abut whether he repeals it or not.

    People stil care about man made climate change.

    I will be out on November 17 with Get up. I only hope that they have a protest closer to my home, so I do not have go to Sydney.

    Was at the last one, when the CEF was being passed in Canberra.

    Yes, Mr. Abbott, we are all well aware that a new government is in town. Looking at the actions in some of the states, it is now time to get out on the streets, to protect the few rights we have left.

  110. Michael, he did turn up last Sunday. They let him sit in a truck all day. One could say, the message from his mates in the unit, we do not want you here. You are not going to use us anymore for stunts.

    Why he has not given his condolence, since it looks like more that two hundred homes, including some of historical importance has gone, and now the deaths are starting.

    It is major fires, even for the areas of NSW they are occurring in. My area is not usually this bad.

    Maybe he should hook up with O’Farrel today, not Cando.

  111. It appears there is not going to be any wages rises for the staff of this government, for those who followed Abbott from Opposition.

    Most are upset, as they believe extra work and responsibilities, deserve extra wages. the same as their bosses are getting. on becoming ministers.

    I believe they might have a point.

    Talk about a self centred government.

    We get the shadow ministry, today, I believe. Time for Shorten, also to get his messages out re the fires.

  112. Industry minister Ian Macfarlane said the government would find the $400m. Photograph: Lukas Coch/AAP
    More than 100 companies – including News Corp Australia, Amcor, Golden Circle and Visy – may lose clean technology grants worth more than $53m as the Abbott government searches for budget savings.

    During the election campaign the Coalition pledged to save $400m by discontinuing the Labor government’s clean technology program, part of $42bn in savings it outlined to pay for its election pledges. The clean technology fund was paid for by the carbon price, which the Coalition will also seek to repeal as its first legislative act.

    Ministers have now been asked to look for further savings – including reconsidering discretionary grants across all portfolios – as economic growth remains subdued and the new government prepares a mid-year budget review for release before Christmas.

    Guardian Australia has learned there is not $400m of uncommitted money left in the clean technology fund the Coalition has promised to cut, forcing it to consider withdrawing formal offers of funding already made to leading companies for detailed projects to reduce their carbon emissions, if legally binding contracts have not yet been signed.

    A spokeswoman for the industry minister, Ian Macfarlane, said the government woul…………

    http://www.theguardian.com/world/2013/oct/18/coalition-may-take-back-clean-technology-grant-offers-of-53m?CMP=ema_632&et_cid=53343&et_rid=fehowarth@iprimus.com.au&Linkid=http%3a%2f%2fwww.theguardian.com%2fworld%2f2013%2foct%2f18%2fcoalition-may-take-back-clean-technology-grant-offers-of-53m

  113. TA can’t afford to visit the bushfire-affected areas lest someone confront him about his attitude to climate change science, and he is desperately scared of being exposed on this issue.

  114. Tony can’t afford to visit the bushfire affected area lest someone cottons on to the fact that he has NO idea of what to do….. one wonders if Tones is nothing but one cunning stunt.. after another…. one, also, wonders why limitednews hasn’t shown photo-shops of Tones blowing the fires out with his calibre breath… no, really 🙄

  115. Fu, in QLD we call him Mr CAN’T. This is because he fails in all the things he says he “Can Do!” in electioneering, and suddenly for all things worthwhile and required he promised, he “can’t”. “Campbell Newman is a CAN’T!” is a much loved phrase up here.

  116. TechinBris there are thing Newman can do though.

    He can give himself and ministers huge pay rises.
    He can take away from the less well off and give to the wealthy.
    He can destroy the Queensland environment at record scope and rate in the name of profits for a few.
    He can destroy swaths of the Great Barrier Reef.
    He can put at threat The Great Artesian Basin.

    What he can’t do is keep promises and the right thing for Queensland and Australia.

  117. Mr. Abbott, this is the way it is done.

    Federal opposition leader Bill Shorten commented on the NSW bushfires during a press conference at Parliament House in Canberra. He said: ‘The pain for hundreds of families who have lost their homes is unimaginable.’ Shorten also acknowledged the selfless work of the emergency services……

    http://www.theguardian.com/world/video/2013/oct/18/131017shortenfromgaus?CMP=ema_632&et_cid=53479&et_rid=fehowarth@iprimus.com.au&Linkid=http%3a%2f%2fwww.theguardian.com%2fworld%2fvideo%2f2013%2foct%2f18%2f131017shortenfromgaus


  118. New Labor leader Bill Shorten has moved to dash Tony Abbott’s hopes of obtaining swift progress on his carbon tax repeal bills, declaring the Prime Minister is confusing his own wishes with those of others and coming to flawed conclusions.
    “Mr Abbott confuses himself with myself,” Mr Shorten said in Canberra, after Mr Abbott had predicted that Labor would crumble and allow the repeal bills through because the carbon tax was a negative for it.
    “It is important that we have a principle that the future of this country can’t be mortgaged or delayed, that’s why we believe putting a price on carbon pollution is impo

    Read more: http://www.smh.com.au/national/tony-abbott-confuses-himself-with-myself-says-bill-shorten-20131018-2vsij.html#ixzz2iDwvbmcn

  119. Compare who can claim for disaster payment. ALP v Libs

    ALP – Social Security (Australian Government Disaster Recovery Payment) Determination 2013 (No. 4)
    Schedule 2 Circumstances in which person adversely affected

    A person is adversely affected by a major disaster mentioned in Schedule 1 if:
    (a) as a direct result of the disaster:
    (i) the person is seriously injured; or
    (ii) the person is an immediate family member of an Australian who is killed; or
    (iii) the person’s principal place of residence has been destroyed or has sustained major damage; or
    (iv) the person is unable to gain access to his or her principal place of residence for at least 24 hours because:
    (A) access to the place of residence is cut off; or
    (B) the person is unable to leave a place affected by the disaster;
    (v) the person is stranded in his or her principal place of residence for at least 24 hours, or
    (b) as a result of the disaster, the person’s principal place of residence was without a particular utility service for a continuous period of 48 hours; or
    c) the person is the principal carer of a child to whom paragraph (a) or (b) applies.

    Libs – Social Security (Australian Government Disaster Recovery Payment) Determination 2013 (No. 5)
    Schedule 2 Circumstances in which person adversely affected
    A person is adversely affected by a major disaster mentioned in Schedule 1 if:
    (a) as a direct result of the disaster:
    (i) the person is seriously injured; or
    (ii) the person is an immediate family member of an Australian who is killed; or
    (iii) the person’s principal place of residence has been destroyed or has sustained major damage; or
    (b) the person is the principal carer of a child to whom paragraph (a) applies.

    http://www.twitlonger.com/show/n_1rq00om

  120. Australian wildfires put heat on climate change skeptic Abbott

    “…………….Reuters) – A long, hot summer looms for Australian Prime Minister Tony Abbott as devastating wildfires near Sydney fuel opposition to his plans to repeal a carbon emissions tax, one of his basic campaign pledges in the election he won a month ago.

    The links between the blazes and climate change caused by carbon emissions are complex and as the driest inhabited landmass on earth, deadly wildfires have been a perennial problem for Australia.

    But a series of record-busting hot, dry conditions across the continent and an early start to the Southern Hemisphere summer has rekindled arguments on mankind’s impact on climate and what can be done to mitigate it.

    Abbott was elected in September on the back of plans to repeal Australia’s scheme to price the carbon emissions responsible for global warming. He has promised to dissolve both the lower house and the Senate if his plan to scrap the scheme is blocked.

    But as the fires spread, the pressure is mounting on Abbott, who once described the science around climate change as “absolute crap”.

    “Reducing emissions is not a free lunch, but neither is climate change,” said John Conner, the Chief Executive of independent research organisation The Climate Institute. “If we’re serious about reducing the risks of climate change and climate impacts like these bushfires, then we need to have a serious climate policy which is credible.”

    More than 200 homes have been destroyed since last Thursday as scores of fires burned through thousands of hectares of bush, farms and rural communities outside Sydney. A state of emergency has been declared in New South Wales (NSW) state, Australia’s most populous.

    Forecasts for a return of hot, windy weather later this week has raised fears that three of the most dangerous blazes in the Blue Mountains west of Sydney could join up to form a massive “mega-fire”, according to the New South Wales Rural Fire Service.

    CARBON PRICING BATTLE

    The previous Labor government’s carbon pricing plan was aimed at reducing emissions by taxing major polluters with the world’s highest carbon price of A$23 ($22.23) a tonne before moving to a market cap and trade system by mid-2014.

    Abbott, a volunteer NSW firefighter himself, now faces a tough test to convince opposition politicians to repeal it when parliament resumes next month, with the Greens and Labor vowing to fight changes.

    Abbott has a clear majority in the lower house, but if he fails to get the legislation through a hostile Senate, he has promised to call a double dissolution to break the deadlock. Such a move, last called in 1987, would mean elections to both the lower house and the upper house.

    After earlier rubbishing climate change, Abbott has subsequently acknowledged that it is happening and has proposed a “direct action policy” that would fund some projects that reduce or avoid greenhouse gas emissions and punish businesses which exceed their “business as usual” emission baselines.

    But just days after taking over as prime minister on Sept 18, Abbott dismantled the Climate Commission and the Climate Change Authority, the two main government bodies for reporting the science of climate change and providing advice on carbon pricing and emissions reduction targets.

    Before being disbanded, the Climate Commission had reported that climate change had increased the incidence of bushfires in many regions, with heat waves more frequent and severe and the number of hot days in Australia doubling since the 1960s.

    Last month, leading global climate scientists said they were more certain that human activity was the main cause of global warming, which would bring more heatwaves and droughts, as well as more floods and rising sea-levels.

    Scientists and most politicians are loath to link single weather or fire events to climate change, and Australian Greens deputy leader Adam Bandt was heavily criticized by some government ministers and media for “political point-scoring” when he did that after last week’s blazes.

    But the fires and persistent hot weather would increase public pressure on Abbott to come up with a strong alternative to carbon pricing, said Tristan Edis, a former research fellow at the Grattan Institute and now editor of Climate Spectator.

    “It’s not just about axing something. He’s got to replace it with something that credible and in that respect, (the fires) help people that are concerned about climate change and want to see government action on it, it helps their cause to keep this top of mind.” ($1 = 1.0348 Australian dollars).”

    http://uk.reuters.com/article/2013/10/21/us-australia-fires-abbott-idUKBRE99K03S20131021

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