Tony heads south

Just when I thought it would be a slow news week I’m hit with the beautiful Monday morning headline that Tony Abbott is further on the nose, with his popularity taking a further nosedive south. You can read about it here. To rub salt into his wounds he is:

. . . facing a crisis of confidence, with almost two-thirds of voters wanting the Opposition Leader replaced with the man he deposed two years ago, Malcolm Turnbull.

Mr Turnbull now leads Mr Abbott by 60 per cent as preferred leader, compared with Mr Abbott’s 29 per cent.

Ouch.

No doubt this headline will be followed up in the next few days with messages of stoic support from the party faithful, or the customary distractions such as another Rudd challenge to the PM.

In other less important news, I haven’t been around much lately thanks to bringing home the virus from hell from the USA. If this is the typical Yankee virus then I can understand why they’re a warlike race and like shooting people. But instead of taking to the streets with a machine gun I’m taking the gentler option of laying in bed and moaning 24 hours a day.

Thanks to Alex and Patricia for putting up their posts while Min and I were off-line. Their efforts were appreciated.

168 comments on “Tony heads south

  1. Personally I’m hoping they stick with Abbott! He’s fine as long as he isn’t in a position to have any real power. He’s been such a great Leader of the Opposition I hope he stays there. Forever. Any change will also undermine attacks on Labor over dumping Rudd: Oppositions aren’t normally attacked for this (as both parties know they will change leaders once in Opposition at a high rate) but this isn’t a normal parliament.
    Interesting that the same poll also saw support grow for the Prime Minister to remain as leader (particularly among ALP voters).
    Hope you’re back to 100%!

  2. This is not a popularity contest, even with Abbott the Coalition will still win.

    You must be aware that Talcum is on the nose with the Nats after his love affair with gorebull worming. If he recanted publicly, this flight of fancy, he may get a look in.

  3. I’d suggest that current polls beg to differ: the Coalition might just lose with Abbott. Amazing that el gordo can refer to a scientific theory such as anthropogenic climate change as a “flight of fancy”. You can’t choose your own reality.

  4. If it’s not a popularity contest, then why does Abbott spend an extraordinary amount of time attempting to prove that he is indeed popular. *see Tony’s recent attempt to “prove” that he is popular with women…

  5. Funny really to have Hon Prime Minister and the Leader of the Opposition so
    unpopular. Who would want either at home for the family and friends BBQ?
    Abbott certainly showed the flesh at Derby Day with 3 good looking women
    (namely wife and 2 daughters) , Julia cannot trump that one , Tim is as limp as a
    lettuce leaf on cold day and even worse on a hot day. He has been instructed
    not to wave at any time . How managed is that? Does he still do her hair.
    And I guess it shows the extent of the misogyny beatup.

  6. Oh dear, something that Hockey and Robb must have been dreading..the day when Tony’s policies started to be scrutinised as to cost..

    THREE of the Coalition’s tax policies will cost Australian businesses an extraordinary $4.57 billion in their first full year of operation, a Treasury analysis has found….

    Treasury finds businesses would lose $4.57 billion in the first full year the Coalition’s three commitments were operational, accumulating to $17.2 billion over four years. Its calculations suggest manufacturers would pay an extra $1.34 billion a year, retailers an extra $930 million and the construction sector an extra $860 million a year.

    http://www.smh.com.au/opinion/political-news/coalition-tax-plans-come-with-46b-bill-20121104-28sa5.html#ixzz2BIMVPqjP

  7. facing a crisis of confidence, …why is anyone surprised by this, whats the old saying, always see negative and negative will become you… something like that… I agree with Drunkslag though, leave him where he is.

  8. Voyager- that you think it’s important to note that Mr Abbott appears with three “good looking women” and that it somehow trumps the Prime Minister shows that sexism and misogyny is alive and well. Any evidence that Mr Mathieson has been instructed not to wave?

  9. Going south, eh? He he, Antarctica will boil over before the Rabbott becomes popular.

    Get well soon Migs. Good news like this will help!

  10. Oh dear, no surprise that an ignorant troll like el gordo also happens to belong to the Climate Change Denial Cult.

  11. There was a very interesting show on SBS yesterday called ‘Power surge’, on the subject of climate change and the race for alternative power sources. For anyone interested it is well worth a look. Trolls don’t bother, you wouldn’t know if the fire brigade was up your collective arses if you didn’t here the sirens. 🙄 🙄

    Cheers 😀

  12. Yes, Migs we have enjoyed the polls while you have been out of action. Not that they mean much at this time. They do upset that other side thought.

    We need to hope he lasts until the election. Not that it will make much difference, as I think any attempt to remove him, will split the Opposition apart.

    We now have shadow back benchers going against their leader.

    Mr. Slipper seems to be Mr. Abbott’s worse nightmare come true. The danger appears to be with him. Maybe Abbott should have left him in the chair.

  13. Oh dear, something that Hockey and Robb must have been dreading..the day when Tony’s policies started to be scrutinised as to cost..”

    Was this leaked by Treasury?? I thought these things were confidential. Wayne Swan has politicised Treasury and the Coalition no longer trusts Treasury. That is why they went to that accounting firm to get their policies costed. Before the last election after submitting some of their policies Swan leaked the results so the Coalition went elsewhere.

    It appears that the alleged Structural Deficit crap was sponsored by Swan to trash Costello. Anyone with any honesty would have been suspicious of allegations that Costello left a structural deficit when he ran so many surplus budgets. But we certainly have a structural deficit now. Swan has already spent the extra money they thought they wee going to get from the mining tax.

  14. “It appears that the alleged Structural Deficit crap was sponsored by Swan to trash Costello.” Gee, way to show your ignorance there, Neil. Even Costello himself complained about the way Howard’s drunken sailor spending was placing future surpluses at risk. Also, the structural deficit has been confirmed by a number of economic & political analysts *such as George Megalogenis). Of course, there are many people that believe Costello invented the “Budget Black Hole” in 1996, to trash Keating & allow Howard to break all of his “non-core” promises. Still, Neil, I’d hardly expect a Fiberal Cheerleader like yourself to know fact from fiction.

  15. That is true, Marcus. Costello declared that Howard was too busy throwing money around to buy votes instead of throwing where it was really needed, ie infrastructure. Neil, before you jump in asking for proof of this, look no further than Costello’s book. But I suppose you’ll say Costello was lying.

  16. Also, the structural deficit has been confirmed by a number of economic & political analysts *such as George Megalogenis).”

    It is news to me that Megalogenis publishes economic papers. According to Turnbull the Structural deficit crap was published to trash Costello.

    http://www.malcolmturnbull.com.au/media/speeches/budget-in-reply-speech-labor-wasting-the-boom/

    Talking about the alleged Structural deficit

    Nonetheless, Kevin Rudd and Wayne Swan were entirely willing to use a crude earlier version of the Treasury’s work published in the 2009-10 budget without any such qualification to try and trash John Howard and Peter Costello’s reputations by claiming that they squandered the resources boom. In fact it appeared that the work had been commissioned for that very purpose.”

    Latter work by Treasury showed there was no or a very small structural deficit in Costello’s last budget. Swan put the earlier structural deficit crap in the 2009-10 budget. He did not put the latter results in the budget. You will have noticed that Megalogenis no longer talks about Costello’s alleged structural deficit.

    Yeah Costello saved $50B in his last three budgets and you lot call that reckless spending.

  17. What twist is this??? Anybody with any honesty (which you people are not) would have suspected that the Structural deficit allegations against Costello may have been wrong. In fact Turnbull says they were published by Swan to trash Costello.

    The latest estimates can be found in Chart 14 at this link.

    http://archive.treasury.gov.au/documents/1881/HTML/docshell.asp?URL=04_Structural_Budget_Balance.htm

    It shows a small structural deficit in Costello’s last budget and these results are different to what was published in the 2009-10 budget if you believe you can actually measure such a difficult quantity.

    As I said Megalogenis no longer talks about it.

  18. Pretty desperate. Why not include in this post that the 2PP is 47-53 to the coalition or your heroine is not as popular as Rudd in Qld which will decide the next election? What about the percentage of people that Gillard lied about her part in Rudd’s stabbing? Nearly two thirds believe she did.

    Attending an American election party in the seat of Lilley in a couple of days. Will be fine tuning the campaign against Swan and have thousands to devote to the project. Rudd’s reelection is not guaranteed and Emerson might be in for a shock.

    Had a long chat to the next member for Moreton last week, Perrett is gone in this electorate. Slippers seat will go to Brough so at least an extra four seats in Qld.

    But then again…Gillard might not be there for the next election and if you think that Turnbull will be the leader at the next election, you lot are delusional!

  19. What twist, Neil? I repeated what Costello had said then you turn around and say I said he was a reckless spender. Huh!

  20. Scaper, you are the one being delusional. I can’t see where anybody has said that Turnbull will be leader at the next election.

  21. Well, this post says to expect stoic support or some Rudd challenge rumour as if Abbott does not have the support. Got to laugh though…the idea to spread the Rudd challenge was formulated last August by people that are not Liberal members. Funny thing it became reality around six months after it was agreed to seed the media with the rumour.

  22. Neil, I think it was announced by the treasury. Believe it or not, it is a part of their job.

    These figures are not from any policy that the Coalition has submitted for costing. They are from policy that the Coalition has put in the public arena.

    We have both Hockey and Abbott squealing like stuck pigs. One wonders why.

    They are complaining that the Greens policies have not attracted similar treatment6. Good reason for this, the Greens have not put forward any policies that can be assessed.

  23. No Neil, some of those structural deficits have been dealt with by Labor.

    Saying this, there is still a long way to go.

    To keep on reducing company and income tax might just add to any future problems.

    We only have to look to the USA to suspect this is the case.

  24. “Yeah Costello saved $50B in his last three budgets and you lot call that reckless spending.”

    Neil, as you appear to be on top of the subject, can you tell me how he managed to save this amount.

  25. Neil, I think it was announced by the treasury. Believe it or not, it is a part of their job.”

    If you are talking about this topic i am not sure that is true.

    http://www.smh.com.au/opinion/political-news/coalition-tax-plans-come-with-46b-bill-20121104-28sa5.html

    Treasury costing Coalition policies a long way from an election?? Sounds like Swan has totally politicised the Public Service and is using taxpayers money to try and trash an Opposition political party. He did the same thing with the Structural deficit crap.

    The reason why the Coalition went to that accounting firm is that after they submitted some of their policies for costing the evil man who is now Treasurer of this country leaked the results.

    Has this happened before?? An Opposition political party having some policies costed that they may not even take to an election since it is many many months away?

  26. Ah, the politicised Treasury. Let me see…last financial year they predicted a $10B hole in the budget, then mid year they revised it up to a $23B hole and it ended up over $43B???

    They haven’t even come close to predicting a budget because the department has become a Labor propaganda tool and until such time they can get relatively close to predicting an outcome, not worthy of belief at all.

    But you got to give it to Swan though…the world’s best treasurer (cough cough) introduces a new tax, has spent the predicted tax money already but nothing has come in. What a retard, HAHAHAHAHAH!

  27. Neil, what is so wrong for the treasury to cost policies in the public arena,

    What is wrong letting the voter know.

  28. CU

    Catallaxy has some point for thought.

    http://catallaxyfiles.com/2012/11/05/peter-martin-the-treasurers-go-to-man/

    WHAT THE HELL IS THE TREASURY DOING COSTING COALITION POLICIES?

    There is no sense in which this is legitimate activity for public servants to undertake. And were a government minister to ask for such analysis, the appropriate action of the public servants would be respectfully to decline the request.

    I am absolutely amazed that Peter Martin can’t see this.”

  29. “Although business as a whole would benefit from the Coalition’s policies because of the removal of the $6.6 billion a year carbon tax and the $2 billion a year mining tax, the analysis suggests that outside of the few big companies paying those taxes, the rest of Australian businesses would suffer.
    Treasury’s responsibility for costing opposition policies in the lead-up to election has been transferred to the new Parliamentary Budget Office, but it still maintains a watching brief on behalf of the government. During the 2010 election campaign it found errors and differences of opinion over Coalition costings amounting to $11 billion

    Read more: http://www.smh.com.au/opinion/political-news/coalition-tax-plans-come-with-46b-bill-20121104-28sa5.html#ixzz2BKbNzXkM

    scaper all the Treasury can do is make predictions on the figures available at the time. If these figures change, any predictions will be out.

    We reside in a volatile and fragile global economy that ois taking a long time to recover from the GFC.

  30. It is called the Public Service, I believe. Surely it is their responsibility to inform the public. If not, it should be.

    Why should we not know.

    It is up to any political party to ensure their Treasury has all the figures, to come to a balance outcome.

  31. CU

    “WHAT THE HELL IS THE TREASURY DOING COSTING COALITION POLICIES?”
    should really be “”Why is treasury attempting to come to grips with a suite of Coalition policies yet to be announced”

    Do you get it? Second guessing is a pathway to nowhere….

  32. No, I missed nothing. Abbott announces a policy. The treasury assessed that promise.

    It is up to Abbott to defend his position.

    I would see the treasury’s point of view, as to holding the Opposition to account.

    What is wrong with that.

  33. What a delusional, biased, and puerile lot the trolls are. If the economic shoe were on the other foot, they would be screaming from the rooftops that treasury costing of the alternate governments policies was essential, and in THAT case they would be right, as we, the voting public need to have the truth about policy so that we can make an informed decision on who should be running the joint instead of wrecking it.

    Grow up trolls or STFU.

  34. Treeman, I’m still waiting for your answer to an earlier question: how’s business? In particular, how’s business under the Gillard Government?

    From your posts I’d expect to learn that your business has been destroyed because of this Government.

  35. Stuff me mushrooms trollman, I know you’re not the brightest bulb on the Christmas tree, but surely your comprehension skills aren’t that appalling? The relevant quote is:

    Prepared as Treasury attempts to come to grips with a suite of Coalition policies yet to be announced, the analysis includes only those to which it has publicly committed. Excluded are policies with a negative but uncertain impact on business…

    Do you get it? Treasury is second guessing NOTHING 🙄

  36. Still don’t get it do you…”attempting to come to grips with thin air” now that’s really DELUSIONAL!

    Once again, when we do not again when we do not agree, we delusional.

    Tree, you are lucky you are having this conversation in cyber space.

    If you were in that bar, I think it was MJ mentioned, I feel by now you would be flat on your back.

    Maybe, it would just be a glass of beer over your head, that is if one could find some that has gone flat nearby. Would not want to waste a good beer. Not worth it.

  37. tree, for starters.

    Costello’s Queensland financial audit questioned
    ASHLEY HALL: To Queensland, where a union-funded report has labelled the former federal treasurer, Peter Costello’s, audit into the state’s finances shoddy and intellectually dishonest.

    Mr Costello’s audit is the document the Queensland Government has used to justify a big cost cutting program.

    The Sydney accounting academic, Professor Bob Walker, reviewed the audit for the Queensland Council of Unions.

    He says the review doesn’t adhere to required standards, and doesn’t support the State Government’s claims that debt is out of control……..

    …………………………………………………………..
    http://www.brisbanetimes.com.au/queensland/queensland-govt-forced-to-defend-budget-audit-20Two scathing academic reports have forced the Queensland government to defend a financial audit it has used to justify massive public sector cuts.
    The commission of audit into Queensland’s finances, chaired by former federal treasurer Peter Costello, found the state would have debts of $92 billion within four years.
    Premier Campbell Newman has used the audit to claim the state has thousands more public servants than it can afford.
    But University of Queensland economist Professor John Quiggin said the audit was ‘‘a routine political manoeuvre undertaken by incoming governments seeking to abandon electoral commitments.’’……………….

    ………………
    http://www.theaustralian.com.au/national-affairs/state-politics/costello-audit-paved-way-for-nicholls-budget/story-e6frgczx-1226471858889

    THE purpose of the Peter Costello-led audit of Queensland’s finances is now abundantly clear.
    Treasurer Tim Nicholls and his Liberal National Party colleagues were always going to move Queensland in a different direction but they needed to summarise, in the worst possible way, where the state had actually been under Labor. So they had Costello rewrite history while they were recharting the state’s course.
    Not only does today’s budget use different accounting terms and methodologies, it uses the Costello audit figures – not those of budgets past- to provide the historical comparison. This helps Nicholls justify certain decisions, both demonstrating the need and, at times, perhaps, exaggerating the benefits – a clever tool in times of such political and economic turbulence.
    Budget trickery, in itself, is neither new nor unique to the LNP; Labor used conservative Treasury forecasts during the last boom to suggest it was managing the coffers better than expected, and went into an election year predicting, on paper, a strong economic recovery that failed to eventuate………
    ……………………………………….
    http://www.couriermail.com.au/spike/columnists/audits-do-a-number-on-truth/story-e6frerg6-1226467519947
    COMMISSIONS of “audit” into state and federal finances are nothing new, and have assumed an almost ceremonial air as new governments seek ostensibly independent backing for claims that the Treasury cupboards are bare.
    These audits inevitably discover a budget black hole and fiscal mismanagement which provides the justification for a new administration to junk election promises or start slashing and burning.
    As Professor Bob Walker, who this week released a scathing assessment of the Peter Costello-led audit of Queensland finances, puts it, the process is aimed at reaching the following conclusions:
    “The incoming government had inherited a financial crisis. The financial cupboard was bare. There was a high level of debt. There was a need to cut a range of programs and reduce the size of the public sector.”

    Walker’s was not the only critique of the Costello report published this week. University of Queensland economist John Quiggin also concluded the Costello document was neither independent nor an audit, and grossly exaggerated the financial challenges facing the state.
    As Quiggin puts it, “the conservative parties of politics have formalised and ritualised the process”, beginning, somewhat ironically, with an audit commissioned by then incoming federal treasurer Peter Costello in 1996.”The impressive machinery of the Commission of Audit, and its predictably alarming report, laid the ground for the invention of the then-new category of ‘core promises’ which were to be kept, with the rest becoming ‘non-core’,” Quiggin says……….
    ………………………………………………..

    http://www.couriermail.com.au/news/national/queenslands-peter-costello-audit-trashed-by-experts/story-fndo1yus-1226466757844

    TWO separate reviews of the audit of Queensland state finances led by former federal treasurer Peter Costello have concluded the report was neither independent nor an “audit” as such.
    An examination of the Costello document by University of Sydney’s Professor Bob Walker argues that it simply follows a very familiar and politicised theme: “The incoming government had inherited a financial crisis. The financial cupboard was bare. There was a high level of debt. There was a need to cut a range of programs and reduce the size of the public sector.”
    The Walker analysis, funded by the Queensland Council of Unions, is backed up by University of Queensland economist John Quiggin, who will today publish his own independent critique of the document.
    Both analyses conclude that the Costello report focuses almost exclusively on the liabilities side of the Queensland balance sheet while understating assets, at the same time as shifting the goalposts when it comes to accounting standards to inflate the size of the problem………………
    ……………………………………..

    http://www.macrobusiness.com.au/2012/09/queenslands-rubbery-figures/

    Queensland’s rubbery figures
    Posted by Delusional Economics in Australian Economy, Featured Articleon September 7, 2012 | 65 comments
    I mentioned back in June that one the first acts of the new Newman Queensland government was to employ former Liberal federal Treasurer Peter Costello to “audit the books”. I suggested at the time that it was difficult to verify much of the report as it was obviously political in nature and I can only assume was written with a “glass half empty” mindset.
    The Courier Mail today has a piece covering responses to that audit:
    Two separate reviews of the audit of Queensland state finances led by former federal treasurer Peter Costello have concluded the report was neither independent nor an “audit” as such.
    An examination of the Costello document by University of Sydney’s Professor Bob Walker argues that it simply follows a very familiar and politicised theme: “The incoming government had inherited a financial crisis. The financial cupboard was bare. There was a high level of debt. There was a need to cut a range of programs and reduce the size of the public sector.”……………………

  38. The question should be asked is why Treasury was asked to cost some Coalition policies so far out from an election?? Swan is obviously up to something and is using taxpayers money to further the cause of the ALP.

    Surely it is a waste of money to cost policies so far out from an election when many parameters can change.

  39. By the time the next election comes around, Queenslanders will have had a gutful of Cando and will no doubt punish Liars party candidates by telling them to sling their hook, but keep smoking those cigarettes if it makes you feel better,scaper.

    A year is an extremely long time in politics.

    Trolls, I know your attention spans are somewhat less than a gnat, but the Rodent politicised the public service well before the present government came to power, or have you forgotten Godwin Grech?

  40. Perhaps the devious plot by the government in having the opposition’s policies costed is to try to introduce a thing called honesty into the misleading claims.

  41. A year is an extremely long time in politics.”

    Yes, so why is Swan wasting taxpayers money costing Opposition policies so far from the next election?? Perhaps Swan enjoys wasting money.

    And lets hope Campbell Newman can get Queensland’s massive debt under control. It is amazing, Shane told me that Costello paid off debt because he governed during a time of unforeseen prosperity. Well during this time of unforeseen prosperity Bligh/Beatty were racking up the debt.

  42. Neil of Sydney: you have no idea about Queensland government debt. It isn’t massive. It is under control. And the Newman Government will return to surplus the same year the Bligh Government would have. The cuts have nothing to do with debt and everything to do with paying for election promises. Even if you think the debt is massive and needs to be controlled, Newman isn’t attempting to do that.
    And it’s pretty standard for governments to cost opposition policies. It’s one of the benefits of incumbency.

  43. And it’s pretty standard for governments to cost opposition policies

    Really?? Seems like a total waste of money with the election so far away and world economic conditions could change any costings.

    Sounds like it was done for political purposes rather than for honest purposes.

  44. As Treasury has assessed the situation, the opposition should be using this as an opportunity to take a hard look at the implications of several policies. *choke, choke*, of course not..

  45. Neil, we are talking about politics. What action does Mr. Abbott take that is not about politics.

    Why is it so strange, that politicians act like politicians.

  46. Yes, I want the treasury to waste money, costing all policies put forward by all parties.

    I would like them to go further, but I know it will not happen, to point out what effect these policies will have on the economy.

  47. Neil, I believe the polls are a waste of money for the same reason.

    Costing policies have little to do with being so far from an election. I would expect the assessments of cost would be the same in twelve months down the track.

    I assume that assessments would be made of any change if further policies impacted on what is announced.

    Polls are only recording a moment in time.

    Yes, I believe the PS is there to serve us, not the politicians.

  48. The people of Australia have every right to understand the impact of policies proposed by politicians. Governments have been using this kind of tactic for a long time: it’s part of the reason why Opposition’s are reluctant to release policies so far out from an election.
    I wonder how much analysis it would actually require: costing two of the three policies would basically involve working out how much the Government’s policy costs, and the third is the parental leave scheme – a policy which the Coalition has probably provided the most detail for. We’ve probably spent longer discussing it than it did to do the analysis.
    Get Treasury to cost the Opposition’s policy, release the bits that embarrass the Opposition, and the rest can’t be made public. It doesn’t matter how far away an election is or that world economic factors may change: the fact is the Coalition is committed to policies that will take money from small business to pay for its ineffective and inefficient Direct Action policy, paying polluters to reduce pollution.
    Forget the numbers or debating whether the Government should be doing this sort of thing: the Coalition’s policies are bad for business.

  49. I always enjoy the argument. I note that he hasn’t replied to what I said about Queensland debt. I hope one day someone will run out of BS to say.

  50. scaper

    I agree the coalition will more than likely win the next election, however with 60% of voters polled preferring Malcolm Turnbull over Tony Abbott and the majority of Liberal voters polled now preferring Turnbull, your blindness to the silent majority of voters of both parties and their desire to have an opposition leader who is not so angry, aggressive, negative and can actually agree at times is obvoius. Peopl are now seeing votes against policy for political point scoring given the actual policy is part of the coalition platform ( foreign investment and deregulation of the wheat board to name a couple). People are growing tired of negativity and hate, of revenge and partisan bitterness, of hysteria and lies. The polls showing voters prefer Turnbull and Rudd display this. Just because the coalition will win the next election does not mean people like Tony Abbot, (or even his proposed policies) they actually dislike him intensely. The problem for the ALP is that they dislike Julia for stabbing Rudd and that wont go away in less than 12 months.

  51. “The problem for the ALP is that they dislike Julia for stabbing Rudd and that wont go away in less than 12 months”

    There is a lot more that voters don’t like about Gillard than the “stabbing of rudd”

  52. Shane, I agree.

    I’ll go one step further and suggest that the dislike for Tony Abbott in the electorate will be converted into more votes for Labor when it comes to the crunch.

  53. Migs

    I agree it will translate into votes for the ALP but I think via preferences. I also think it will not be enough to save the ALP.

    Treemans deafening silence to my continual questioning in relation to being of the Walrus/Jaws alias IMO screams yes and as such I will never respond to any commnents this alias makes on Cafe Whispers from here on in.

  54. Miglo
    Equally Gillard might wish she had the popularity levels of Krudd.

    Shane…rambling on about jaws and walrus….wtf are you on about?

  55. WAYNE Swan’s office has outed itself as the source of Treasury modelling on Coalition policies that it used to make a political point….

    http://www.theaustralian.com.au/national-affairs/wayne-swans-office-admits-to-leak-of-treasury-costings-of-coalition-policies/story-fn59niix-1226511391054

    “Fairfax said the modelling was undertaken “as Treasury attempts to come to grips with a suite of Coalition policies”. But it is understood the work was commissioned by the Treasurer’s office…

    Wayne Swan exercising his right to second guess what the Abbott Abbottt Abbott is up to!

  56. Catching Up

    I’ve just read through all the articles that you linked above to damn Costello. The only damning has been done by two people Walker and Quiggin doing a bit of grandstanding for the QCU and the links you have provided are to the same two articles they wrote.

    http://www.brisbanetimes.com.au/queensland/costello-hits-back-at-audit-critics-20120907-25i0a.html

    Mr Costello and his two fellow commissioners, Professor Sandra Harding and Dr Doug McTaggart, issued a statement this afternoon defending their June interim report.
    They said the document prepared for the QCU made no substantive findings against either the methodology or conclusions of the June report.
    ‘‘Walker and Walker criticise audits going back to the 1980s and 1990s and conclude with a polemic entitled ‘Dangers of ‘‘Audit’’ Commission Reports’ (p. xv-xvii) claiming they are ‘ideological’, ‘stunts’, ‘mischievous’ and cannot be trusted to ‘financially unskilled politicians’,’’ Mr Costello and his two commissioners said.
    ‘‘All these observations are political observations not the language of serious accounting analysis.’’
    Mr Costello and his two commissioners said the commission’s analysis of assets and liabilities was based on the key debt metrics used by international credit rating agencies, especially the net financial liabilities to revenue ratio.
    ‘‘Walker and Walker refer to the ‘relative triviality of interest expense on borrowing’ from the downgrading of Queensland’s credit rating,’’ they said.
    ‘‘The commission finds additional borrowing costs are $100 million per annum and are not trivial.’’
    Mr Costello and his two commissioners said to claim that employee expenses had remained stable as a proportion of total expenses over the past 10 years simply meant employee expenses were also increasing by 10.5 per cent a year.
    ‘‘The significant deterioration in Queensland’s financial position that is disputed by Walker and Walker was first identified almost three years ago not by the commission but by credit rating agencies when they chose to downgrade Queensland’s credit rating.
    ‘‘This has also been the judgement of international capital markets, in the form of higher borrowing costs for Queensland, than for all other states, including Tasmania.’’

    Read more: http://www.brisbanetimes.com.au/queensland/costello-hits-back-at-audit-critics-20120907-25i0a.html#ixzz2BPG7ZSm9

  57. Yes and Swan is almost certainly the person who leaked Coalition costings before the last election. If people recall after submitting their policies for costing the results were leaked and the Coalition got that accounting firm to do the rest of the costings because they could not trust Treasury with Swan in charge..

    Also Swan is almost certainly the one who got Treasury to model that Structural Deficit crap to try and trash Costello. Swan put the results in the 2009-10 budget papers. Latter work by Treasury showed a different result showing no or maybe a very small structural deficit but Swan does not publish this result. Megalogenis no longer talks about it because it has been shown to be in error.

  58. There were others at the time. He did not use conventional accountancy methods, No getting away from that.

    No work today,. Nothing else worthwhile doing. Does it gets tedious looking for gotcha moments.

    Conventional auditing would come up with a different answer.

    I am just saying, compare apple to apples, not apples with oranges.

    By the way, you are entitled to your own opinion. It is that I do not agree.

    Personally, I could not give a damn what you think. You are free to make up your own mind, as I am mine.

    WE COULD GO ON FOREVER COMIONG UP WITH TIT TO TAT REPLIES. WHAT WOULD THAT PROVE. MAYBE THERE IS NO RIGHT AND WRONG.

    Why are you so intense and have a need to be right all the time?

  59. Neil, I do not think the Swan has access to those figures.

    It is my belief that the opposition had more to gain by releasing them.

    They had already decided to have that fake audit done.

    I believe it was already underway. They needed an excuse not to lodge with Treasury.

    However they came to be revealed, the public has right to all information, so they can make an informed opinion.

    The wash out of that incident, was that the figures released by the Opposition were far from the truth and reality.

  60. Believe whatever you want to believe CU

    http://www.news.com.au/features/federal-election/coalition-demands-leak-source-be-found/story-e6frfllr-1225904018434

    FINANCE spokesman Andrew Robb says the Coalition will withhold 20 of its policies from Budget costings until the source of a leaked confidential Treasury analysis is investigated………………”If the leak has come from Treasury then it is in all likelihood a criminal offence,” Mr Robb said.”

    Federal Police were called in and they found the person who leaked the results had the right to do so. Now I wonder who that could be??

    Could it have been nasty Mr Swan??

  61. Update, they have found Abbott. He is wandering around the country in a daze chanting three word slogans aimlessly looking under all the policy voids for his credability. Last sighting was up around oxford street bondi junction near the roosters club…where the more palatable fiberals reside.

  62. If Mr. Robb said that, it must be the truth.

    Neil, maybe you can let me into the secret as to why we should believe Mr. Robb, or anyone from the Opposition for that matter.

  63. Neil, it is still true that they had decided not to use treasury before this happened. A week or so before in ,my memory is correct. Anyway, long before there was any leakage.

    Neil, maybe you can tell us what was so wrong, that the costings were released. Surely we have a right to know.

  64. Interest rates on hold, suggests that the RBA considers the economy is not as bad as portrayed by many.

  65. More likely the bumbling Mr Hockey or the deceitful Mr Robb”

    If this was so why did not the Federal Police charge Hockey and Robb for making a false complaint???

    It was Swan all right.

  66. Maybe they were too clever in hiding the evidence. Maybe the police felt the complaint was not serious enough for them to waste too much time on. Who knows.

    Maybe they could not find any evidence, as I believe they said happened.

    Maybe they thought it was just political, just like they used to investigate domestics, not taking them seriously.

  67. Tony has moved on from that great big disastrous so called carbon tax, to the NBNco. This is why Turnbull has been let off the leash.

    Have to agree with this article. The arguments against do remind one of the deniers.

    …..news Telecommunications analyst Paul Budde has accused the harshest critics of Labor’s flagship National Broadband Network project as being similar to “climate change deniers” in their irrational opposition to the project, arguing that such critics are given undue prominence in the media, despite representing less than five percent of the population.

    Over the past several years, Budde wrote today in a post on his blog, dozens of research papers and many articles in the press had been written about the NBN, But less than five percent of those participating in the NBN debate had argued that the NBN was a waste of money. “The five percent who are downright dismissive of the NBN are mostly politically motivated and are basing their opinion on the high cost involved,” he wrote, “and so they agree that we either should abandon the project or indeed look for the cheapest plumber in town.”

    “The disappointing thing about this last category is that it is widely reported by the press, who are always interested in dirt-digging, mud-slinging and strong language, in the same way that they give the > 5% minority group of climate change deniers far more attention than they deserve. Politicians and their supporters are seriously over-represented within the above two groups of naysayers – particularly those on the more conservative side of politics.”……………..

    http://delimiter.com.au/2012/11/06/nbn-critics-like-climate-deniers-says-budde/?utm_source=feedburner&utm_medium=feed&utm_campaign=Feed%3A+Delimiter+%28Delimiter%29

  68. …………These are all things, given the constant onward march of technology, which Australia will largely take for granted in a decade or so. But to get there, we’ll need much better infrastructure than we have right now. Despite that being a fact, it appears that many people just don’t understand these ideas; and so their comments about the NBN don’t add anything to the debate. When you disagree with the fundamental facts of a debate, it’s hard to have an intelligent conversation about it.

    And these sorts of commentators do remind me of climate change deniers (in fact, perhaps not coincidentally, many of the major NBN critics are also climate change deniers). Just as with the NBN, the evidence is on the side of climate change existing and being a human-created phenomenon. But to climate change deniers, the fact that the overwhelming weight of scientific evidence points towards the existence of the issue doesn’t matter. Just like the NBN…………………..

    http://delimiter.com.au/2012/11/06/nbn-critics-like-climate-deniers-says-budde/?utm_source=feedburner&utm_medium=feed&utm_campaign=Feed%3A+Delimiter+%28Delimiter%29

  69. CU
    The Federal Police found who did the leaking. In their statement they Police said the person who leaked the Coalition policies had the right to do so. If it was a leak from the PS that person would have been charged. If the leak was from the Coalition they would have been charged with making a false statement.

    It was Swan all right.

    The Coalition will never trust again a Treasury lead by Wayne Swan.

  70. Neil, once again, what was so wrong with the figures being release to the public?.

    Why could it have not been someone in Treasury? Why not someone in the Coalition?

  71. Hey Neil of Sydney… You sound a bit desperate there matey. Federal police and all. Abbott has no credability, hanging by a thread, not a credable policy in sight. The fiberals are so desperate they are resorting to lies about the NBN that are the laughing stock of the IT world. Fuck Pine and Hockey look so stupid its embarrassing.

  72. How old are you, Ricky! Obviously your political balls haven’t dropped yet as no opposition releases policies this far out from a federal election. Looking pretty pathetic…onya Ricky! Defending the politicisation of the public service? “Oh, but Howard did it” you would most probably say but that is no excuse to allow this mob to turn it into an art form.

  73. Neil and scaper, the only politicised public servant sprung by the Feds has been Godwin Grech, Liars Party stooge and the author of the infamous fake email, who confessed that the Rodent had thoroughly politicised the public service.

    Grech admitted that the Rodent had people just like him spying on their fellow employees.

    As usual, you’re dribbling shite. The mob with the track record for dodgy costings and lying about their release or leaking is the Nopposition.

    Everyone knows that any Nopposition policy would be as full of black costings holes as kindy kids’ knitting. In fact, the kids would have less holes than anything crafted (and I use that word very loosely) by Sloppy, Robb or the rest of that bunch of talentless hacks.

    And Neil, if the feds say that the person who ‘leaked” the policies and their costings had every right to do so, then they haven’t been leaked. The alleged “leaker’ hasn’t done anything illegal.

    So no evidence of a “politicised” public servant doing anything wrong, just more tosh from the usual suspects.

    Maybe you should take up alien watching. It couldn’t be any less fruitful than this non-storm in a thimble that’s got your knickers in a twist.

  74. How old are you, Ricky!…Old enough to remember all Howard s appointments and astute to see through the disgraceful politics of a party that has done more to irreversible damage the very fabric of Australian society for nothing more than neocon ideology. The liberal party noes nothing more than politicising the public service and punishing those who don’t take their shit…Godwyn Gretsch. I stand that the floposition is a vacuous policy void and Abbott is a stone faced fake.Two words…John Hewson

  75. The alleged “leaker’ hasn’t done anything illegal.”

    Exactly. Swan has not done anything illegal by leaking which is why no-one in the Coalition now trusts the totally politicised Treasury. It is also the reason the Coalition before the 2010 election stopped submitting their policies for costing and went to that accounting firm

    Old enough to remember all Howard s appointments and astute to see through the disgraceful politics of a party that has done more to irreversible damage the very fabric of Australian society for nothing more than neocon ideology

    Yeah right. Another deluded comment from a deluded leftoid.

  76. Remember when Gillard offered the opposition the resources of treasury to help with their costings (their excuse had been that they “couldn’t afford it”). Tony of course turned a whiter shade of pale thinking that he might have to produce something more substantial than a slogan…

  77. Name me one political party that hands over policies to be costed one year before the next election?? Do you remember what Labor did before the 2007 election??

    http://www.theage.com.au/news/federal-election-2007-news/late-policies-a-ploy-to-avoid-costing-costello/2007/11/22/1195321951582.html

    Peter Costello said yesterday that Labor leader Kevin Rudd had run “a very tricky little operation”. He released a detailed tally suggesting that Labor handed in just 20% of its policies to the Treasury and Finance department by the November 15 cut-off date.

    The Treasury and Finance website appeared to confirm that Labor submitted 32 policies before the deadline, with 132 released after the cut-off, including 104 that were handed in with three working days or less until the election.

    “By submitting 104 policies with three working days or less to the election, Labor knew they could either not be costed or, if they were, it would be too late for any critical analysis,” Mr Costello said.”

  78. “Defending the politicisation of the public service”

    Scaper, again and again you reveal your ignorance of how the public service works. All governments (State and Federal) ask their Treasuries to cost Opposition’s proposals/policies and do so on an ongoing basis. It comes with the territory.

    For someone who aspires to be a ‘lobbyist’. FGS. Who in their right mind would employ a complete dill?

    Why don’t you enrol in some educational program that will dissolve or at least modify your ignorance. Or perhaps talk to someone who has experience is such matters.

    Become a disciple not a desci …

    Sorry N. I edited the comment. Miglo.

  79. But Neil the Liberals put in legislation that Labor passed to stop that.

    What’s happening now is that the Liberals are reneging on their own legislation, the hypocrites.

    And what about your hypocritical stance in these matters.

    Because Labor does it it’s OK for the Liberals to do it, but when the shoe is on the other foot and the Liberals do it then it’s not OK for Labor to do it.

    It’s always been the case with the double standards and disingenuousness of the Liberals and their wingnut rusted ons, and will be forever thus.

  80. “And these sorts of commentators do remind me of climate change deniers (in fact, perhaps not coincidentally, many of the major NBN critics are also climate change deniers)”

    Hogwash, Delimiter’s been drinking again!

  81. What’s happening now is that the Liberals are reneging on their own legislation, the hypocrites.”

    How so?? The election is 12 months away.

    All governments (State and Federal) ask their Treasuries to cost Opposition’s proposals/policies and do so on an ongoing basis.

    http://www.theaustralian.com.au/national-affairs/treasury/treasury-tainted-by-wayne-swan-leak-as-coalition-says-advice-was-compromised/story-fn59nsif-1226511833841

    WAYNE Swan has been accused of politically compromising Treasury and undermining the effectiveness of its advice after his office leaked an analysis of opposition tax policies.

    Former Treasury secretary Ted Evans said while it was open to governments to ask the department to cost opposition policies, “certainly I cannot recall an occasion of them ever being misused, which seems to have happened on this occasion” ………………Mr Evans, who retired as Treasury secretary in 2001, having served under John Dawkins, Ralph Willis and Peter Costello as head of the department, said while his memory was unclear, he could not recall being asked by government to cost an opposition policy.”

  82. “IN an interview with women’s magazine Marie Claire on sale today, Julia Gillard says her dream job outside politics is global philanthropist. Like so much of what the Prime Minister says, it sounds damn good but what it really means is far from clear.
    This disconnect between rhetoric and reality segues into a deeper problem facing modern politics. Sounding good is too often used as a cheap and easy substitute for the harder yards of doing good.”

    http://www.theaustralian.com.au/opinion/columnists/the-perils-of-the-prime-ministers-feminist-fantasies/story-e6frg7bo-1226511758423

    “One would think serious accusations of sexism and misogyny required serious evidence. Instead, Gillard conducted a most superficial show trial during her parliamentary attack before finding Abbott guilty. If Gillard can get away with producing no real evidence, why would other women bother when making similar accusations?”

    Isn’t that exactly what’s been happening here? A bunch of women and womanly men lauding a misandrist!

  83. Bacchus

    Did you read the date??

    The Labor Party showed complete contempt for the Charter of Budget Honesty. Of Labor’s 165 costing requests, only 32 were submitted after the deadline, which is why some 44 of Labor’s commitments remain uncosted with the election due tomorrow.

    This, along with other omissions, leaves substantial doubt about the veracity of Labor’s numbers.

    MELBOURNE

    23 November 2007

    I was also basing my statements on what Ted Evans said. I am guessing just before the election under the Charter of Budget Honesty the Opposition Party will have their policies costed. I guess the results will then be published. What seems to bother both sides is leaks.

    I guess Costello was commenting on the few ALP polices that had been submitted. I actually do not know the full policy. I am guessing the results of policy costings are released just before the election under the Charter of Budget Honesty.

  84. Spin your BS all you like Neil – FACT is, this is now SOP for any government. The advantage of incumbency, perfected by your heroes during their last disastrous time in government.

  85. Bacchus. Costello went to court and won as not in the public interest to have his budget figures as compared to actual outlay made public.

    This came about when a reporter through FOI found out that the Howard government was short changing budget items but still claiming they had spent the full amount in bragging.

  86. They’re not interested in facts, only spin, Bacchus. That’s all they’ve got – spin and deceit. LIEberals.

  87. Spin your BS all you like Neil – FACT is, this is now SOP for any government.”

    What spin Bacchus?? Under the CBH Oppositions submit their policies for costing. I do not know the full policy but I guess the results would be published otherwise why submit them. Your link was dated 23/11/07 and Treasury was costing policies which the ALP themselves had submitted for costing.

    I am assuming the results would be released otherwise why submit them. I am also going on what Ted Evans said in the link I provided.

  88. Seeing as the talk has returned to honesty or lack thereof in political life, I thought it appropriate to repost my poem here.

    Tony Abbott, the libs and the truth.

    When Tony Abbott.. and his libs
    Say Julia Gillard.. lies
    They are showing.. their hypocrisy
    As they spout.. THEIR porky.. pies
    About a price.. on carbon… that they’ve called
    The PM’s.. toxic tax
    While dismissing.. all the experts
    And ignoring.. all the facts

    Claiming massive rises… in the price
    Of everything… we buy
    But he’s contradicted.. by the facts
    And his arguments.. just won’t fly
    And his cohorts think… that lies become truth
    If they’re often enough.. repeated
    But it’s their credibility.. not the ALP
    That.. by their lies.. will be defeated

    The lies they’ve told.. are big and bold
    Seeking to.. rewrite…. History
    For the sake of Abbotts.. grand ambition
    Based on inherent… stupidity
    Saying.. poor Wyalla’s.. gunna go
    She’ll be wiped.. right off.. the map
    Proving yet again… the man’s insane
    And full of naught.. but crap

    And his wrecking ball.. had a nasty fall
    Landing squarely… on his toe
    After missing… the.. economy
    And rolling…. sloppy Joe
    Who was never good with figures
    But a wrecking ball…is he
    Spreading lies.. and misinformation
    about the oz economy

    Then there’s the tech head.. Malcolm Turnbull
    Spreading… more of Abbotts lies
    Claiming.. fibre to the node.. is the way for us
    Proving… on him…. there are no flies
    As when it comes… to his own.. investments
    Fibre to the home.. is the way to go
    But when it comes to giving us… the best
    The Abbott just says… NO

    And the rest of Abbotts mendacious mates
    Make up…. his motley crew
    Of sloganeers and… farting heads
    They’re dishonest through and through
    With his deputy.. the Bishop
    Searching constantly… for proof
    That her sour looks… are justified
    Cos she’s been.. violated… by the truth

    And he plots and schemes to fulfil his dreams
    Of his perfect… Liberal state
    Based on Howards.. worn out policies
    His mentor… and his mate
    But the world’s moved on.. without him
    And the Liberals… fractured parts
    Leaving a monstrous policy vacuum
    And the Abbotts stale… brain farts

    He’ll promise us… a banquet
    But all that’s on…. his plate
    Is his pugilistic nature…
    And his body… builders.. gait
    With his numbers falling weekly
    And his credibility… shot
    And the murmurings of descent
    Amongst.. the lying.. liberal.. lot

    But the right wing.. power brokers
    Still think Abbott… is their man
    Pushing spin and propaganda
    Just because… the bastards can
    But he’s not a leaders… arsehole
    He is just… a right wing.. thug
    With the body… of an old.. athlete
    And the brainpower… of a slug

    And despite support from… billionaires
    And mates… like Alan… Jones
    The Abbotts time… is nearly done
    With no meat.. left…… only bones
    And the history books will tell the tale
    Of an election…. his to take
    But he lost… because.. all… the people saw
    Was a…. monumental…. fake

    and this is just a snapshot, with a bit of research there could have been another twenty or more verses.

    The only time the Libs don’t lie is when their mouths are shut, and then they’re thinking about the next round 👿 👿

  89. I am assuming the results would be released otherwise why submit them. I am also going on what Ted Evans said in the link I provided.

    And ignoring all the other evidence I have provided 🙄

  90. http://www.petercostello.com.au/press/2007/3008-costing-blunder-400-million-reasons-why-labor-can-t-be-trusted-on-the-economy

    Actually your link is interesting.

    Finance has not ticked off on the accounting treatment for Labor’s $4.7 billion broadband policy – under which it is claimed that the $4.7 billion spend has no Budget impact.

    This was one of the big vision projects which helped Labor win the 2007 election. The NBN was going to cost $4.7B and be finished in 5 years which means they should be wrapping up the project this year.

    Shows the ALP is capable of fooling a lot of people.

  91. Yes, the Opposition and their followers do indeed have troubles with experts.

    We find this in all fields they make comments. They know more than those who make their life work in stopping the boats.

    When it comes to climate change, only they know and have put forward their Direct Action, which only they believe will work.

    Then they have been denigrating the Treasury for the last few years. Do not like the way they add up.

    They, and only they have the answers for increasing productivity. Easy, all one needs to do is take away workers’ rights, and the economy will flourish.

    The greatest one where they deny the science is when they talk about Broadband. The experts are wrong, when they say, hacking fibre onto ca\rapped out copper wire will not deliver. Wireless, according to the scientist does not do, what Abbott and Co claim. They are only experts, what would they know.

    Then we have the proposition, we should ignore 97% of the worlds scientist, when we look at man made climate change, and take on board the 3% who disagree.

    Yes, there is no place for experts in Abbott”s world.

    Another area that Abbott is in dispute with the experts, is that he cannot pull a DD or early elections at will. Even if he could, the results are likely not to be what he is claiming he can do. It will be a long time in the future, even if all went his way, he would have control of the Senate. The ruled just do not allow this to occur.

    The last is his claim he can stop the boats. Experts once again disagree.

  92. Min, thanks for that, I always value your opinion. 😀

    CU, yes, if you couldn’t see them, just listened to them you would swear they are all teenagers.
    Like the old bumper sticker says… “Employ a Teenager (Insert Lieberal) NOW while they know EVERYTHING” 😉

    Cheers 😆 😆 😆

    BTW hows Migs? Hope he is feeling better! 😀

  93. Cu, that’s interesting about Abbott and experts..why can Abbott never muster any to support his policies and opinions..that is, unless you count Alan Jones. 🙄

  94. Min, I do not believe there is one policy or whatever ones calls what he promotes, that has the support of any expert. Now I could be wrong, and I am sure our visitors will put me right, after putting me down, telling me I should not pick on Tony.

  95. Min, please pass on my best wishes for a speedy recovery.
    He is one of the shining lights breaking through and helping to force back the long, dark and cold political and economic winter that awaits if Abbott has his way in this great country.

    Bloody Yanks, got to do everything bigger and better. 🙄

    Keep your chin up… He, like us, will prevail!

    Cheers 😀

  96. CU, even after the GFC when all the informed commentators said that their policy direction would have taken us down the same road as NZ and much of Europe to some degree, and the evidence is in that we out performed the bulk of the developed world, they still bleat about the cost of keeping people in jobs and the stimulus package ( that was applauded around the world), and that their ideas would have worked better… Talk about delusional.

    And then they make the ludicrous claim that they will always manage the economy better… they just conveniently leave off the part that clarifies “for them and their rich mates” 👿 LIARS

    Cheers

  97. Another is the deregulating of wheat sales. They even ignore the experts in the party on this one.

    Seem to do the same with the Murray River and the formation of more marine parks. The list goes on and on.

  98. Thanks MIG. Deluded Leftie? Well Truth is a bitch of a thing for neocon fiberals to deal with. It derails the lie line. So if a little history rattles the Howard (arguebly Australias worst economic manager as treasurer) fanboy club, then so be it. As was so rightly pointed out, the treasurey was offered for costing gratis, seems to be a great thing for voters, however telling for fiberals. if anybody is in any doubt of why the fiberals should be forthcoming look at NSW and QLD. I stand by my comments. Fiberals do not govern for the whole of society. Consider work choices, consider the attack on the public service jobs in both states. Consider the cuts to hospitals and TAFE. Liberals and economic management? Well the the Liberals of NSW seem to have demonstrated that when they lost a billion under the couch. Newman demonstrated that with a Costello style audit. In both cases the outcomes are punishing public servants. So slag me all you want, the figures and actions are irrefutable and for the Fiberals, inconvenient.

  99. Cuppa, yes you would certainly rather have him on your side than against you.

    I think it speaks volume that whenever the Libs are confronted with truth or facts, they don’t address them, they just jeer, pull faces and dismiss out of hand.

    covered somewhat in the line;

    With his deputy.. the Bishop
    Searching constantly… for proof
    That her sour looks… are justified
    Cos she’s been.. violated… by the truth

    Sadly it’s more truth than satire. 🙄

    Cheers

  100. Neil of Disneyland….. The NBN will be (finished and wrapped up) in 5 years. I love it when the luddites dip a toe in technology and embarrass themselves. Like Pinoclean and Hokey Poky maybe you would like a fact before dribbling. Networks are “commissioned”, they are never finished, the evolve and expand. The NBN is up and about to enter the expansion phase. I know infrastructure is a dirty word to you Liberals, fiberals are nowhere on technology its beyond the feebleness of vision unless they can attach it to a headline for political advantage.

  101. As far as Tony heading south is concerned, we can only hope that he would take sloppy Joe with him.
    I just saw an interview on the treasury costings which prompted this.

    Sloppy Joe

    Cocky Hockey… or sloppy Joe
    Call him… what you like
    The man talks only lies and spin
    And should be told.. get on your bike

    His economic creds… are shot
    The man’s… a total knob
    And rubbish is.. the only thing
    That dribbles… from his… gob

    To give him keys…. to treasury
    Would be… a huge… mistake
    Cos like his leader?…. Abbott
    He’s a… monumental… FAKE 👿 👿 👿

    Cheers

  102. The NBN is up and about to enter the expansion phase

    I just looked out the window and I saw a pig fly past.

    Ah Neil – divert, deflect & obfuscate. Has it ever been any different

    ??? I have been commenting on the first link you posted. You know the one Costello posted on the 23/11/2007, the day before the Federal election.

    So Labor did not submit most of their policies for costing before the 2007 hey?? Please do not be surprised by if a take with a grain of salt calls by ALP supporters that we should be more honest with Opposition costings.

  103. I have been commenting on the first link you posted.

    And completely ignoring everything else posted – I wonder why that might be? 🙄

    CU, RP, Cuppa, Min and especially TS with his excellent poem have covered the Lieberals’ mendacity really well…

  104. Neil, like it or not, the NBN is past the tipping point. I would expect an outcry from business if Abbott was stupid enough to touch this one. Harte to think what would happen to the young vote. They know full well the value of it. So do all the experts in the field.

    In fact I would expect similar action if any effort was made to undo the GEF legalization as well.

    As for the MRRY, this only applies to a handful of miners.

    Neil, at the end of the day, business will go for stability every time.

    ‘They will want to move on, as undoing any of it, is not worth the effort.

    We will be back to the 1980’s and election instability, while the system is brought back into sync. Menzies was the culprit last time.

  105. Neil, they did not submit, mainly because it was set up to make Labor look bad. That is why the Coalition would go no where near it.

    I do not know what it is about the Libs that they set up traps for Labor, without acknowledging they might not be in power for ever.

    It was Liberal party legislation that the Coalition refused to honour.

    The truth is that the Coalition is once more wedge, and will have to submit to the new body. The PM has given Hockey all he wanted with this new body..
    .

  106. And completely ignoring everything else posted – I wonder why that might be?”

    Bacchus I am a busy man. Your first link was supposed to show Costello doing something wrong because he published Opposition costings. All Costello was doing is his job. They are supposed to be published surely?? It was one day before the 2007 election. Are you saying that Opposition policies costed by Treasury before the election should not have the results published?? Interesting to see the ALP did not submit most of their policies for costing before the 2007 election. I will never take seriously comments by ALP supporters that we need all the information on Opposition policies since Labor did not submit most of their policies before they won govt.

    If I have time I will look at the other two.

  107. I feel like a sneeze after that Neil…

    bull, bull, bull, bullship!

    If the legislation was so good Neil, why didn’t the Lieberals submit all their costings last time? Rhetorical question Neil – we know your deluded view. Quite simply it was because they knew they’d set the legislation up to discredit Labor in 2007 without thinking of what would happen when they lost government.

    To overcome this, they had to manufacture a reason not to have Treasury do their costings, by leaking a few of their own policy costings, so they could have a sham “audit” done by a friendly accountancy firm – that worked really well 🙄

  108. I thought one put up a post, and followed it to wherever it goes.

    It is what it develops into, that makes it interesting. I thought all trolls understood this, as that is their modus operandi. Their only agenda is to wreck the thread.

  109. If the legislation was so good Neil, why didn’t the Lieberals submit all their costings last time?”

    They started to until Wayne Swan leaked the data. No early leaks the policies would have been costed.

    Quite simply it was because they knew they’d set the legislation up to discredit Labor in 2007 without thinking of what would happen when they lost government.”

    You really think they are that stupid??

    by leaking a few of their own policy costings

    They would have been charged by the Federal Police for making a false declaration if that was true. Swan was the leaker we all know it.

  110. Thanks Bacchus. There was no gain in Labor releasing anything, especially something they did not have access to.

  111. The cost of Lieberal “policies’ will be in reduced pay and conditions, and abolished job security, for millions of employees under SERFchoices.

  112. Neil, they leaked it, because they needed an excuse not to lodge anymore. They needed an excuse to use that accountancy firm they had set up earlier for costs.

    Neil, there were problems with the numbers. Did not add up.

    This was proven after the elections when the independents demanded costings before that made their decision, as to who they would support.

    This was proven when the firm they hired was found guilty because of the job they did.

    Neil, none of this is made up.

    There was a huge holes in the figures.

  113. Neil of Disneyland: I just looked out the window and I saw a pig fly past.

    As a gesture to help you with that ignorant obstinance, here is a map of where the pigs have landed in the phase one.
    http://www.nbnco.com.au/rollout/rollout-map.html?icid=pub:rollout:1yr:bod:map-lp.

    You may like to note the word “Stage”. That’s a term we technical folk use when commissioning a network of this magnitude. You may pay special attention to the special attention to “telstra”, remember them, the national carrier that the Luddite Fiberals seemed so intent on selling. I don’t see the market forces of Vodafail (just announced slashing jobs) or Optus (Singtel) in any of the bush area’s…hmm not much force in that free market economy.They instead have decide to migrate clients to the NBN.

    This is a particular area of my expertise, so as Julia offered treasury gratuitously to the Fiberals I would be more than happy to point you to a few facts and steer you back into 2012 so you can look forward.

    Link to ludite lies:
    http://delimiter.com.au/2012/11/04/pyne-wont-retract-false-100mbps-nbn-claim/

  114. Bacchus, thanks for that kind remark on my musing, and I think you have covered pretty much the rest on this topic.
    Trolls are sounding more and more frustrated and repetitious… facts? ….What facts? 😆 😆

    Cheers 😀 🙄 😀

  115. Appears the Teaparty has been a problem for the Republicans.

    Maybe that type of politics has run its course.

    Read the other day that many religious groups are moving away from the Tea Party.

    One can only hope that is true.

    The democrats keep the senate. Still a deeply divided country.

    Wonder if the Republicans will keep up their spoiler role, as the coalition does here.

  116. The Teaparty loses but still sees it as a win, therefore will not work with Obama.

    Maybe they need to reassess the situation. This is not a narrow win, as predicted.

  117. The Secretary to the Treasury, Dr Martin Parkinson PSM, has responded to concerns raised by the Shadow Treasurer and Member for North Sydney, the Hon Joe Hockey MP.

    As you know from your own time as a senior Minister, the Australian Public Service serves the people of Australia through the Government of the day, irrespective of which political party or parties form that government. Accordingly, it is imperative that departments, such as Treasury, and individual public servants are apolitical and professional both in substance and in how the public perceives the way they undertake their duties. Without this, public faith in the institutions risks being undermined, which damages their effectiveness and ultimately undermines the pursuit of good policy, all to the detriment of the wellbeing of the Australian people.

    It has long been the case that Treasury is periodically asked by the Government of the day to cost or analyse alternative policies, some of which are already in the public domain. These can include policies proposed by stakeholders or by non-government political parties. In such cases, we draw, to the maximum extent possible, on publicly available information, in part due to the confidentiality we observe in responding to requests from Ministers.

    On the occasion to which your letter refers, the Treasury provided advice to the Deputy Prime Minister and Treasurer at the request of his Office on several specific policies. As is always our practice, the Treasury did not provide the advice or the underlying analysis to anyone outside of Government.

    As outlined in my letter of 25 September 2012 to the Australian Public Service Commissioner, adherence to the Australian Public Service values outlined in the Australian Public Service Act is a central element of Treasury’s internal culture. Accordingly, any suggestion that we would be complicit in questionable practices is without foundation.

    http://treasury.gov.au/About-Treasury/OurDepartment/News/response-to-concerns

  118. Bacchus, that is telling it as it is.

    I wonder if Mr. Hockey realizes, they are using the Treasury and other departments politically..

    One only has to listen to Senate hearings, on most subjects.

    The Opposition questioning is always of a political nature.

    They also treat the PS, including department heads disgracefully.

    The abuse these senators dish out, to people who cannot defend themselves is shocking.

    Yes, Neil, if you do not believe me, listen in.

  119. Pingback: URL

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