Tony Abbott versus the Universe

It’s not unusual for a politician to stand against, rather than for something. John Howard’s dismissal of climate change (until he reckoned there were a few votes in it) and Julia Gillard’s opposition to gay marriage are a couple of recent stand outs. Taking a stand against a popular issue is not a crime, however, even if it does go against public opinion.

But in Tony Abbott we have an unusual case. He is against every social, environmental and economic reform imaginable. I cannot think of anything in the known universe he might agree with.

Let’s hear what he has to say about these issues, some of which you may of course agree with.

Same-sex marriage: Mr Abbott has said marriage is between a man and a woman not just to fulfill their own personal happiness ”but because we have obligations to the children that come with families”.

Homosexuality: Federal Opposition leader Tony Abbott has defended comments he made about homosexuality on 60 Minutes, saying gays and lesbians “challenge” the order of things.

Mr Abbott said he felt “threatened” by homosexuality on Sunday night’s program, a comment that has angered the gay and lesbian community and something he tried to back track from during an interview on the ABC last night.

“There is no doubt that it (homosexuality) challenges, if you like, orthodox notions of the right order of things” Mr Abbott told Lateline.

Abortion: Christians aren’t required to right every wrong in the political arena, but they can help change the nation’s culture, suggests Tony Abbott DESPITE the debt that political institutions owe to the West’s Christian heritage, there is the constant claim that Christians in politics are confused about the separation of church and state. There’s also a tendency among Christians in the community to think that Christians in politics have to sell out their principles in order to survive. Christian politicians are often warding off simultaneous accusations that they are zealots or fakes. Indeed, the public caricature of a Christian politician is hypocrite or wuss, in denial about the ruthlessness and expediency necessary to wield power, or too sanctimonious to be effective. Take the challenge of abortion. The problem with the Australian practice of abortion is that an objectively grave matter has been reduced to a question of the mother’s convenience.

Boat people: Tony Abbott yesterday claimed boatpeople were acting in an un-Christian manner.

Euthanasia: Legalising euthanasia in Australia would put elderly people at risk of being “bumped off”, federal Health Minister Tony Abbott has warned, after an Australian man travelled to Switzerland to legally end his life.

The needy: “We can’t abolish poverty because poverty in part is a function of individual behaviour”.

Women’s rights: Tony Abbott warns women against sex before marriage. And how about this brain fart: “I think it would be folly to expect that women will ever dominate or even approach equal representation in a large number of areas simply because their aptitudes, abilities and interests are different for physiological reasons”.

Recognition of Indigenous culture: ‘Western civilisation came to this country in 1788 and I’m proud of that . . . Aboriginal people have much to celebrate in this country’s British Heritage’.

Climate change: As a climate denier, Tony Abbott is most famous for his statement that climate science is “absolute crap“. However, that’s just the tip of the iceberg – he actually has a long history of denying climate change science. “The fact that we have had if anything cooling global temperatures over the last decade, not withstanding continued dramatic increases of carbon dioxide emissions, suggests the role of CO2 is not nearly as clear as the climate catastrophists suggest.”

Technology: “There is no way on God’s earth that we need to be spending $50 billion plus of borrowed money on what is going to turn out to be a telecommunications white elephant – school halls on steroids.”

Foreign investment: Tony Abbott made headlines recently when during a visit to China, he declared that “it would rarely be in Australia’s national interest to allow a foreign government or its agencies to control an Australian business”.

In other words: foreign direct investment by such entities would not be welcome.

Divorce: Liberal Party frontbencher Tony Abbott wants laws toughened up to make divorce harder. The opposition families and Aboriginal affairs spokesman has called for a return to the fault-based system of divorce discarded in 1975, which was replaced by a “no-fault” system. Mr Abbott’s plan, outlined in his soon-to-be released book Battlelines, would see a grounds for divorce reintroduced, including adultery, cruelty, habitual drunkenness and imprisonment.
It would be similar to the defunct Matrimonial Causes Act.

He certainly is a unique little package, isn’t he? But with such a suite of archaic views he belongs in a museum, not politics.

Here’s a photo of him preparing to take on the universe.

English: Tony Abbott

(Photo credit: Wikipedia)

298 comments on “Tony Abbott versus the Universe

  1. 😆 😆 😆 He will twist it around so no one will understand anything, only he himself will understand it, but then again he could just agree to everything in a way that no one will agree, or that blah blah blah

  2. To tell the truth he will probably go through every point and tell you where you went wrong, then criticise every person for making a comment on how that comment was wrong because there is no such thing as AGW or Climate change or what ever he is BLAH BAH BLAH

  3. Abbott and co are not against foreign investment, as long as it comes from the mother country. It appears that it is the reds under the bed they are afraid.

  4. As for divorce, probably wants to bring back the husbands right to flog his spouse, as long as he uses a rod the thickness of, I believe thumb. Some men have thick thumbs.

    As for marriage, I am sure that it should not be between mixed faith or race.

  5. and turn around and tell us we are stupid because we do not comprehend the wonderful words, he has spent so long compiling.

  6. Although Abbott is defined mostly by what he is against (is he pro-monarchy or anti-republic?) I don’t think that’s unusual for conservatives, particularly in this country.
    To paraphrase Rudd, the conservative parties have never had a positive agenda of reform. Howard’s great reforms are gun control, the GST, and (from a Tory perspective) WorkChoices. Twelve years and that’s pretty much it. Compare that to the Rudd-Gillard or Hawke-Keating governments. Always reactionary, never a positive agenda. With the exception of Fraser and Turnbull, Liberal leaders don’t imagine Australia as a better place, but seek to return to some idealised golden age.

  7. What gets me about Abbott’s negativity and standing for nothing but against everything is that he also stands against those things he’s for.

    I think for the first time in frontline Australian politics we have an opposition leader and opposition that vote against their own policies and beliefs for the sole reason it’s not them implementing them. So there is the ludicrousness of Abbott demanding the government do something his way, and when the government does it he stands against it.

    There is no doubt whatsoever he is the most negative politician and by an enormous way the most negative leader this country, and probably the world, has seen. The Negabore label was apt for him but now that doesn’t encompass his exhibitionistic negativity anymore, and it was upgraded to Super Negabore, but even that doesn’t get close to describing his deeply entrenched negativity.

    Abbott is now his own word for supreme negativity.

    The moment you hear the name Abbott you think negative. The name Abbott and negativity have irreversibly become synonymous, and it’s his fault.

    Remember a little while back when on the back of a string of criticisms about his negativity he promised he would be more positive, that lasted all of a week and he became even more negative.

    That illustrates how ingrained his negativity is and how he will never change away from it, he knows no other way.

  8. Abbott and Boswell would make a lovely couple with their backward views. I can just see them together tripping down the isle. Same sex marriage would suit them perfectly the backward thinking bigots. Bossies little diatribe this morning just shows him up for the shameful turd he is.

  9. Pingback: “Tony Abbott versus the Universe”, the remix | Iain Hall's SANDPIT

  10. posted this at may blog but to save you lot form having to go there I repost it here as a comment
    In the comments of this post Miglo was curious about my reaction to his critique of Tony Abbott’s position on a grab bag of social issues well I wrote out a long comment answering each point in turn only to have it disappear into the either when I tried to use it as a comment to a re-blog here at the Sandpit So this is “take two” and hopefully this one will not disappear…
    So without further adieu I will go through the points in turn

    Same-sex marriage: Mr Abbott has said marriage is between a man and a woman not just to fulfil their own personal happiness ”but because we have obligations to the children that come with families”.

    I see no reason to fault Abbott on this position as marriage is much more about the children that it is about social affirmation for homosexuality

    Homosexuality: Federal Opposition leader Tony Abbott has defended comments he made about homosexuality on 60 Minutes, saying gays and lesbians “challenge” the order of things.
    Mr Abbott said he felt “threatened” by homosexuality on Sunday night’s program, a comment that has angered the gay and lesbian community and something he tried to back track from during an interview on the ABC last night.
    “There is no doubt that it (homosexuality) challenges, if you like, orthodox notions of the right order of things” Mr Abbott told Lateline.

    At the risk of being howled down as a homophobe I tend to think that homosexuality is against the natural order of things and it serves no biological purpose (given the simple fact that such pairings must be sterile) that said I am a realist who thinks that what consenting adults do in private is entirely their own business and the law and society should not penalise them for their choice of partner(s).

    Abortion: Christians aren’t required to right every wrong in the political arena, but they can help change the nation’s culture, suggests Tony Abbott DESPITE the debt that political institutions owe to the West’s Christian heritage, there is the constant claim that Christians in politics are confused about the separation of church and state. There’s also a tendency among Christians in the community to think that Christians in politics have to sell out their principles in order to survive. Christian politicians are often warding off simultaneous accusations that they are zealots or fakes. Indeed, the public caricature of a Christian politician is hypocrite or wuss, in denial about the ruthlessness and expediency necessary to wield power, or too sanctimonious to be effective. Take the challenge of abortion. The problem with the Australian practice of abortion is that an objectively grave matter has been reduced to a question of the mother’s convenience.

    Abortion is the classic example of competing moral imperatives and the simple fact is that those competing imperatives each have different levels of validity depending upon the stage of gestation. Thus very early on its easier to argue that a women’s bodily integrity and autonomy should give her unfettered rights to terminate an unborn child the longer that the gestation endures the greater the argument for the protection of the unborn from arbitrary execution becomes. Anyone who does not realise this is essentially a sociopath who is ruled by a dark and vicious feminist ideology.

    Boat people: Tony Abbott yesterday claimed boatpeople were acting in an un-Christian manner.

    Given the fact atht most of these mendicants are not in fact Christian then what is contentious about this observation

    Euthanasia: Legalising euthanasia in Australia would put elderly people at risk of being “bumped off”, federal Health Minister Tony Abbott has warned, after an Australian man travelled to Switzerland to legally end his life.

    Killing oneself is not rocket science and you really don’t need much more than simple things that are common around the house, nor is suicide actually a crime. But there are lots of downsides to making it easy for doctors to assist. In extreme circumstances if there is a legal cost to “helping” some one end their lives then it is a small sacrifice that should be paid to prevent malicious pressure on the unwell.

    The needy: “We can’t abolish poverty because poverty in part is a function of individual behaviour”.

    Contrary to leftist ideology the reality is precisely as Tony Abbott observes here some people just can not be saved from themselves no matter how much money you throw at their problems.

    Women’s rights: Tony Abbott warns women against sex before marriage. And how about this brain fart: “I think it would be folly to expect that women will ever dominate or even approach equal representation in a large number of areas simply because their aptitudes, abilities and interests are different for physiological reasons”.

    Is promiscuity really such a good thing for anyone in society? The left seem to believe that sexual intercourse is something akin to a contact sport that is little different to any other amateur sport. However this ignores its true purpose which is to propagate the species and to provide the glue that cement the pair bonds that are foundational to raising subsequent generations. As for the difference in aptitudes of men and women in different roles and professions only a fool denies that there are differences but the other side of that coin is to have a society that allows and appreciates those who want to step outside the usual gender expectations.

    Recognition of Indigenous culture: ‘Western civilisation came to this country in 1788 and I’m proud of that . . . Aboriginal people have much to celebrate in this country’s British Heritage’.

    Compare and contrast the sort of colonial experience that this country benefits from with the sort of colonial experience under different European colonial regimes and its clear that we would be a lesser nation under the French, the Dutch, Spanish or the Portuguese. So Abbott is spot on here.

    Climate change: As a climate denier, Tony Abbott is most famous for his statement that climate science is “absolute crap“. However, that’s just the tip of the iceberg – he actually has a long history of denying climate change science. “The fact that we have had if anything cooling global temperatures over the last decade, not withstanding continued dramatic increases of carbon dioxide emissions, suggests the role of CO2 is not nearly as clear as the climate catastrophists suggest.”

    Does it matter what the man personally believes about the AGW proposition? I think not when it comes down to it. However if his scepticism about the millenarian cult of “climate change” leads this country to a more nuanced policy setting that eschews useless lip-service to AGW as a front for social engineering then the nation can only benefit. If AGW theory is correct which is the greater sin? To agree with the liturgy and preform pious acts of contrition that have no effect on the problem (like Gillard’s Carbon tax ) and cost our economy a Motza Or to disagree with the theory but to act in a prudent manner to improve the environment?

    Technology: “There is no way on God’s earth that we need to be spending $50 billion plus of borrowed money on what is going to turn out to be a telecommunications white elephant – school halls on steroids.”

    We would all love to have a Lamborghini or a Rolls Royce in the garage but when it comes down to it most of us would be happy with a Nissan or a Ford. lets consider just what people actually want out of the Internet rather than getting carried away by the dreams of the technophiles and the latte sippers

    Foreign investment: Tony Abbott made headlines recently when during a visit to China, he declared that “it would rarely be in Australia’s national interest to allow a foreign government or its agencies to control an Australian business”.
    In other words: foreign direct investment by such entities would not be welcome.

    How is it a bad thing to be concerned that a totalitarian state owned corporations may not have Australian’s interests at heart when they try to buy the farm here?

    Divorce: Liberal Party frontbencher Tony Abbott wants laws toughened up to make divorce harder. The opposition families and Aboriginal affairs spokesman has called for a return to the fault-based system of divorce discarded in 1975, which was replaced by a “no-fault” system. Mr Abbott’s plan, outlined in his soon-to-be released book Battlelines, would see a grounds for divorce reintroduced, including adultery, cruelty, habitual drunkenness and imprisonment.
    It would be similar to the defunct Matrimonial Causes Act.

    There is a great deal to recommend in our “no fault” divorce system but its not perfect and there are times when a judgement of fault would aid justice in adjudicating some of the issues associated with the dissolution of a marriage, its property and children that make divorce tough and the experience of our system shows it could do with some review and reconsideration at the very least.
    So there you go Migs I have gone through your points and shown that none of them are the black marks that you seem to think they are, all are quite reasonable positions to take and most reasonable people will be able to see that.
    Cheers Comrades

  11. Quite frankly, Tony Abbott is a fake. He’s fundamentalist in his ideology, who is all about winning with no comprise. This guy is incapable of governing for the masses as his addiction to winning means that if he won by 1 vote he would be bragging mandate. The issue in Australia is that the voting public has a short fickle memory. This is not the John Winston makeover where you get the worst treasurer in Australian history, shave his mono brow and he is re-born as a retro 50’s model of fuzzy old world Australia. Tony Abbott is a mono functional neocon terminator that has not evolved from his days trying to save the SRC from the threat of atheists, communists and feminist’s. This guy has made his mind up who we are, what we are and has no room in his mindset to change. You are for or against him and if its the later he will lie, cheat and fight to get his way or the highway. Dip a turf in chocolate and take a bite, its still a chocolate covered turf.

  12. Iain and,

    I see no reason to fault Abbott on this position as marriage is much more about the children that it is about social affirmation for homosexuality.

    How many of us enter into marriage with the sole intention being to have children. Marriage is about commitment and wanting to share one’s life with that person. So many marriages not just now but in the past were highly successful relationships, minus children.

    This is a very old idea coming from religious teachings – so much so that in the not too distant past a husband could cast away his wife should she prove to be barren.

  13. Iain, you are having yourself on. We were sending you up. We are well aware of what your response will be.

    Nice to see, you did not let us down. Nice to know, once again, we were right.

    Still trying to get people to your site. Not having much success, I see.

  14. As always Iain has added his opinion completely devoid of fact. I especially love technology and divorce. A ludite estimate of the needs of technology in his expierince straight from the 70’s volume of the liberal version of the future. One word genius….convergence.

  15. Migs, nice one and your wonderings were obviously well founded.

    Paul. spot on.

    Ricky, nicely put.
    Cheers 😆 😆 😆

  16. On divorce, Abbott has already written in his book that he believes that there should be 2 forms of divorce, one as per the Family Law Act and a 2nd one which would bring back the old faults based clause.

    Faults based divorce is nothing but pandering to the Catholic element, an attempt to make divorce more difficult especially for women. Faults based divorce when it existed was available only to the wealthy and in the vast majority only to men. The effect was the many women were forced to stay in sometimes violent situations as they did not have a the financial resources in order to obtain a divorce. You can therefore imagine which type of person would be insisting on entering into a faults based marriage contract.

    Abbott tugs at forelocks regarding other cultures and their marriages practices, but what he is suggesting re faults based would have a very similar effect on women, and their children.

  17. Iain, I like sex at now 71. Now there is no sense to that. in your eyes. Have you ceased to have sex, now that you have your pigeon pair. Could explain your frustration and the need to write such long tedious comments.

    I will be surprised if Migs is thankful for your contributions. Once again you have reinforced what a bore you are.

  18. Re:

    Recognition of Indigenous culture: ‘Western civilisation came to this country in 1788 and I’m proud of that . . . Aboriginal people have much to celebrate in this country’s British Heritage’.

    Abbott might have some semblance of an argument if this was mutual – that is, an equal amount of recognition and respect was shown to our Aboriginal people as Abbott would have them show to that (ever decreasing) portion of our heritage which is British.

  19. Min, much of our heritage is not only British. This has been true ever since the First Fleet landed.

    If anything, the Irish culture has come through stronger.

    Our culture has always been enriched by cultures from many countries. We seem to take the best from all and discard quickly what is not good.

    The protest on the weekend highlighted this. The biggest outcry against it came from the Muslim community.

    Most cultures, even all cultures, share common beliefs. Love of family, love of children, having a job and getting ahead. Even in religion, there is little difference. Most believe in god. The Muslims even recognise Jesus.

  20. Cu, precisely. Our so-called British heritage is highly over-estimated..by the time that you deduct the Scots, the Irish..and many Welshmen are overly keen on being labelled British either..then there are the Chinese, in some areas a substantial Indian population (came in a cane cutters), the Germans (especially in South Australia). Not many realise this but there were 3 African Americans at the Eureka Stockade.

    ps Scotland is technically part of the British Isles, but I wouldn’t want to try calling a Scot a Brit…it’s a vastly different culture with a vastly different history.

  21. There was one on the First Fleet. If my memory is correct, he was hung, as he could not survive on the small amount of food available.

    Personally, as a fifth generation Australian, I have little British blood. My people came as settlers and small shop keepers.

    PC on with representives from the Muslim community. ABC 24

  22. Min @ 9:11 am

    Iain and,

    I see no reason to fault Abbott on this position as marriage is much more about the children that it is about social affirmation for homosexuality.

    How many of us enter into marriage with the sole intention being to have children. Marriage is about commitment and wanting to share one’s life with that person. So many marriages not just now but in the past were highly successful relationships, minus children.

    Well I don’t know about you but children was front and centre in my decision to marry and you can’t tell me that you never considered what sort of parent a potential partner would make, otherwise why would be have any conception of beauty if not for it being an indicator of breeding potential?

    This is a very old idea coming from religious teachings – so much so that in the not too distant past a husband could cast away his wife should she prove to be barren.

    Yeah well the reality is if we find that our partner is barren how long will that marriage last if having children is top of your agenda?
    Catching up @ 9:14 am

    Iain, you are having yourself on. We were sending you up. We are well aware of what your response will be.

    Nice to see, you did not let us down. Nice to know, once again, we were right.

    Still trying to get people to your site. Not having much success, I see.

    Actually C U there has been some very lively discussion there over the last week or so.
    Ricky Pann @ 9:14 am

    As always Iain has added his opinion completely devoid of fact. I especially love technology and divorce. A ludite estimate of the needs of technology in his expierince straight from the 70′s volume of the liberal version of the future. One word genius….convergence.

    Migs asked for may opinion about his collection of Tony Abbott bon motts and I obliged him with a reasonable response which entails my opinions and discussion of how well they align with what Abbott is arguing.preciely what facts are you seeking”?

    Min @ 9:17 am

    On divorce, Abbott has already written in his book that he believes that there should be 2 forms of divorce, one as per the Family Law Act and a 2nd one which would bring back the old faults based clause.

    Faults based divorce is nothing but pandering to the Catholic element, an attempt to make divorce more difficult especially for women. Faults based divorce when it existed was available only to the wealthy and in the vast majority only to men. The effect was the many women were forced to stay in sometimes violent situations as they did not have a the financial resources in order to obtain a divorce. You can therefore imagine which type of person would be insisting on entering into a faults based marriage contract.

    The trouble with fault free divorce is that it fails to recognise that when a marriage fails there is usually some fault or failing upon the part of one of the partners and natural justice would suggest that there should be some form of accounting for this in the disposition of the assets and children of the marriage.

    Abbott tugs at forelocks regarding other cultures and their marriages practices, but what he is suggesting re faults based would have a very similar effect on women, and their children.

    I don;t quite get your point here can you be more expansive on this point of your argument please
    Catching up @ 9:18 am

    Iain, I like sex at now 71. Now there is no sense to that. in your eyes. Have you ceased to have sex, now that you have your pigeon pair. Could explain your frustration and the need to write such long tedious comments.

    Did you miss my point about sex also functioning as a glue in a pair bond? As for may own sex life well I don’t discuss such things in public beyond pointing out that I have a very satisfied wife and I have no complainants about the frequency or teh quality of lovemaking.

    I will be surprised if Migs is thankful for your contributions. Once again you have reinforced what a bore you are.

    Well you were under no obligation to respond to me as I had ignored your earlier comments
    Min @ 9:22 am

    Re:

    Recognition of Indigenous culture: ‘Western civilisation came to this country in 1788 and I’m proud of that . . . Aboriginal people have much to celebrate in this country’s British Heritage’.

    Abbott might have some semblance of an argument if this was mutual – that is, an equal amount of recognition and respect was shown to our Aboriginal people as Abbott would have them show to that (ever decreasing) portion of our heritage which is British.

    Lets be real here Min, Indigenous culture was/is far from the epitome of noble savagery it was brutal misogynistic and not that wonderful overall.

  23. “The fact that we have had if anything cooling global temperatures over the last decade, not withstanding continued dramatic increases of carbon dioxide emissions, suggests the role of CO2 is not nearly as clear as the climate catastrophists suggest.”

    Great quote…that definitely puts him in the denialati camp and not with those wishy washy sceptics.

    Three cheers for the monk.

  24. Wonder what our sceptic friend will have to say on this

    One of the world’s leading ice experts has predicted the final collapse of Arctic sea ice in summer months within four years.
    In what he calls a ‘‘global disaster’’ now unfolding in northern latitudes as the sea area that freezes and melts each year shrinks to its lowest extent ever recorded, Prof Peter Wadhams of Cambridge University calls for ‘‘urgent’’ consideration of new ideas to reduce global temperatures.

    Read more: http://www.smh.com.au/environment/climate-change/arctic-summer-ice-to-disappear-within-four-years-expert-says-20120918-26324.html#ixzz26m3XGFE5

  25. I started off reading this and highlighting what I thought might be a few I wanted to comment on however found that the whole thing just made me angry, what a nasty useless piece of ‘individual’… that said…corflutes strategically posted around the place with this stuff should be mandatory from now to the election… because I trust the voting public is clearly not aware of this misogynist full capability’s in the crap stakes and would be better informed and NOT VOTE HIM IN. Let’s face it, this would be a public service and he’s felt that very important in his capacity as LOTO.

  26. Iain and,

    Lets be real here Min, Indigenous culture was/is far from the epitome of noble savagery it was brutal misogynistic and not that wonderful overall.

    You know this for certain do you Iain or are you just listening to the white man’s propaganda which “proves” that white civilisation is superior to that of the Aboriginal peoples.

    Aboriginal cultures survived plus thrived with their rich and complex social system while so called civilised nations we almost wiping themselves out through pestilence and famines. Many of us are here in Australia as a result of the failure of these Western cultures eg. the Irish famine.

  27. An interesting article on The Drum,

    Has Gillard done the rope-a-dope on Abbott?

    But the Coalition’s slide in the polls and his own battle to win personal support must have Liberal strategists wondering whether he is fighting the right sort of bout.
    Since the 2010 election the Opposition Leader has been in attack mode, denying the legitimacy of the Government, honing in on the carbon ‘tax’ ‘lie’, railing against government incompetence on everything from fiscal policy to border protection.
    With a massive lead in the polls there has been no reason to change strategy – indeed compelling reasons to keep things going – so we have seen day after day of Opposition with the gloves off, refusing to concede anything, always attacking.

    http://www.abc.net.au/unleashed/4266294.html

  28. As I said elsewhere, the slugger has met the boxer.

    ..Because he was leaning on the ropes, the impact of the punches would be diminished, but not the effort that went into delivering them. The plan was to drain all of Foreman’s energy swinging at Ali, while Ali focussed on merely surviving the onslaught.
    It wasn’t until Foreman began to flag that Ali went off the ropes and in for the kill, raining blows and winning a surprise knock-out.
    Since that match the ‘Rope-a-Dope’ strategy has become synonymous with a game-plan that leads an opponent to think they are in a winning position, only to learn later that they had been lulled into a false sense of security for strategic gain….

    http://www.abc.net.au/unleashed/4266294.html

    Brains always beats brawn
    .

  29. Min…on the evidence… Iain is closer to the reality. Confirmation bias ignores the gang rapes and the fight or flight mentality of these stone age people.

  30. The so called British culture has a violent history, as have most cultures. Our own Indigenous not as violent as most.

  31. And the dope on the rope had bishop and pyne, in his corner yesterday. Even wright in fairfax is commenting on how pathetic and rehearsed and desperate it was and how even the barrackers found it embarrassing.

  32. “bias ignores the gang rapes and the fight or flight mentality of these stone age people.”

    Where did this come from. What is he/she trying to say.

    Gang rape is a new one on me. Is it fight or flight. Is it that they have the brains to pick the \fights they can win.

    Maybe el gordo, you can explain what you are trying to say. Suspect you hit the return button too quick.

  33. I also get the impression Iain does not know what the NBN is, he give no evidence as to why the Ford is better than the Lamborghini or a Rolls Royce.

  34. “Did you miss my point about sex also functioning as a glue in a pair bond?”

    My point. Being for having kids is not the aim.

    Therefore what is different with same gender sex, committing in the same manner.

    In the real world, most have sex, desperately hoping that a kid is not the result.

    Once again, you attempt to walk both sides of the fence.

  35. Migs asked for may opinion about his collection of Tony Abbott bon motts and I obliged him with a reasonable response which entails my opinions and discussion of how well they align with what Abbott is arguing. preciely what facts are you seeking”?

    Well your opinion is wrong Iain. Maybe instead of using language like Latte’ and car analogies, you could explain the rationale of providing a digital future for Australia that is not based on the functional limitations of mobile technology like wireless? The Opposition has yet to reveal how they are going to provide a digital model that will secure our future prosperity after they sold the national carrier for zero gain and left us to languish in market forces effectively reducing of the greatest telecommunication networks in the world to a directionless shareholder shackled bottom line.

    I don’t see any market forces in the Bush Iain. Don’t see Singapore Telecoms Optus nodes or Vodaphone all over the country investing in the future. Just an unregulated, dysfunctional, cherry picked mess left by the past governments race for a surplus @ the expense of Jobs training and our future in the digital economy. Fibre to the house is why Korea is prospering and we are wading in the mud hole left by the previous government’s ideology of non-existent free market “Jodi Rich” style competition.
    I may take you seriously if you bring on the facts mate but opinions are like assholes, everyone has one and most are full of shit. I have a promiscuous stiffy full of truthful reality ready to deflower your opinion faster than a Price Coopers partner @ a tax deductible Liberal policy formulation conference.

    Abbott is a luddite, even Keating admitted he was wrong in regards to the digital economy. Turnbull does not believe a word he is spuking, infact he invested in French Telecom, fibre to the house.

  36. paul, those cars mainly do the same job. They get you from one place to another in the same time. Some might be a little more comfortable. All have to travel at the same speed.

    The NBNco versus keeping copper does not.

    One out performs the other by far.

    Fibre to the home is far superior, and in the long run cheaper. Over time, there will be great savings on maintenance.

    Retro fitting is always dearer. That will be necessary in the near future, if one only goes to the node, attacking in to inferior, crapped out copper wire.

    It will need huge ugly nodes on each corner.

    I have used the full words, to enable him to understand.

    The NBNco will also be earning money, as the process of putting it in place goes on.

    Mr. Turnbull has not been able or willing to enlighten us, as to what the earnings, if any would be of their scheme.

    Has not explained how much it will cost to deal with Telstra, So many unanswered questions.

    With the NBNco, will result in a scheme that will serve us well into the future, with no more to pay.

  37. CU I agree with everything you have said, the oppositions plan for FTTN will be outdated in the near future, which means replacing all the copper from the nodes to the premises with fibre at the cost of the tax payer, They also want to rip up the agreement with telstra and take it back to a monopoly.

  38. Ricky, I believe Howard had seventeen or more attempts. Labor was not able to bring their original scheme., Mainly because of the mess, Howard made of selling off Telstra, and the failure of private enterprise to come to the party.

    Labor has had the guts to go ahead with the best option.

    The cheapest way, is often the most wasteful.

  39. Britain is going down the road of fibre to the node, saying this is only a temporary phrase because of the state of the economy. They intend to take it to the home as soon as possible. They see it as essential. to take it to the home.

  40. “…in fact he invested in French Telecom, fibre to the house.”

    And as was revealed a few days ago also in a Spanish FTTH telco.

    Must be something in this FTTH if other countries are piecemeal bringing it in.

  41. More on the “tony I know” this time big joe hockey. Hockey says he deserved his black eyes from tony, as he hockey had kneed tony in the kidneys.
    Sorry joe but in any footie match the referee does not take kindly to those who retaliate. And your account joe co firms that abbott was unable to control his emotions. Tony thought about himself before his team.
    Oh well I wonder who in the spin team will send next into the press?

  42. I guess this is a boring deja vu for me having spent a great deal of my working life in The Telecomunications/IT Indusry building the future. I wrote a blog about it, which is lost on people like Iain because they just cant get there head’s around what us digital technology futurist’s see on the horizon. They are weighted down so by the past to have any foresight to see future application. I just threw my hands up in the air and left the industry to concentrate on digital content and future media delivery. I have been dreaming of a fibre future since Telecom started laying 64 meg lazer routes in the mid 80’s, its 2012. I was not even enticed to work for NBN corp as I know those guys will build something wonderful and a future political ideology will destroy it, so thanks but no thanks.
    If you can be bothered:
    http://politicaljelly.blogspot.com.au/2012/04/mis-information-back-road.html

  43. Ricky, I am an old woman and I dig it. Cannot understand why the younger ones cannot. Maybe I am old enough, to remember when that copper was first laid, and how long it took.

    Like me, the copper has or is nearing the end of it’s useful life.

  44. Ricky, we will just have to work that much harder, so your fears do not come to fruition.

    I have a feeling that business will not allow Abbott to weal his wrecking ball. They have much to lose. They will not want years of uncertainty and instability. That is what Abbott is promising.

  45. Interesting to lineup those comments of Abbott with those of his confessor Pell. There are striking similarities. Question is who said it first? Who prompted who?

  46. dafid1. There is no prompting needed, they just follow their tired old script that requires no logical thinking at all. Easy peasy!1

  47. paulwello @ 9:50 am

    Wonder what our sceptic friend will have to say on this

    One of the world’s leading ice experts has predicted the final collapse of Arctic sea ice in summer months within four years.

    well I will say lets wait and see what happens because such dire predictions don’t have a long and illustrious history of being right, and even if it is right is there anything that can realistically be done about it?

    Signe @ 9:57 am

    I started off reading this and highlighting what I thought might be a few I wanted to comment on however found that the whole thing just made me angry, what a nasty useless piece of ‘individual’… that said…corflutes strategically posted around the place with this stuff should be mandatory from now to the election… because I trust the voting public is clearly not aware of this misogynist full capability’s in the crap stakes and would be better informed and NOT VOTE HIM IN. Let’s face it, this would be a public service and he’s felt that very important in his capacity as LOTO.

    What here makes you angry and why?

    Min@ 10:02 am

    Iain and,

    Lets be real here Min, Indigenous culture was/is far from the epitome of noble savagery it was brutal misogynistic and not that wonderful overall.

    You know this for certain do you Iain or are you just listening to the white man’s propaganda which “proves” that white civilisation is superior to that of the Aboriginal peoples.

    I make no claim that indigenous culture is “inferior” Min only that it is brutal(think about the beatings and other punishments in “indigenous law”, Misogynistic you need look no further than the rates of domestic violence and there are a whole lot of other cultural practices that are at odds with modernity (like the practice of forced marriage of young girls to senior men)

    Aboriginal cultures survived plus thrived with their rich and complex social system while so called civilised nations we almost wiping themselves out through pestilence and famines. Many of us are here in Australia as a result of the failure of these Western cultures eg. the Irish famine.

    We have only an oral tradition to support this claim and such oral traditions are only as good as the paper they are written on to be frank. That said when it comes to eeking a living out of this country as hunter gatherers may be the very reason that the culture developed such a harsh system of law and such brutal cultural practices. Frankly their longevity as culture in this harsh land is probably down to that very harsh culture. Which just brings us back to the need for indigenous culture to change now that they are seeking to be part of the 21st century because stone age thinking won’t help them in the age of the microchip.


    Paul @ 11:20 am

    I also get the impression Iain does not know what the NBN is, he give no evidence as to why the Ford is better than the Lamborghini or a Rolls Royce.

    what does a Lambo , a Roller and a Ford have in common? they are all cars designed to move people from one place to another. What sets them apart? The difference in their cost to a would be owner. As fro the ford being better well that depends on how you define it doesn’t it? If you want a machine that does the same thing as that Lambo you can spend a fraction of the Lambo sticker price on a hot Ford and have as much fun time driving fast. So it comes down to value for money, whcih coincidentally is why the NBN may be an extravagance that costs way too much for what it actaully does, just like taht Lambo… (oh and I have a good friend with a Lambo and frankly its a bit agricultural,maybe because its a tractor!)
    Catching up @ 11:23 am

    Once again, you attempt to walk both sides of the fence.

    And why is that wrong? Don’t we all seek to understand the arguments with adequate thoroughness?

    Ricky J Pannowitz @ 11:27 am

    Migs asked for may opinion about his collection of Tony Abbott bon motts and I obliged him with a reasonable response which entails my opinions and discussion of how well they align with what Abbott is arguing. precisely what facts are you seeking”?

    Well your opinion is wrong Iain.

    No Ricky my opinion is just my opinion and I am entitled to believe whatever I please.

    Maybe instead of using language like Latte’ and car analogies, you could explain the rationale of providing a digital future for Australia that is not based on the functional limitations of mobile technology like wireless? The Opposition has yet to reveal how they are going to provide a digital model that will secure our future prosperity after they sold the national carrier for zero gain and left us to languish in market forces effectively reducing of the greatest telecommunication networks in the world to a directionless shareholder shackled bottom line.

    Well Ricky I look at the things that most technophiles want to use the technologies for and I can’t help thinking that so much of it is pointless crap stupid amusements on mobile devices and entirely unnecessary communications about what brand of beans to buy in the supermarket. Wasn’t it you who was saying in an earlier thread that we should put down the devices and actually get back to having real contact with real people? are our lives really going to be better if we can download movies in a minute? lets go to first principles here what functions do we need from telecommunications and what is the best value way of getting it?

    I don’t see any market forces in the Bush Iain. Don’t see Singapore Telecoms Optus nodes or Vodaphone all over the country investing in the future. Just an unregulated, dysfunctional, cherry picked mess left by the past governments race for a surplus @ the expense of Jobs training and our future in the digital economy. Fibre to the house is why Korea is prospering and we are wading in the mud hole left by the previous government’s ideology of non-existent free market “Jodi Rich” style competition.

    I don’t care and I actually live outside the latte belt and all that I and most other internet users want is to be able to do the basics like email, a little blogging/ socialising and internet shopping. reliable ADSL does this but hey you are the technophile here so why don’t you explain why we NEED more than that.

    Catching up @ 11:35 am

    The NBNco versus keeping copper does not.

    One out performs the other by far.

    But I am not making those Particular comparisons

    Fibre to the home is far superior, and in the long run cheaper. Over time, there will be great savings on maintenance.

    I don’t believe that the savings will be a great as you think CU

    Not going to go into your reiteration of the ALP propaganda except to say that the one thing that you ignore is the distances and population densities involved
    paulwello @ 11:41 am

    CU I agree with everything you have said, the oppositions plan for FTTN will be outdated in the near future, which means replacing all the copper from the nodes to the premises with fibre at the cost of the tax payer, They also want to rip up the agreement with telstra and take it back to a monopoly.

    where I live Paul there are only two houses on my road so do you think that its good value to the nation to dig a kilometre of trench to service those two houses? and taht is not counting the miles of trenches to get the cable to the end of may road.

    Ricky J Pannowitz @ 12:30 pm

    I guess this is a boring deja vu for me having spent a great deal of my working life in The Telecomunications/IT Indusry building the future. I wrote a blog about it, which is lost on people like Iain because they just cant get there head’s around what us digital technology futurist’s see on the horizon. They are weighted down so by the past to have any foresight to see future application. I just threw my hands up in the air and left the industry to concentrate on digital content and future media delivery. I have been dreaming of a fibre future since Telecom started laying 64 meg lazer routes in the mid 80′s, its 2012. I was not even enticed to work for NBN corp as I know those guys will build something wonderful and a future political ideology will destroy it, so thanks but no thanks.

    Mate as someone from inside the industry and who is having a love affair with the idea of the technology I think that you are actually too close to the whole thing to really think about what the ordinary people from the communications technology rather than what those who want to make a quid from it want the punters to pay for.

  48. The visitor said this

    where I live Paul there are only two houses on my road so do you think that its good value to the nation to dig a kilometre of trench to service those two houses? and taht is not counting the miles of trenches to get the cable to the end of may road.

    He has just proved to me he has not read any policy on the NBN . The NBN are not going to dig a trench to your house, they will be using the infrastructure that is already in place.

  49. Paul
    the discussion was generated by one of my fellow authors at the Sandpit

    So one of your sock puppets posted then.

  50. Iain, those two houses are also entitled to be serviced. I am assuming they have other services, such as a copper wire phone and electricity.

  51. Paul there is no Telstra conduit to my house, in fact for a good part of the cable run to this humble abode the cable sits on the ground and it has done so for the last 13 years that we have lived here, essentially there is no existing infrastructure that can be used.

    Oh and this “So one of your sock puppets posted then”. is utterly wrong “GD” wrote the post in question because I do not write under any name other than my own on any political topics anywhere on the net,

  52. Catching up @ 2:53 pm

    That is OK, if you do not believe it will be cheaper. The experts do, and that satisfies me.

    Experts are often wrong CU no matter what the grand qualifications that they claim may suggest.

    Catching up @ 2:55 pm

    Iain, this is not the sandpit. If we were interested, we would go there.

    Well had Paul not brought it up then I would not have discussed it here.

    Catching up @ 2:56 pm

    Iain, those two houses are also entitled to be serviced. I am assuming they have other services, such as a copper wire phone and electricity.

    Sure we have phone and power but that is besides the point which is that we have a geographically wide spread population which means delivering the promises of the NBN is far more expensive than the more densely populated and physically smaller countries cited as examples of what can be done.

  53. What another MSSO by Hockey. In full flight. Albanese objecting to Hockey action. Accused Hockey of making a application for position of Acting Opposition leader.

    Hockey will have no voice, Speaker suggested that he does not need to scream. Moved that the member be no longer heard.

  54. Yes that is why the NBN and Labor did the deal and the Coalition wants to rip up that deal.

    CU, as I have said he only come here because hardly any one visits his site, he tries to push his views here but is always beaten down, have not heard one Liberal Idea from him, he is always in the conservative mode, not going forward, looking to the past.

  55. Catching up @ 3:02 pm

    What I do not understand why you are allowed to hog this site.

    CU you post more comments here than I do and we both do so at the pleasure of the blog owner, So just because you have trouble bettering me in debate please don’t compromise you dignity by whining about the fact that I am welcomed here.

  56. Yes, Iain, I believe I do. They do not run everyone else down. That is except for you. I move from topic to topic. I suggest new ones. I partake in the conversation. I do not attempt to control it.

    I do not attack others who make comments.

    I do not write reams, of what amounts to nonsense.

    I do not treat it as my own site. Yes, now and then I might put up a post, if I feel it is necessary.

    What I contribute is nothing like your efforts. If I say the wrong thing or upset anyone, I apologise.

  57. That is what I am saying the liberal party have lost there identity, they are not liberal any more under Abbott, they are conservative, maybe the should change there name to the “Conservative Party of Australia”

  58. It is a circus. Move that the member be no longer heard. Looks like this stunt is being bought to an end. Not before time.

  59. @Iain…what makes me angry is that this man and his ilk are even considerations for the top job in the country, I believe we need to be moving forward unlike your leader who spends way to much of his time trying to drag us back to serfdom and minion-ism… his attitudes are not anything to do with equality and fairness he lacks vision and is not of sufficient calibre to hold such an important position. As I said we should have signage on every corner between now and the next election reminding the populous of his fanatical and outdated thinking.

  60. I have noticed our visitor is belittling the people on this site again, buy saying that he is better at debating than other people.

  61. The only type of debate that he has any aptitude for is mass-debate, that should be masturbate 😳 🙄 😆

    Cheers

  62. “I do not write under any name other than my own on any political topics anywhere on the net”…how would anyone possibly know that, you could be anyone.

  63. The visitor and TA would make a great pair, unable to win an argument and offer nothing to the future of this great nation

  64. Iain and:

    I make no claim that indigenous culture is “inferior” Min only that it is brutal(think about the beatings and other punishments in “indigenous law”. You suggest inferiority by the utilization of the technique of comparison. Brutality as in Gitmo, as in genocide, as in the deliberate starvation of the Irish people in the 19th Century. Brutality such as burning witches at the stake. Brutality such as the Spanish Inquisition. Brutality such as locking children away via mandatory sentencing laws.

    Misogynistic you need look no further than the rates of domestic violence and there are a whole lot of other cultural practices that are at odds with modernity (like the practice of forced marriage of young girls to senior men) Is domestic violence a cultural thing – well of course racists would have us believe so. Re forced marriages, then you would support the Labor government’s initiative in categorising those escaping things such as forced marriages, as being refugees.

  65. Iain, I will let you into a little secret. While you keep dissecting people and what they say, as you do, I will continue to do like to you.

    Now, I believe that is fair. Do unto others, as they do to you.

    If you see it as whining, so be it.

  66. What I do not understand why you are allowed to hog this site.

    You could always join Iain and his chattering coven of sockpuppets on his own blog, CU. Just don some sunglasses and take some stupefying drugs beforehand.

  67. Migs and,

    Mr Abbott said he felt “threatened” by homosexuality on Sunday night’s program, a comment that has angered the gay and lesbian community and something he tried to back track from during an interview on the ABC last night.

    Interesting is that Abbott’s sister later came out as a lesbian, yet previously Tony said that he felt “threatened”..does this include his sister?

  68. Looks like a Liberal Senator will defy Abbott on the Gay Bill.

    Liberal senator defiant on gay bill. Liberal senator Sue Boyce will defy Tony Abbott by speaking in favour of a bill to legalise gay marriage, and has not ruled out crossing the floor to vote for it.
    Senators will tonight resume debating the bill, sponsored by Labor senators Trish Crossin, Carol Brown, Louise Pratt and Gavin Marshall. A vote on the bill is expected tomorrow.
    Senator Boyce, of Queensland, has previously publicly expressed support for same-sex marriage.
    But the Coalition has maintained a position of opposing change to marriage laws, and coalition MPs and senators are bound to vote against it.

    Read more: http://www.smh.com.au/opinion/political-news/liberal-senator-defiant-on-gay-bill-20120918-2642h.html#ixzz26nlPqLB9

  69. Paul, excellent news that one Liberal has the gumption to take a stand on something that she believes in. Doubtless, as for people such as Petro Georgiou versus Howard, don’t expect a promotion any time this century…

  70. Also this quote from the same article, these are just some of the issues in the gay bill debate.

    In other speeches, Labor senator Louise Pratt fought back tears as she spoke about being prevented by law from marrying her transgender partner.
    ”We exist. We already exist… all we ask is that you stop pretending that we don’t. That you stop pretending that our relationships are not as real as yours, our love as true, our children as cherished and our families as precious. Because they are,” she said.

    Read more: http://www.smh.com.au/opinion/political-news/liberal-senator-defiant-on-gay-bill-20120918-2642h.html#ixzz26nncA0Qj

  71. This article from Michelle Grattan

    Poll: Abbott erratic, angry and arrogant.

    TONY Abbott is seen as being significantly more arrogant, narrow-minded, intolerant, and aggressive than Julia Gillard, in a new poll underlining the Opposition Leader’s image problem.
    After Labor’s vote and the PM’s approval rose and Mr Abbott’s approval rating fell to a personal record low in The Age/Nielsen poll, while Newspoll had a 50-50 two-party vote, Essential Research has found Ms Gillard is viewed less negatively than in April, with a significant fall in perception of her as out of touch with ordinary people and ”superficial”.
    Mr Abbott is regarded as arrogant by 63 per cent (Gillard, 46 per cent); superficial by 51 per cent (46 per cent); narrow-minded by 59 per cent (46 per cent); intolerant by 53 per cent (37 per cent); aggressive by 59 per cent (42 per cent) and erratic by 51 per cent (43 per cent).

    Now we know all this, and word is getting out more and more about TA

    Read more: http://www.smh.com.au/opinion/political-news/poll-abbott-erratic-angry-and-arrogant-20120917-262nu.html#ixzz26npnhYnJ

  72. paulwello @ 3:16 pm

    That is what I am saying the liberal party have lost there identity, they are not liberal any more under Abbott, they are conservative, maybe the should change there name to the “Conservative Party of Australia”

    Why does it matter if there is a dissonance between the name of a party and what it actually stands for? For instance neither the Labor party or the Greens are the same sort of party that they were at their creation. As the saying goes “a rose by any other name would still smell as sweet”

    Miglo @ 3:29 pm

    Iain, I forgive you for your ignorance of pre-contact Aboriginal societies.

    Am I really that far off the mark Migs? Come on be honest here do you think that Pre-contact indigenous culture was wonderfully peaceful and the epitome of social virtue?

    Signe @ 3:59 pm

    @Iain…what makes me angry is that this man and his ilk are even considerations for the top job in the country, I believe we need to be moving forward unlike your leader who spends way to much of his time trying to drag us back to serfdom and minion-ism…

    That is a rediculious claim to make and I ask you why you think this

    his attitudes are not anything to do with equality and fairness he lacks vision and is not of sufficient calibre to hold such an important position.

    That assertion needs backing up because I don’t see the evidence for this claim at all

    As I said we should have signage on every corner between now and the next election reminding the populous of his fanatical and outdated thinking.

    Well that is the aim of the ALP dirt unit isn’t it? the pity is that hyperbole seldom has credibility except amoung the already committed Abbott haters.

    paulwello @ 4:12 pm

    I have noticed our visitor is belittling the people on this site again, buy saying that he is better at debating than other people.

    Paul I am just stating the facts mate but you should look at the comments that you and CU have posted about Moi

    dafid1 @ 4:32 pm


    “I do not write under any name other than my own on any political topics anywhere on the net”
    …how would anyone possibly know that, you could be anyone.

    Mate I have been writing and posting about politics for seven years in my own name and I am far to lazy to try to invent new personas to discuss politics. When you write in your own name then I will take what you say about my identity on the net without totally laughing myself silly!

    Catching up @ 4:35 pm

    I will whine as long as I like. I just call it as I see it. Do not see much respect here.

    Whine away CU I don’t care

    paulwello @ 4:40 pm

    The visitor and TA would make a great pair, unable to win an argument and offer nothing to the future of this great nation

    I care a great deal about our future Paul which is why I’m concerned about change that is not for the better and the fact that under Labor we have had more than our share of change that is bad.

    Min September 18, 2012 @ 4:42 pm

    Iain and:

    I make no claim that indigenous culture is “inferior” Min only that it is brutal(think about the beatings and other punishments in “indigenous law”. You suggest inferiority by the utilization of the technique of comparison.

    That analysis only works if you consider “brutal” to be universally bad I think I suggested earlier that there is a place for brutality in harsh conditions.

    Brutality as in Gitmo, as in genocide, as in the deliberate starvation of the Irish people in the 19th Century. Brutality such as burning witches at the stake. Brutality such as the Spanish Inquisition. Brutality such as locking children away via mandatory sentencing laws.

    It will probably horrify you Min but there is a place for brutality in the case of Gitmo we are talking about fanatics who would love nothing more than killing in the name of their God yopu surely can’t expect them to be treated like honoured guests? The Spanish inquisition was hundreds of years ago, as for mandatory sentencing if they do the crime why should they not do the time?

    Misogynistic you need look no further than the rates of domestic violence and there are a whole lot of other cultural practices that are at odds with modernity (like the practice of forced marriage of young girls to senior men) Is domestic violence a cultural thing – well of course racists would have us believe so. Re forced marriages, then you would support the Labor government’s initiative in categorising those escaping things such as forced marriages, as being refugees.

    Come off it Min I’m not saying that only indigenous people have domestic violence or that they are the only ones to treat girls as chattels to be traded and misused but such things still happen annd I don’t care who does it I think its totally unacceptable under any circumstances.
    As for the refugee question it has some merit to accept such things as grounds for consideration.

    Catching up @ 4:46 pm

    Iain, I will let you into a little secret. While you keep dissecting people and what they say, as you do, I will continue to do like to you.

    Now, I believe that is fair. Do unto others, as they do to you.

    If you see it as whining, so be it.

    You do your best then CU I look forward to the challenge 😉
    Peter W. @ 4:47 pm

    What I do not understand why you are allowed to hog this site.

    You could always join Iain and his chattering coven of sockpuppets on his own blog, CU. Just don some sunglasses and take some stupefying drugs beforehand.

    would you be the person who’s only blogging claim to fame is a blog devoted to yours truly?

    I’m sure you know all about stupefying drugs then Peter


    Min @ 4:48 pm

    Migs and,

    Mr Abbott said he felt “threatened” by homosexuality on Sunday night’s program, a comment that has angered the gay and lesbian community and something he tried to back track from during an interview on the ABC last night.

    Interesting is that Abbott’s sister later came out as a lesbian, yet previously Tony said that he felt “threatened”..does this include his sister?

    I think that he was just being candid Min because we all feel threatened by something but what matters is how we then think and act on those issues.


    paulwello @ 4:52 pm

    Looks like a Liberal Senator will defy Abbott on the Gay Bill.

    maybe not because speaking for a bill does not mean that this senator will vote for it

  73. Visitor

    Looks like a Liberal Senator will defy Abbott on the Gay Bill.

    maybe not because speaking for a bill does not mean that this senator will vote for it

    Please read again I said It LOOKS LIKE, does not mean they will, again not reading articles

  74. The visitor said this

    I’m concerned about change that is not for the better and the fact that under Labor we have had more than our share of change that is bad.

    What changes do you think will be better under TA rule.

  75. Iain, I know a fair bit about Aboriginal cultures, customs and societies, both pre and post White contact. You were a long way of the mark. I can’t blame you for this as most Australians are not well versed in Aboriginal history.

    I’m not an expert on many things but on this subject I am, which is a segue to a bit of bragging. I hold an Arts degree in Aboriginal Affairs Administration and an Honours degree in Aboriginal Studies. I worked in Aboriginal affairs for seven years. I worked with Aboriginal communities for six years and lived in remote Australia for three years.

    I learnt to speak Pitjantjatjara to boot. But my best credentials are that I have two Aboriginal ‘brothers’, one in SA and one in NSW. They asked me to be their brother. This is a big honour. They don’t usually ask this from a white person, unless that person would be accepted by the black community as a person who can identify with Aboriginal people.

    Bragging over. You can either try and learn from me what I know, in which case I’d be delighted to teach you about our Indigenous brothers and sisters, or you can take me on and try and argue with me. But you’d lose. Best not to bother with it.

    You’d be up against an expert.

  76. Iain, dude, above you made a broad assumption about pre-contact Oz with no back up, two lines later you demand backup by someone else.

    You then talk about the Labor dirt unit, dude… Chris whine having beers with Ashby before all the…blah wasting keystrokes.

    Then you talk about change that is not for the better?? Come on mate seriously!!! Where is Oz right now, look at the beautiful set of numbers. Now look ANYWHERE else on the planet you bafoon.

    You are a tool. Everyone can see it. I recon even you.

    Sometime you gotta listen to the great Kenny Rogers and “know when to fold em”

    Oh, and Tony is fucked because he isn’t PM’s arsehole, didn’t stop the CP and that’s all he was there to do, he was never meant to get to lodge because important people know he’s a fucking halfwit!!

  77. Migs
    I was aware of your back ground from your FB profile and I would be delighted to hear you tell me about the nature of pre contact indigenous culture in particular an exploration of the attitude to women an the attitudes to concepts of crime and punishment. Maybe that could be a good topic for a post of its own though.

  78. I think I worked out why the visitor does not give any links to back up his arguments, he is afraid of being found out to being a liar, like when we ask what policies TA has that would be better than the current governments he cannot, why his climate change policy is better than the governments, he cannot, why the coalition policy on telecommunications is better than the governments, he cannot, he just says, they are, great argument. 😈 😈 😈

  79. With Newspoll at 50/50 some wag indicated look what could happens with a neutral press and I support that comment. The polls without the media bias should give a more balanced view all round, much like the melbourne byelection which Labor held and showed the real public perception. Amen

  80. The Authority on everything wrote…..”I don’t care and I actually live outside the latte belt and all that I and most other Internet users want is to be able to do the basics like email, a little blogging/ socialising and internet shopping. reliable ADSL does this but hey you are the technophile here so why don’t you explain why we NEED more than that.”

    See therein lies the difference, you think blogg trolling and self importance, emails and socialising. I think Medical diagnostics, home security, remote monitoring, video conferencing, decentralised industry, cottage industries, education, service delivery, job opportunities, converging media and wait for it genius…reliability. Iain your are a short sighted argumentative troll with an opinion for everything but no foresight or facts. You are brainwashed by your man crush on Abbott which just displays your poor cut and paste judgement .

    http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=-572077907195969915

    I am so completely sick of people like you….yawn yawn yawn

  81. Kitkat @ 6:37 pm

    Iain, dude, above you made a broad assumption about pre-contact Oz with no back up, two lines later you demand backup by someone else.

    Really? well I invite you to show me where I am wrong about the brutality, of the treatment of women.

    You then talk about the Labor dirt unit, dude… Chris whine having beers with Ashby before all the…blah wasting keystrokes.

    The David Marr smear piece may not be an actual product of the dirt unit but you can bet London to a brick that they love it even though it has no evidence to back it up.

    Then you talk about change that is not for the better?? Come on mate seriously!!! Where is Oz right now, look at the beautiful set of numbers. Now look ANYWHERE else on the planet you bafoon(sic).

    Did I talk about accounting or finances? I was referring to changes to immigration controls made back in 2008, the stupidity of the Carbon Tax, the creation of a useless “clean energy fund” the mining tax, the list is endless

    You are a tool. Everyone can see it. I recon even you.

    🙄 I am immune to insults KK

    Sometime you gotta listen to the great Kenny Rogers and “know when to fold em”

    Nah I prefer to work on the basis that it aint over till the fat lady sings, so you feel free to fold any-time you please

    Oh, and Tony is fucked because he isn’t PM’s arsehole, didn’t stop the CP and that’s all he was there to do, he was never meant to get to lodge because important people know he’s a fucking halfwit!!

    Abbott is a Rhodes scholar and it would be a big mistake to under estimate him, but you do come across as the sort of person who believes their own rhetoric, which is rather sad.

  82. His comments are true of being a conservative, the only preview of the future that Iain sees is one to the past. The past of the fifties.

  83. Yes, Iain, it would be a good idea for a topic. Although there are many in the Indigenous Australia category, especially among my earlier posts.

  84. So Iain, you now admit that the ‘Labor Dirt Unit’ had nothing to do with anything, well done, you just fucked your own argument.

    My point about you requesting evidence stands, you said nothing to quash my point.

    Who gives a fuck if Abbott is a Rhodes scholar, a fucking moron that can row boats and get punched in the head is still a moron. If the guy is so smart how is he in the situation he is in now. He has had the rub of the green in EVERY possible way since the last election and has been bested by Gillard and co EVERYTIME. He’s a half witted pugilist nothing more.

    How about you sing the graces of Menzies, Hawlke and Beazley if you have so much love for Rhodes scholars.

  85. Ricky J Pannowitz said 7 minutes ago:

    See therein lies the difference, you think blog trolling and self importance, emails and socialising.

    No Ricky I talk to a lot of ordinary people and I ask them what they want from the net

    I think Medical diagnostics,

    To what end? If you need medical imaging you have to go to where the machines are, the fastest internet offers no real; advantage.

    home security,

    Its illusionary at best to think that fast internet will improve your home security will it get a cop to your joint any quicker if you are burgled ?

    remote monitoring,

    My brother already does this fro his business with good old ADSL

    video conferencing,
    Cute but rather over rated

    decentralised industry,

    How can this be if you still have to transport raw materials and the final product?

    cottage industries,

    How many cottages do we need?

    education,

    that is vague, what kind of education are you talking about?

    service delivery,

    what sort of service would that be Ricky? could I get my car serviced over the NBN?

    job opportunities,

    what sort of Jobs?

    converging media and wait for it genius…reliability.

    Really? how so?

    Iain your are a short sighted argumentative troll with an opinion for everything but no foresight or facts.

    No I am just a bloke who does not swallow the all progress is good mantra of the slaves to new technology like you.

    You are brainwashed by your man crush on Abbott which just displays your poor cut and paste judgement .

    😆

    I am so completely sick of people like you….yawn yawn yawn

    👿

  86. The visitor is back to his usual tricks again, twisting every word and sentence to suit his own needs while not actually saying anything relevant or adding to the argument, not posting to links to back up his arguments.

  87. Kitkat, go to the fucking How To tab tab neat the underneath our fucking banner and it’ll give yo a link on how to make the little turds.

  88. Iain, and

    Really? well I invite you to show me where I am wrong about the brutality, of the treatment of women.

    And you show me how white society is superior in this regard…

  89. Iain doesn’t want the NBN because (a) Labor thought of it, and (b) he can troll blogs, play online PS3 games and google lawyers just fine on his ADSL.

    could I get my car serviced over the NBN?

    No, but you could look up a good wreckers, which would be more appropriate.

  90. paulwello @ 7:01 pm

    His comments are true of being a conservative, the only preview of the future that Iain sees is one to the past. The past of the fifties.

    Actually Paul I am more fond of the period just before before the outbreak of WW2 especially when it comes to the style and design of cars and the clothes 😉 but in all seriousness there is a great deal of good things from the past that offer us valued insights into the future if we take the time to look.
    Miglo @ 7:01 pm

    Yes, Iain, it would be a good idea for a topic. Although there are many in the Indigenous Australia category, especially among my earlier posts.

    Well I will take the time to check out your back catalogue Migs

    Kitkat @ 7:07 pm

    So Iain, you now admit that the ‘Labor Dirt Unit’ had nothing to do with anything, well done, you just fucked your own argument.

    The dirt unit exits by your own admission KK so its reasonable to assume that it is not part of an ALP gardening club, rather it is indicative of a desperate party that feels the need to go for the smear. That Marr is a fellow traveller rather than a contributor to the dirt unit makes no difference.

    My point about you requesting evidence stands, you said nothing to quash my point.

    Yawn! I offer opinions and I ask questions, its called having a civil conversation, maybe you should try it sometime

    Who gives a fuck if Abbott is a Rhodes scholar, a fucking moron that can row boats and get punched in the head is still a moron. If the guy is so smart how is he in the situation he is in now.

    You were the one insisting that the man is stupid and when I point out that is very wrong you blow a gasket

    He has had the rub of the green in EVERY possible way since the last election and has been bested by Gillard and co EVERYTIME. He’s a half witted pugilist nothing more.

    You are kidding yourself there KK

    How about you sing the graces of Menzies, Hawlke and Beazley if you have so much love for Rhodes scholars.

    Its hard to win that scholarship and I have the greatest respect for all who have done so

  91. It is quite funny though, Abbott was given a situation that even Hewson wouldn’t have screwed up. Hung parliment with a Govt bringing in policy that was unpopluar with the full weight of Newcorp kicking the shit out of it. And Abbott lost ground…bwahahahahahaha.:mrgreen:

  92. Many choose not to noticed, but Abbott has not won one round in the last two or more years. The only claim to fame, he had was the polls. That success is disappearing fast.

    We have seen in the last two days, with Abbott absent, there is no obvious talent to take over.

  93. Like I said an answer for everything….You talk to people about what they want from the net? Most people like you, use 10 % of the capability of their technology, because they are unaware of what is possible. Iain live in the dark ages where you belong. There is no point in me educating you because you just don’t want to know. If you don’t understand a service model or the service industry, decentralisation, remote diagnostics and what a cottage industry is, obviously you don’t understand business. Like Miglo I have worked at the top of my game actually building things that have enabled industry, defence, science, education and social advancement beyond the scope of your narrow vision and feeble understanding ….Telecom, Jtec, Price Waterhouse, Scitec, Defence, brag brag blah blah….

    Iain when you have a Vagina you can spout your expert opinion on abortion, until then shut the fuck up…Its highly offensive. If you like I know a bloke that could organise one for you because their are a few people here that would love to see you go fuck yourself you misogynous dick…..Yes seeing to treat me with such disrespect I return the complement. There is a reason that conduit is dormant next to your house Iain..The lineys think your a knob.

    Carry on being ordinary Ian it becomes you.

    Catching Up: Thanks…Your Gorgeous
    Miglo, you have my utter respect, we need more people in the world like you.

  94. Miglo, you must feel as if you have been gazumped. Maybe you should rent the site out. I have had a weekend at family wedding. Do not feel too generous or being nice to all. Sorry.

  95. This has certainly been an interesting read this afternoon (thanks in large part to the combination of ians avatar and the scroll wheel) and Kitkats colourful dialogue.

    Fucken Brilliant! 🙂

    Reminded me of this

  96. I think that there should be a cost benifit analysis on the installation of telephone wire nationally done NOW. How much money did that little bit of infrastructure bring in that was not even fathomed at the time of implementation. Now apply the same percentage to the NBN, or even a quarter of the percentage and see if the NBN makes money. Just build tha bloody thing ffs!!!!!!!

  97. ACADEMICS from the Melbourne University law school have written an open letter blaming some federal MPs for encouraging the sexist abuse on social media aimed at Prime Minister Julia Gillard.

    http://www.couriermail.com.au/news/national/academics-point-finger-at-mps-for-encouraging-sexist-abuse-on-social-media-aimed-at-julia-gillard/story-fndo1wyv-1226476167780

    Personally, I think it is a shame they just didn’t cut to the chase and say ‘Grow the Fuck up libs’

  98. That is good, Miglo. Would hate to see you displaced.

    We have the main contenders back in the house tomorrow.

    The poor, younger Bishop will have to move back to her regular seat. Deputy not too impressed with her effort over the last couple of days.

    I think Hockey might have blew his chance as well. Then we had Mr. Truss line up, soon put back in his place. Pyne had plenty to whine about.

    Then we have the handbag brigade on the warpath. Abbott better be careful.

  99. the handbag brigade

    ROFL

    I wonder if it ever entered into tabots consciousness as his fist were flying all those years ago that a ‘handbag brigade’ would feature so prominently in his political future, and hopefully downfall

    I don’t know who came up with that title (it was in QT wasn’t it?) but it is a pearler, and just has to get under his skin.

  100. The biggest problem in being a conservative is that ultimately you are protecting sometthing that progressives implemented twenty years ago.

  101. It came from some woman on the Opposition side. Could have been the one that took over from Costello. Not sure though.

    Ms. Roxon said she was not too fussed, it is a part of the rough and tumble of politics.

    I am sure she had trouble not bursting out laughing.

    Have not seen any of them with handbags come to think of it. Maybe a brifcase, never a handbag. Which most women know, are only a nuisance.

  102. Maybe the Liberal women are a little jealous of the success of the Labor women, who are positions of real power.

  103. Personally don’t give a damn what your name is, just going on your pompous know all libturd attitude to everyone here smells of untruths…I will continue to believe it is not your name. Even the Iain is pompous…but as you are in your decline it matters not…time is your enemy not Labor.

  104. Hello everybody I havent posted here for a while. Good to see the polls tightening up and some of the bluster from the conservatives becoming more shrill than usual. About time too.

  105. Re the handbag brigade..it is a term the Tory Opposition have conjured up in reference to the Govt female Ministers, according to my chat with a male Minister. Fits the childish immature rubbish the Tories have been reduced to. The unhinging continues at a pace

  106. The libs came up with that ya reckon CU. That is so cool. I reckon Labor should run with it, cos it’ll just piss tabot off no end. And I reckon it’s hilarious.

    But then again, my sense of humour is a little on the weird side 😉

  107. Like private school bullies picking on people in the corridor between period, nah the opposition would never resort to that…hang on!!!!

  108. Fits the childish immature rubbish the Tories have been reduced to

    Seems I was correct about my sense of humour lol 😉

  109. Catching Up…. as Abbotts political idol, Mrs Thatcher was a constant handbag user, I am surprised he would allow the term, but as they are devoid of any constructive ideas, any port in a storm. Incidentally his Chief of Staff is believed to be pregnant, much is already being made of it. I cannot imagine why 🙂

  110. Tom, I agree. It highlights the strength of women in Labor. They hold most of the leading jobs, in both houses. The Coalition cannot lay a glove on any. They sure try hard with Senator Wong.

    I do not see anything in the name to be ashamed of.

    We all share the same humour, I suspect.

    The one I like today, is promoting Abbott as caring and generous. Is not the PM a caring person. Well that is the way the PM comes across to me. Does not have to me promoted in that role.

  111. What about Abbott and pairing?? 100 years of good vibe flushed with one oppostion leader. Precedent is set. Wreck the joint is an understatement.

  112. The tightening of the polls has caused for more problems for an Abbott lead opposition than it seems at first look. First, as Antony Green’s blog points out http://blogs.abc.net.au/antonygreen/2012/09/which-party-wants-an-early-election.html#more
    you will not be hearing the boring calls for an ‘immediate election’. This would lock in a very hostile senate for sometime (about 12 months to the next half senate election).
    Second, as Andrew Probyn pointed out a few weeks ago much of the heavy policy work for the opposition is in resinding legislation this will require a very large victory. With the polls this close even a loss for a labor lead government would put almost everything in the too hard basket.
    Third, The Abbott lead government if it were to come to pass has talked about going to a double dissolution to put in place its agenda. Think about this, Cambell Newman reduces the public work force by thousands and loses a substantial amount of popularity. This is the first thing that Joe Hockey wants to do with the federal pubic service. Now, after slicing the employment and antagonising broad swaths of the work force they head off to an election!! Its just not going to happen. Therefore, the very effective Gillard Government reforms and legacy will remain in tack no matter what the outcome of the next election. Of course, the next election is almost a year away and any thing can happen. But the liberal latham experiment looks to be unravelling and so progressive voters like myself are feeling just that little bit happier. I hope the brutal words of previous political misogynistic discourse is now at an end. We all live in hope.

  113. Just watch replay of Meet the Press. It was put forwarded that most of Labor’s cuts in employment are real productivity gains., Such as paying Medicare payments straight into ones bank. They have been introducing new technology to make the cuts.

    Where as the states have been cutting Willy nilly and that does not work.

    Maybe Miglo would have some input into that proposition.

  114. The last 2 days of QT have been interesting in that the Coalition had a series of shadow ministers trying to lead the attack. What a joy for Abbott, his team was very disappointing. Not one of them showed potential as a potential LOTO. The new pressure for Abbott will come from the backbenchers, every one of them would be thinking “I could do better than that”. Not least of all the member for Higgins, kellie o’dwyer, she who was upset by the term “hide”.

  115. Iain says….Off to bed now see ya all in the morning…oh aren’t we lucky,
    Russell in Glendale, totally agree…two words well three actually..Dr John Hewson as Kit Kat stated (cracked me up) This guy makes John Howard look like Simon the Likeable from Get Smart.

  116. Scott Morrison may have tickets on himself and the Cori Bernardi’s would back him, but voters?
    Scott Morrison he who complained that a child was flown from xmas island to Sydney for the funeral of his family. Yep a great choice for next LOTO, I hope that happens

  117. Cu, in order to meet the severe budget cuts, departments had no option but to consider ways of increasing productivity by other means considering the decrease in personnel.

    Unfortunately, in a timid response to the media’s and the Opposition’s demand that we return to a surplus, a lot of jobs aren’t being replaced once the position becomes vacant.

  118. Miglo, I assume that one cannot get the same productivity gains with cut and burn, as the states are doing.

    Following what you have said, there cannot be any fat there for Abbott to cut. One cannot go down the path he plans without sending Canberra and other places into recession and cutting services.

  119. Kitkat @ 7:45 pm

    Iain, flaccid comeback champ, off to bed and get some strength buddy lol 😆

    Morning KK up and ready to take on you minions of the dark-side 😉
    Kitkat @ 7:52 pm

    You were the one insisting that the man is stupid and when I point out that is very wrong you blow a gasket.

    Blow a gasket or point out the obvious, here take your pick champ, and yes he is stupid.

    In politics only a fool underestimates the players on the other side, say anything about Abbott’s politics and how much you disagree with them but surely you are better than insisting that Abbott is “stupid”. Hmm maybe not

    paulwello @ 7:52 pm

    Off to bed to have w#t dreams of his hero ABBOTT

    Well even that would be preferable to having wet dreams about Julia, or worse yet Christine Milne


    Catching up @ 8:01 pm

    So stupid, he cannot see it. That is what makes it so funny.

    🙄 you can do better than that CU


    Kitkat @ 8:02 pm

    It is quite funny though, Abbott was given a situation that even Hewson wouldn’t have screwed up. Hung parliment with a Govt bringing in policy that was unpopluar with the full weight of Newcorp kicking the shit out of it. And Abbott lost ground…bwahahahahahaha.:mrgreen:

    Given the depths to which Gillard has taken Labor in the Polls it was inevitable that there should be some bounce at the bottom even if it is just a bounce of the dead cat variety.

    Catching up @ 8:10 pm

    Many choose not to noticed, but Abbott has not won one round in the last two or more years. The only claim to fame, he had was the polls. That success is disappearing fast.

    We have seen in the last two days, with Abbott absent, there is no obvious talent to take over.

    There is lots of talent in the parliament in all parties C U and only a partisan fool pretends otherwise

    Miglo @ 8:12 pm

    I’m thinking of renaming this thread to “Tony Abbott and Iain Hall versus the Universe”. 😈

    What an honour, thanks for that kind thought Migs 😀

    Ricky J Pannowitz @ 8:27 pm

    Like I said an answer for everything….You talk to people about what they want from the net? Most people like you, use 10 % of the capability of their technology, because they are unaware of what is possible.

    You have it Ricky, even though you don’t see what the truth you have enunciated is. May point is that for most people the utility of the internet is in the simple but useful things that can be done with it. Your problem is the standard “geek/nerd” blindness to what is needed as opposed to what is possible.

    Iain live in the dark ages where you belong. There is no point in me educating you because you just don’t want to know.

    I am quite computer literate when it comes down to it but I’m also a very practical man who actually makes things from concept to finished item, my ride is an example of this and making things like that car has taught me the value of simplicity and focus on the purpose

    If you don’t understand a service model or the service industry, decentralisation, remote diagnostics and what a cottage industry is, obviously you don’t understand business.

    This is where you are wrong Ricky I understand all of those things well enough but I don’t think that you have a clue beyond the Geeky technophiles slogans that you sprout.

    Like Miglo I have worked at the top of my game actually building things that have enabled industry, defence, science, education and social advancement beyond the scope of your narrow vision and feeble understanding ….Telecom, Jtec, Price Waterhouse, Scitec, Defence, brag brag blah blah….

    Well I respect Migs much more than I respect you because he has the good graces of a gentleman You on the other had lack any good graces at all. that said its obvious to me that you are far too much in love with the technology to apreciate where it fits within a viable society. Perhaps you need to consider if the technology should be our slave ( my position) or our master (which is how I see your sycophantic ranting about it)

    Iain when you have a Vagina you can spout your expert opinion on abortion, until then shut the fuck up…Its highly offensive. If you like I know a bloke that could organise one for you because their are a few people here that would love to see you go fuck yourself you misogynous dick…..Yes seeing to treat me with such disrespect I return the complement. There is a reason that conduit is dormant next to your house Iain..The lineys think your a knob.

    Are the unborn not human Ricky? Are you and I as men also human ? Is that a Yes I hear? Well then I will argue for the protection of the unborn for as long as I please. What is really offensive is self-hating men like yourself who have ceded the argument on abortion not because they have any principles but because they are afraid to stand up to the murderous feminists who think that women should have the unfettered right to kill the unborn right up until they are full term. My position is very accommodating of the reality that Abortion can sometimes be justified but there are clear instances when it is just murder for the crime of being “inconvenient”.

    Carry on being ordinary Ian it becomes you.

    The truly humble do not despise being ordinary Ricky, only the arrogant like you do that.

  120. Do not have to do better. One only needs to keep to the facts.

    If there is talent in the Opposition, they are keeping it well hidden. Maybe you with your superior intellect can let us into their secrets.

    Maybe Ricky left out, that what you have delivers porn, another interest I believe.

    There is much more to the NBNco than being computer literate, Then you share with Mr. Abbott, a dislike of experts, knowing that one does not need expers to be informed.

    I long with every thing else, you are a pest. You have a hide inches thick, that nothing seems to penetrate.

    Once again, you have attacked those on this site. Once again, I am doing like.

    This is fun, maybe that is what drives you, You just like be a nuisance.

  121. Whew, that’s a lotta scrolling for this time of the day 😦

    a scatty, policy-free reactionary Opposition is going to be carved up by a government that only has to stay on its feet to look like geniuses by comparison.

    http://andrewelder.blogspot.com.au/2012/09/some-sort-of-correction.html

    It really is beginning to look like both the libs and their media mates hadn’t banked on the Governmnet lasting this long. It’s all unchartered territory for them from here (for the rest of us, it’s just a case of ‘back to normal’ hopefully, you know, policy discussions etc)

    It also appears that comments made by bloggers months ago (I think Min was the first I read using this label) is being noted amongst more mainstream commentators. Sheesh they’re slow somwtimes 😉

    Has Gillard done the rope-a-dope on Abbott?

    http://www.abc.net.au/unleashed/4266294.html

    Mind you, these ones reckon Gillard just fell into this, which I guess is partly true, she couldn’t do it if tabot had another plan other than trying to land roundhouse blows. But, she herself has played it slow and steady the whole time, laying the foundations for a strong run into the election, while tabot has flailed around wildy, and pretty much relied on the great big tax as his only real landing punch. Now that punch is gone, he’s just swatting at her now. And her jabs are starting to show on him

  122. “who think that women should have the unfettered right to kill the unborn right up until they are full term”

    Where up to full term came into the equation is a new one on me.

    I have news for you, women have had abortions for centuries, long before feminists existed,

    Feminist have not made your world worse. They have only pointed out that women were not getting a fair deal, and decided to do something about it.

    Whether it is seen as murder, depends on your view. Yes,, others opinions can also be correct.

    For the record, I have not met any woman that does not find abortion hard, or a easy decision to make.

    Of course, you as a superior male, be challenge this.

    Most woman, especially in the past, made that decision because the male let them down.

    Then, Iain, you believe you have the right to judge all. Where this right came from, is beyond me.

  123. Tom R, they were so sure of their ability to bring down the PM, that anything went. They did not care, as they believed their actions would not ever be scrutinise.

    By the time the chickens came home to roost, they would be in power.

    Trouble is that has not occurred. They now have no backup plan. They have to explain all the lies, all the exaggerations and all the bullshit. They now have to answer questions. The slogans and three word sentences no longer work.

    The PM has done as she promised. The PM has the runs on the board. The PM is setting in place, the agenda for the next elections.

  124. Kitkat @ 7:19 am

    Back to bed Iain, try again tomorrow.

    The day is young KK and the sun is shining so it looks like it will be a beautiful day why should I not enjoy a bit of sport?

    Catching up@ 7:25 am

    Do not have to do better. One only needs to keep to the facts.

    In your case the facts are not enough CU you need to also prove the rellevence of thise facts

    If there is talent in the Opposition, they are keeping it well hidden. Maybe you with your superior intellect can let us into their secrets.

    There are none so blind as those who will not see

    Maybe Ricky left out, that what you have delivers porn, another interest I believe.

    I’m a bloke C U and I won’t pretend that I don’t enjoy the sight of a pretty girl

    There is much more to the NBNco than being computer literate, Then you share with Mr. Abbott, a dislike of experts, knowing that one does not need experts to be informed.

    I don’t dislike experts CU I just won’t genuflect to anyone on the basis of their “expert” ststus.

    I long with every thing else, you are a pest. You have a hide inches thick, that nothing seems to penetrate.

    Well why don’t you stop wasting your time trying to insult me and addres my arguments instead 😉

    Once again, you have attacked those on this site. Once again, I am doing like.

    This is fun, maybe that is what drives you, You just like be a nuisance.

    You need to consider who throws the first stone before you try to claim the moral high ground CU .

  125. Catching up @ 7:49 am

    “who think that women should have the unfettered right to kill the unborn right up until they are full term”

    Where up to full term came into the equation is a new one on me.

    Read the arguments from the activists and it is clear that they see no limit to a woman’s “right to choose”

    I have news for you, women have had abortions for centuries, long before feminists existed,

    Sure I know that and for centuries it has been abhorrent

    Feminist have not made your world worse. They have only pointed out that women were not getting a fair deal, and decided to do something about it.

    I tend to agree with you on that , with some qualification, mainly about those who don’t want equality but a reversal of the paradigm so that the feminine is supreme.

    Whether it is seen as murder, depends on your view. Yes,, others opinions can also be correct.

    My position is simply that I think that abortion should be available ,affordable and safe but most importantly RARE and it should never be viewed as a post facto method of contraception.

    For the record, I have not met any woman that does not find abortion hard, or a easy decision to make.

    It should never be an “easy decision” because in involves the killing of a human being,

    Of course, you as a superior male, be challenge this.

    No I don’t

    Most woman, especially in the past, made that decision because the male let them down.

    No they did it because they were stupid or foolish not to believe that sex had consequences

    Then, Iain, you believe you have the right to judge all. Where this right came from, is beyond me.

    We all judge C U why should I be any different?

  126. Greg Hunt’s carbon illusion

    The opposition have two policies out there, and neither are getting any real scrutiny. One is a great big tax on business that will effect them far more than the Carbon Price and the other is the very flawed Direct Action plan.

    It’s good to see that slowly but surly attention is being put on opposition policy, scan as they are, and this is as it should be.

    And every time scrutiny of opposition policy, or should that be brain farts, is undertaken they are found to be wanting.

  127. Something that seems to be overlooked in the NBN debate is the fact (?) that big chunks of the old copper network have pretty much reached the end of its life and need to be replaced anyway.

    I remember a mate of mine in network design telling me that Telstra would sometimes not bother repairing a node-to-house connection but would provide the customer with a wireless set-up instead where feasible. He said the copper network was more trouble than it was worth and Telstra would be glad to get rid of it. That was long before NBN came on the scene.

    If that is the case, then it wouldn’t make much sense to replace the old copper with new copper when fibre is probably comparable in price (for similar capacity) and digging costs would be the same.

    I imagine operating costs (energy) and maintenance of fibre would be a fraction of copper.

    No doubt many folk, like Iain, will still only use their internet connection for email and low bandwidth applications, and provided they don’t have to pay more than they do now for the unused capacity of the new fibre network, then there shouldn’t be a problem.

    I’ve only participated in a tele-lecture once (at the Mackay campus of UCQ) but I’d love to have an at-home capacity to access inter-active lectures on a range of subjects that interest me. And fibre’s going to give me that. Personally, I can’t wait.

    Ricky, at the risk of being accused of feeding you a Dorothy Dix-er, I’d welcome your comments on the above.

  128. I think this is trying to say, that everyone’s view is OK. Often there is no right or wrong. It is natural to differ. Saying something different, does not automatically make one right. Many just see things differently.

    “4. If I’m making an argument, do I actually know how to make an argument?
    […]in my experience the single most common bad argument is the assumption that one’s personal experience is universal rather than intensely personal and anecdotal. Sorry, folks: you are probably not actually the living avatar of What Everyone Believes and Knows.”

    http://hoydenabouttown.com/20120919.12317/scalzi-on-being-a-good-commentor/?utm_source=feedburner&utm_medium=feed&utm_campaign=Feed%3A+HoydenAboutTown+%28Hoyden+About+Town%29

  129. There is growing neurological evidence demonstrating that the way in which we make judgements and decisions is less rational than we like to think and is enormously complex. Decision-making is fraught precisely because of the way in which we draw on emotion and previous experience that generate preference, rather than examining the facts with any conviction. Stereotyping, racial bias, and misogyny are classic negative examples of this phenomenon. A convenient belief will trump facts any time.

    and

    Leaders are no less prone to these basic human traits. The different might be that the impact of poor judgements and decision-making might be greater than for others. Let me give a couple of examples. Our previous experience and preferences can affect our choice of leadership style that might be quite ineffective but we ignore what research might tell us about leadership effectiveness and carry on regardless. The same can be said for the way in which participative process is often ignored in organisations despite the fact that it leads to better outcomes. Leaders are great at locking onto a fad or a sharp talking consultant with a cookie-cutter solution to all problems. They eschew the evidence that demonstrates that all solutions need to be custom-made to acknowledge the hopeless complexity of nearly everything.

    http://noplaceforsheep.com/2012/09/19/an-inconvenient-belief/

  130. Surly is apt.

    What Abbott and the Coalition want to throw out the door in taking us backwards. Worse they will make Australia a pariah in the world and more than likely penalised for not undertaking measures other countries we trade with are.

    China Creates Carbon Calculator to Show Effect of Energy Policy
    Scotland’s Salmond Sees More Renewables Investments This Year
    Distributed Generation Will Make Electric Grids More Secure, Expand Access
    The Big Question: What Can We Expect over the Next 12 Months?

    …and much much more. The movement out there to reducing carbon, with or without governments, and towards renewable energy is growing apace, but as a portent to an Abbott led government, the Liberal State governments are destroying our moves towards that future.

    Utter stupidity in the extreme and such unbelievable short sightedness that will Australia so much and take decades to remediate.

  131. “In your case the facts are not enough CU you need to also prove the rellevence of thise facts”

    “Only in my case.”

    I suggest this action begins with you.

    As for what I said, still stands, you are a nuisance and a pest. The proof can be found within what you write, in copious amounts,

    That is interesting, you like a pretty girl, and turn to porn. Something wrong there, not quite sure what.

    So, you like experts, but I assume, only the ones that agree with you. Please tell me who or what you defer to.

    Yes, I agree with you. It is impossible to insult you, as your ego is just too enormous. Nothing gets through it. Like you, I do not mind a little sport also.

    You intend to stick around no matter what. May as well have some fun.

    No high moral ground here. I am not the one spouting morals. I will leave that up to you.

    As for the first stone, no misunderstanding there, that honour belongs to you.

    “No they did it because they were stupid or foolish not to believe that sex had consequences”

    This one is beyond belief. What role did the man play. If might interest you to know, contraceptives do not always work. And that is not taking the high moral ground.

    No, we do not all judge.

    Most stick to making judgements on comments made.

    Some are just happy to point out a differing view. In fact, I cannot think of any regular on this site that does judge.

    You are the chief offender in this matter.

    What many are saying, they do not relish being dissected and judged.

    In your case I make an exception. I believe in doing to others, as they do to me.

    it will be interesting to see who gives up first.

    You have a sad view and opinion of humanity, You appear to only see everything in the negative.

  132. Jeez troll you are a wanker. Think your droppings dont stink and expert at everything master of none. No wonder you spend your time on blogs, you wouldnt survive in the real world. Big noting self confessed perfectionists such as your worthless self are despicable. I refuse to spend more time in your pathetic world.

  133. The copper wire is at the end of its useful life. it has reach it limits. I moved into a house with my son a few years ago. Ordered two lines to be connected. Was clear that I wanted to use one for what was available at the time. dial up broadband,

    What we got was one line split. It was a slow as hell. It cost was the same as two separate lines. I would have been just as well off with one line and two outlets.

    When I moved into my own home, on a new estate, with a brand new line, the first thing I did was to connect the computer. Whole and behold, my Internet speed doubled,

    When I first signed up to ADSL2 my speed was double what it is now. I was among the first to be connected. So much for copper wire.

    They reckon the maintenance for copper will be a billion dollars a year. Fibre, very little.

    I believe the uploads and downloads are both fast. There is no limit to what fibre can carry. Distance from the exchange does not count.

    Why would one hook the latest technology up to the technology of nearly a century ago.

    Does one hook up copper pipes to crapped out, rusty galvanise pipes to save a little money.

    Yes, this will cost more. It will be a superior service. it will be cheaper to maintain. It will meet the nations needs well into the future.

    How can that be wrong. How can it be wasteful.

    In the long run, it will be more economical.

  134. Thanks for that terrific link ME.

    Everything I wanted to know, and more !

    It’s funny, I’ve just accepted the concept of the NBN as a no-brainer without so much as 5 minutes research (despite having a minor qualification in industrial electronics…or maybe because of).

    “No-brainer” really doesn’t do it justice.

  135. So a liveable wage for childcare workers is waste, according to Mr. Abbott. Listening to the Liberals during the week. They intend to mount a campaign of this governments spending. The fact that it is spent on what many believe is essentials, and will lead to productivity gains, is of little importance to them. It just sounds good. Not much else left in their armour. Their cupboard is bare.

    Opposition Leader Tony Abbott says a $1.4 billion government plan to fund wage rises for private childcare workers is another example of Labor spending like drunken sailors

    http://bigpondnews.com/articles/Politics/2012/09/19/Abbott_slams_childcare_wages_fund_plan_796546.html

  136. OMG, Right Wing projection at its finest.

    Renewed speculation surplus in doubt

    So the government identifying savings and putting out costings are unfunded promises but the Coalition saying they will find $70 billion, trust us.

    Twitter is going haywire at the moment against the Coalition. I’ve never seen this amount of scrutiny and inspection of them before. I can’t keep up with the links and articles, incredible.

  137. Well, we have been told.

    LIBERAL Senator Cory Bernardi has suggested legalising same sex marriage would lead to demands for bestiality to also be sanctioned.
    Speaking in Parliament last night on a gay marriage bill sponsored by four Labor senators, Senator Bernardi said the push for same-sex marriage was part of an attack on ”our enduring institutions.”

    Senator Cory Bernardi. Photo: Andrew Meares
    ”It is another chip in the fabric of our social mores,” he said. ”The time has come to ask, when will it end? If we are prepared to redefine marriage … what is the next step?”
    Advertisement
    ”The next step … is having three people that love each other should be able to enter into a permanent union endorsed by society, or four people. There are even some creepy people out there, who say that it’s OK to have consensual sexual relations between humans and animals. Will that be a future step?”
    Labor Senator Helen Polley also spoke against the bill. She said two-thirds of the correspondence she had received on the issue had urged her to oppose change. She read aloud a letter from a constituent which said same-sex marriage could ”create another stolen generation by putting adult desires above the needs of children”.

    Sue Boyce: ‘I support the intention of the bill.’ Photo: Paul Harris
    But another Labor senator, Doug Cameron, said arguments about children being disadvantaged by being brought up be same-sex couples ”denies the reality of some children facing absolutely terrible lives with heterosexual couples”.
    Labor Senator John Faulkner said the debate was not really about the value of marriage, or its role in society. ”It is a debate on the simple question of whether it is right for a government to deny some of its citizens access to a secular, government-recognised status on the basis of the gender of the person they choose to share their life with,” he said.

    Read more: http://www.smh.com.au/opinion/political-news/bestiality-enters-gay-wed-debate-20120918-264qn.html#ixzz26rvxcK1T

  138. So with the Carbon Price attack turning into a tiny limp dick turkey slap of no consequence or importance it seems the opposition are now turning their attack to government spending, as witnessed by Abbott’s lame presser and Hockey’s interview of Right Wing projection.

    As that video show for the opposition to go down that road they must have alternatives and costings of their own, trust us doesn’t cut the mustard I’m afraid.

    And thus the opposition comes a cropper because they have wasted the last two plus years on Abbott’s negativity instead of developing alternate policies and proving they can govern.

    It’s also a massive admission that Abbott has failed and is a failure, something we have known all along and been espousing loud and clear out of all the banal and meaningless clutter of the Right Wing zombie trolls.

    Well done Whisperers, TPS, Politically Homeless and the other stalwarts not giving up on the outing of Abbott and the opposition for who they really, are and not allowing them to get away with being lazy whilst attempting a snow job on Australia.

  139. Hey whisperers, I have said on a number of occasions that all that the trolls add is length to the page.

    dafid1, you are dead right…Blah Blah Blah..wank wank wank…Blah Blah Blah… scroll the troll. 😆 👿 😆

    And now for something completely different, I wrote this late last night and posted it on TPS, but with the frustration showing I thought that a bit of light relief might help!

    What A Joke the LNP are.

    What a joke the LNP are….. they really aren’t that smart
    Their federal leader… Abbott….does nothing but brain fart
    Misogynist and pugilist… he’s good at punching walls
    But as far as women and policy… he really has no balls

    His deputy the Bishop… says the Tony that I know
    Volunteers with local fire-ies… to put on quite a show
    He guides the blind through marathons… and walks on water too
    But Bishop.. just like Abbott.. is full of cattle poo

    Pyne enunciated the same script.. falling prostrate to the floor
    While proving once and for all time… he’s Abbotts little hoar
    He’s called the mincing poodle.. and he’s great at dummy spits
    But as leader of opposition business.. he gives everyone the shits

    Rolley poley Hockey… the alternate treasurer man
    Proves that numbers aren’t his forte…dragging figures from the can
    Claiming economic management… is the LNPs great strength
    While to hide his budget black hole.. he will go to any length

    Their antics in the question time… are legendary for sure
    Like the time that Thomson sent Pyne and Abbot.. running for the door
    And asking.. nothing much of relevance… but always calling for a vote
    To suspend the standing orders…their stupidity to promote

    Abetz their senate leader… is a man with little cred
    Taking fact and truth and reason…and putting them to bed
    Opting rather for the spin and lies.. that set the libs apart
    Coming second to the Abbott… in the stakes for best brain fart

    And they talk the talk with slogans… and abuse our great PM
    Using lies and obfuscation to turn attention… away from them
    But when they’re asked the tougher questions.. then it ceases to be fun
    So instead of walking the walk.. the bastards turn their backs and run

    In Victoria.. there’s Ted Ballieu… causing death by a thousand cuts
    To the public service sector… by his right wing bag of nuts
    And in New South Wales it’s O’Farrell…with his promises all shot
    A hundred and thirty and counting… means he’s lied an awful lot

    With Campbell Newman.. the new kid on the block… cutting services galore
    Pushing that tired old right wing chestnut….. that less is really more
    Telling lies about the economy using books Costello cooked
    While his model’s admired by Hockey and Abbott with both completely hooked

    Under Labors financial management… the GFC we dodged
    But with Abbott and his cronies.. all we’ll get is figures bodged
    And so give the reigns of power… to this rabble if you dare
    But don’t risk it if you have regard.. for our… Australia.. fair

    Cheers 😆 🙄 😆

  140. Different version

    Federal Treasurer Wayne Swan has dismissed reports the government will top up the wages of low-paid childcare workers.

    ‘There is no basis in fact for these reports at all,’ he told reporters in Canberra on Wednesday.

    Both Fairfax Media and News Ltd on Wednesday said Prime Minister Julia Gillard was set to announce a deal that would subsidise the pay of childcare workers, costing the budget $1.4 billion a year.

    Other Labor MPs also played down the reports.

    Assistant Treasurer David Bradbury insisted they were inaccurate, but would not specify how.

    ‘I’m not going to go into detail about that,’ he told reporters.

    He stressed there had been no government policy decisions on the matter.

    Asked whether the $1.4 billion would come from tax increases or service cuts, Mr Bradbury said: ‘We’re not going to get into the business of ruling things in or ruling things out.

    ‘That would be irresponsible.’

    http://bigpondnews.com/articles/TopStories/2012/09/19/Swan_dismisses_childcare_top-up_reports_796582.html

  141. The alternative

    The Deputy Leader, Julie Bishop, hit back by telling her party room the character assassination of Abbott was entirely predictable, and in question time a Liberal backbencher, Kelly O’Dwyer, denounced the ”handbag hit squad” of Labor women who led attacks against Abbott.

    It was a catchy phrase, and elicited amusing images of Tanya Plibersek and Nicola Roxon using their Louis Vuitton totes (or are they cross-the-body satchel types?) to wallop enemies.
    The Deputy Speaker, Anna Burke, who is stuck in a nightmare of unknowable length until the Speaker, Peter Slipper, returns and relieves her from her post, could have done with a handbag-size weapon, or at the very least a hip flask in her handbag, to help control her charges.

    Read more: http://www.smh.com.au/opinion/political-news/parties-get-out-of-hand-as-soon-as-leaders-turn-their-backs-20120918-264tc.html#ixzz26riWSp1F

    ——-

    http://www.yourdemocracy.net.au/drupal/node/21267

  142. Sue, I believe it will be the label of “sook” that does the most damage.

    Pyne should allow some of the insults to go over their heads.

    it reminds me of that annoying kid in the playground, that is always crying, he hit me. She hit me, to the teacher.

    They are easily offended, when one compares with what the government and PM take, with little complaint.

  143. Well Iain frankly you are quite obviously mentally ill and need to seek help. I have seen these patterns before. I urge you to have a good look at yourself and your actions.

    You are completely irrational, on a crusade in a thread against everything. If you are taking the piss that’s all well and good but I am actually concerned.

    The stark contrast between us is not political Iain. I admit when I am wrong. I quote from truths to support my opinions founded on those truths within the scope of my understanding based in critical thinking. I offer real world experience based on what I have done. My circle of friends is vast, of different ethnicities, different religions and political ideologies. They are academics, executives and tradies. I can be sarcastic and take the piss, that’s fun as is like minded banter. I never, ever make assumptions.

    Example… I’m in love with technology, impractical…blah. Well Iain I was employed and paid big money to design costed business efficiencies for corporations and government using technology, who I can assure you do not part with money easily. I teach elderly people how to use computers and technology. I show people how to utilise technology to enrich their lives. Your world is your world, you’re not a technologist, you don’t understand me or what I do. You are incapable of understanding what I know because if it was so you would have displayed it to me with fact, just as don’t understand what Miglo knows who called you on it. You just make assumptions. This is my world; these are my life experiences. You have no idea who I am, what I’ve done and your responses are embarrassingly ridiculous….Quote. Opinion, quote opinion.

    I have not written this lightly. I have read all your responses to me and each response has no fact, just opinion. Iain ask yourself is this acceptable behaviour, is this critical thinking? I apologise for being condescending but your responses are simplistic, ignorant and somewhat embarrassing.
    Dogged negative opposition to everything at odds with ideology won’t work for Abbott and it’s a particularly bad look for you. This is especially pertinent when you speak about things of which you are clearly clueless.

    I hope you are just taking the piss as if you are not, seek some help as you need it. It is clear to me you have a pattern of lying and delusional dogmatic behaviour that is unhealthy. Write what you like Iain, I’m done. Paste a little quote and write a predictable baseless opinion after it, knock yourself out. If you feel you have won and showed me, then more power to you.

    I will not engage with you further to encourage self-destructive behaviour.
    Please seek help.

    Sincerely
    Ricky

  144. Ricky J, that is what he actually does he is a professional troll, look up his name, he has been banned from several sites for doing exactly the same thing here, once went by the name “niceperpson”. every other site he does exactly the same, opinions with nothing to back them up, never admitting he is wrong and even denying he ever said it sometimes.

    he is just BLAH BLAH BLAH

  145. …the Government has made itself hostage to higher commodity price./em>

    Laughed pretty hard over that one.

    Hockey, that wouldn’t be the commodity price that a great chunk of your phoney costings relied on?

    Those wouldn’t be the commodity prices that underpinned the entire second half of Howard’s reign now would they, and were the only things that kept that government viable as it allowed infrastructure and services to crumble whilst handing out massive chunks of public money as middle and upper class welfare?

    Joke doesn’t get close to describing that interview with Hockey projecting for all he was worth.

  146. This says it all “Bernardi under fire for bestiality comments”

    Speaking in Parliament last night on a gay marriage bill sponsored by four Labor senators, Senator Bernardi said the push for same-sex marriage was part of an attack on “our enduring institutions”.
    “It is another chip in the fabric of our social mores,” he said. “The time has come to ask, when will it end? If we are prepared to redefine marriage … what is the next step?”
    “The next step … is having three people that love each other should be able to enter into a permanent union endorsed by society, or four people. There are even some creepy people out there, who say that it’s OK to have consensual sexual relations between humans and animals. Will that be a future step?”
    Liberal frontbencher Joe Hockey has called for a “measured and sensitive” debate and Greens Senator Richard Di Natale describing the remarks as “offensive and appalling”.
    Australian Marriage Equality convener Alex Greenwich said Senator Bernardi’s comments were extremely predictable, and taken straight from the “American religious right play book”.
    “It’s based on fear, not on facts,” Mr Greenwich said. “There is no international example that backs up what he’s saying.

    Read more: http://www.smh.com.au/opinion/political-news/bernardi-under-fire-for-bestiality-comments-20120919-265dg.html#ixzz26sCoMmYT

  147. Ricky the Logitech AnywhereMX is your friend, though the free wheel mode has been close to burning out lately on the very long crap.

  148. Conservatives Will Never Have “Smart People On Our Side”

    Unfortunately, there are a lot of ians out there 😦

    I hope he is not off to NZ

    😆 😆

  149. Ricky J Pannowitz @ 10:48 am

    Well Iain frankly you are quite obviously mentally ill and need to seek help. I have seen these patterns before. I urge you to have a good look at yourself and your actions.

    What a strange claim to make Ricky (what grown man uses such a child like diminutive?) I like to argue and I make no apology fro that but it does not make me mentally ill, unless you think that being a conservative is a disease that is,

    You are completely irrational, on a crusade in a thread against everything. If you are taking the piss that’s all well and good but I am actually concerned.

    Clearly you have trouble understanding that one does not have to base your values on leftist thought to be correct about society and politics.

    The stark contrast between us is not political Iain. I admit when I am wrong. I quote from truths to support my opinions founded on those truths within the scope of my understanding based in critical thinking.

    Well I do also admit when I am wrong but I make damn sure that my interlocutors have a very strong argument before I concede though. That said can you cite an instance of you admitting an error in your arguments? Because I have not seen it.

    I offer real world experience based on what I have done. My circle of friends is vast, of different ethnicities, different religions and political ideologies. They are academics, executives and tradies. I can be sarcastic and take the piss, that’s fun as is like minded banter. I never, ever make assumptions.

    I don’t believe that you “never make assumptions” as for your claimed friends and associates what does that prove?

    Example… I’m in love with technology, impractical…blah. Well Iain I was employed and paid big money to design costed business efficiencies for corporations and government using technology, who I can assure you do not part with money easily.

    Being employed and being in receipt of “big money” does not prove me wrong about your love of the technology, essentially you would not be good at what you do if you hated the toys that you play with As for your practical abilities well I have not seen any evidence of that.

    I teach elderly people how to use computers and technology. I show people how to utilise technology to enrich their lives. Your world is your world, you’re not a technologist, you don’t understand me or what I do.

    Yeah well my 13 year old daughter helps her Nana out when she is stuck on the computer, sorry but that is not so convincing as to your virtues as a “technologist” Frankly its seems to me that most of what you do is dream of the promise of the new toys and you just refuse to consider what people actually want from the technology.

    You are incapable of understanding what I know because if it was so you would have displayed it to me with fact, just as don’t understand what Miglo knows who called you on it. You just make assumptions. This is my world; these are my life experiences. You have no idea who I am, what I’ve done and your responses are embarrassingly ridiculous….Quote. Opinion, quote opinion.

    You are right that I don’t know “what you know” but I look to the evidence for clues. The evidence is your writing and its amazing just what that tells you about anyone. All of the evidence in your writing is that you clearly have talent in the how of modern technology, heck I admire that sort of expertise but I don’t see any evidence of you having much grasp of “WHY” or any desire to think deeply about the social implications of the technology. Yet in the other thread you were suggesting that old fashioned “chilling” with real people so maybe there is hope for you still.

    I have not written this lightly. I have read all your responses to me and each response has no fact, just opinion. Iain ask yourself is this acceptable behaviour, is this critical thinking? I apologise for being condescending but your responses are simplistic, ignorant and somewhat embarrassing.

    Well blog posts and their comments are conversations rather than scholarly essays and conversations are all about opinion. I struck the same obsession with endless citations when doing literature at Uni why should the opinion of others be any more valid than our individual opinions Ricky? We are after all discussing the social value of the new technology not the design parameters of a machine where empirical data matters.

    Dogged negative opposition to everything at odds with ideology won’t work for Abbott and it’s a particularly bad look for you. This is especially pertinent when you speak about things of which you are clearly clueless.

    I speak about society Ricky and I don’t produce “Dogged negative opposition to everything” there are lots of things that I endorse, heck even some things that this otherwise woeful government has done have earned my tick of approval (like the discouragement of smoking)I’m sorry that I annoy you (hmm not too sorry though 😉 ) but you don’t seem to cope well with being challenged on your assumptions and hopes for a bright new future.

    I hope you are just taking the piss as if you are not, seek some help as you need it. It is clear to me you have a pattern of lying and delusional dogmatic behaviour that is unhealthy.

    Lying??? Oh spare me that sort of crap will you? I am scrupulously honest when I write these responses I am sometimes wrong but that does not make me a liar or delusional.

    Write what you like Iain, I’m done. Paste a little quote and write a predictable baseless opinion after it, knock yourself out. If you feel you have won and showed me, then more power to you.

    Well thanks for that invitation I take it you have read may post this morning then 😉

    I will not engage with you further to encourage self-destructive behaviour.
    Please seek help.

    Sincerely
    Ricky

    😆 that claim is delusional especially the part about “self-destructive behaviour”
    paulwello @ 10:57 am

    Ricky J, that is what he actually does he is a professional troll, look up his name, he has been banned from several sites for doing exactly the same thing here, once went by the name “niceperpson”. every other site he does exactly the same, opinions with nothing to back them up, never admitting he is wrong and even denying he ever said it sometimes.

    Oh Paul I see you have been checking up on me, But a couple of facts for you to consider, firstly I posted anonymously as “niceperson” for about three months and since then I have posted under my own name when writing on the net, three months in the last seven years. Have you actually read what I have posted elsewhere or just the opinions about what I posted? I’m guessing the latter.
    My email is listed on my blog and I will be happy to answer specific queries about my history if you really want to know the truth. My guess is that you don’t care about the truth.

  150. Mig you have been more than patient with this troll, May I suggest it is time for the red line through his name. He has lowered the tenor of the blog to his gutter level and as posters cannot ignore the absurd postings he makes, practically all discussion is being centred on this one idiot. There are many topics we could discuss and comment on without the continual trolling of one poster who knows his craving for attention will ensure he continues his negative approach to attract comment and the circle continues.

  151. Ricky, you have joined the rest of us.

    The problem is not the visitor but yours. The funny thing here, most agree with you and have said so on more than one occasion.

    I have decided I will join in the sport, not that I like being used as a plaything by him. I imagine the sport is football. Plenty of chances to kick the ball around.

    Curious as to what will be his put down this time.

    I think his problem is that he has stayed home too many years to long as parent. Should have looked for other activities when the kids went to school, as most mothers do.

    He has a degree in English Literature and likes to show us his superior literary skills. Shame mine are so poor. Well we cannot all be as clever.

  152. by the way, I find nothing wrong with left wing thought. Makes more sense than that from the right.

    What I do not understand, that he cannot see that we do not accept his values.

  153. Why, visitor, I must be different from most nannies. It is I that sets up the computers. I also make sure, by putting together old machines, that they all have their own machine. It is I, that is called out to removed the virus, only young adolescents can manage to load down.

    Why is it not you that assists nan, you have plenty of free time.

  154. Good on you for rising to the challenge CU but I should point out that my degree is in Drama and “Language in the media” rather than English literature. but You are right about this being my diversion from the rigours of being a house dad, I do it to keep my brain active and I hope with a sense of fun.
    😀

  155. Visitor, what you write here is enough to know what you are about. How many visitors today. Any comments.

    By the way, i am now 71, live alone and sadly have to much time to fill in. Even then I get out to Curves three times a week, by bus. Do little gardening. I do knolw if I had a family, I would not be able to spend the time you do, before your computer.

    The free time you have, fascinates me. At least you have admitted that it was not long lunch breaks that you were posting in, as you did in the past. That must have been a lie, or at least a fib.

  156. So exactly how much is Logitech paying you ME?

    Mate free wheeling mice don’t need paid endorsement when it comes to scroll the troll, especially when the posts are way overly long pieces half full of nothing with the half of substance being the quotes from other posters.

  157. Unbelievable. This from Bolt. The man that has set up the Tea-party in this country. along with Internet sites.

    Cory Bernardi’s clumsy and provocative comments undermined not just an argument but his party, and he’s had to go:
    LIBERAL senator Cory Bernardi has resigned his post as shadow parliamentary secretary to Tony Abbott following his remarks linking gay marriage to bestiality.

    The Opposition Leader said Senator Bernardi had made ill-disciplined remarks and had since offered his resignation.

    In his place, Mr Abbott appointed Senator Arthur Sinodinos as his parliamentary secretary. He also appointed South Australian MP Jamie Briggs as shadow parliamentary secretary for families.

    Damage has been done. But the elevation of Sinodinis is the silver lining, leaving the Opposition lineup looking strong.

    http://blogs.news.com.au/heraldsun/andrewbolt/index.php/heraldsun/comments/bernardi_had_to_go_and_has/

    The vote has risen from 6 to 42. Not a bad result.

  158. opinion The $69.99 unlimited plan revealed by cut-rate ISP TPG yesterday shows what the future of broadband plans on the National Broadband Network will look like, and it’s not good news for premium ISPs such as Telstra, Optus and iiNet.

    Right now, Australia’s cadre of major telecommunications companies are doubtless holding repeated internal meetings as they try and determine just how their pricing models, both external to customers and internal financial modelling for their own profitability, will need to be modified under the drastically changed telecommunications regime being swept into place by Labor’s flagship National Broadband Network project. The conversations are probably going a little like this:

    At Telstra, the company’s executives are probably focused on two main objectives. The first is the need to retain customers under the NBN. There are millions of Australians who have been locked into Telstra’s services for decades now by default, and Telstra wants to make sure it doesn’t lose these customers as the once-in-several-generations NBN migration kicks off. The second objective is all about profit and locking those customers in future — bundling as many services together as possible, from mobile to pay TV to broadband to home phone lines to PVR boxes in the loungeroom — so that Telstra can charge each household one colossal monthly fee.
    http://delimiter.com.au/2012/09/19/tpgs-69-99-unlimited-plan-shows-the-nbn-future/?utm_source=feedburner&utm_medium=feed&utm_campaign=Feed%3A+Delimiter+%28Delimiter%29

  159. Why, visitor, I must be different from most nannies. It is I that sets up the computers. I also make sure, by putting together old machines, that they all have their own machine. It is I, that is called out to removed the virus, only young adolescents can manage to load down. Why is it not you that assists nan, you have plenty of free time.

    Well You are doing better than my wife who has no aptitude for computers at all, as for helping my mother in law I do that when I can but she lives an hour’s drive away but we are great mates even though she is a dyed in the wool lefty not unlike you actually 😉 . You certainly get two ticks of approval! One for being able to fix your own computers and the second for the creative recycling of old machines into things that are useful once again!

    That is very good indeed 8)

  160. Thanks Guys, I will not even dignify any his posts with a read little own a response, he does not exist. Skim right over his ugly mug. Small fish small pond, mentally ill, with a self importance problem. There are some nice people in here who are like minded, I don’t engage lying trolls.

  161. Iain, did it ever cross your mind that you make people feel they are under attack from you? That to continually dissect and be critical of every word they type can only lead to some form of resentment?

    Putting forward an opinion can be done with much more success when it is placed on the table and chewed over rather than throwing it back into people’s faces.

  162. Migs, thanks for your comment and I have always said there’s nothing like a well dipped lid. 🙂

    I nearly choked on my tea when I read that the troll had a degree in english lit.
    The clarification makes more sense, but still proves the argument that I have made many times, that a degree isn’t necessarily worth the paper that it’s written on.

    Case in point. 🙄

    Cheers 😆 😆 😆

  163. Jesus, Iain, are you STILL here annoying these people?

    Don’t you have toy cars to build, PS3 games to play or porn to download?

    Is it any wonder you’re one of the least liked and lowest regarded members of the Australian blogosphere? It can’t all be the work of an evil leftist conspiracy; a large part of it must be down to your own conduct.

  164. Is it any wonder you’re one of the least liked and lowest regarded members of the Australian blogosphere?

    That honour goes to someone else, who praise the Lord doesn’t come here. 😉

  165. Miglo @ 1:20 pm

    Iain, did it ever cross your mind that you make people feel they are under attack from you? That to continually dissect and be critical of every word they type can only lead to some form of resentment?

    Sure I get that Migs but I’m usually responding to multiple people who make many different points that I feel deserve a response, That said the devil is in the detail and I do try to be thorough in what I give in return,

    Putting forward an opinion can be done with much more success when it is placed on the table and chewed over rather than throwing it back into people’s faces.

    Yeah I will try to be more accommodating and less tit fer tat 😉
    Skeptical @ 1:39 pm

    I nearly choked on my tea when I read that the troll had a degree in english lit.
    .

    Yeah I don’t rate my degree that highly either I enjoyed doing it though and it taught me that “Higher Education” can often be very over rated. Still as the first person in my family to get a degree its not something I’m ashamed of either
    Catching up @ 1:46 pm

    Iain, always an excuse. Now does the daughter walk.

    Its not an excuse CU its an explanation! Mother in Law and I talk on the phone all of the time and we share a few interests (like yoga and Art) and I do often go and spend the day fixing things for her, hanging pictures ect. But my daughter is a teenager now and hanging with Nana ain’t that cool to her.

    Peter W. @ 1:49 pm

    Jesus, Iain, are you STILL here annoying these people?

    Are you still writing a blog devoted exclusively to the writings of little old me? Think about it for a minute; If I am as insignificant as you claim then what does that say about you writing a blog entirely devoted tearing me a new one?

  166. Having read David Marr’s Quarterly Essay exposé on Tony Abbott, I am convinced more than ever that the driving force behind Abbott’s almost fanatical obsession to be PM is to turn this country into a Catholic version of Islamic fundamentalism. Anyone who lauds and worships Bob Santamaria is someone who must be feared and loathed by every sane thinking person in this country.
    Marr relates Abbott’s deeply held belief in Catholicism, which in turn has festered his paranoid loathing of gay people and people who don’t agree with him; his aggressive bullying attitude toward women and his fear and hatred of anyone different to his white Australia paradise (refugees). It indicates a man who has deep seated personal problems and whose view of the world is one in which progressive policies hold no place. His extreme right wing philosophy is simply frightening.
    Not once in this current furore regarding his personal sins of the past has Abbott come out and said “I abhor any sort of violence towards women.” He has been far too busy defending himself, saying: “I can’t recall it happening” and then a week later “It didn’t happen”. He is, let’s face it, lying to cover his arse — not once thinking about publicly deploring the sin he is accused of perpetrating.
    That’s because it is all about him.,,,

    http://www.yourdemocracy.net.au/drupal/node/21277

  167. Mate free wheeling mice don’t need paid endorsement…

    Yes ME – I agree. I was just having a little “dig” at you in jest 😆

    I must admit, the Logitech AnywhereMX mouse does look like it’s good value. The Logitech® Unifying receiver that works with that mouse looks interesting too ME – just what’s needed sitting in front of the TV with a laptop.

  168. Could is the word.

    Updated 34 minutes ago Still AAA

    RELATED STORY: Sliding resources prices hit budget bottom line
    MAP: Australia
    One of the world’s major ratings agencies, Standard & Poor’s, believes Australia will record a budget deficit of $20-25 billion this year.

    The agency has slashed its earlier estimate of a $1 billion surplus.

    S&P’s senior director of sovereign ratings Tan Kim Eng says the cut is mainly due to global economic problems.

    “Firstly the export sector is not doing as well as initially expected, commodities exports have not been as strong, on the other hand expenditures are rising,” he said.

    The agency has affirmed the country’s sovereign rating at the highest possible AAA, one of only seven countries in the world to be rated that highly.

    However S&P says this could come into question if there is no pick up in the global economy and Australia’s financial system is affected.

    The agency’s deficit estimate matches the Federal Opposition’s, which Treasurer Wayne Swan dismissed earlier today.

    Mr Tan says only a large economic rebound will bring a surplus this year.

    “If the economy were to rebound very strongly in the second half of this year, then that’s definitely achievable, but it would have to be a very strong rebound, something that is, in our view at the moment, not very likely,” he said.

    http://www.abc.net.au/news/2012-09-19/standard-and-poors-says-australia-heading-for-deficit/4269980

  169. The agency’s deficit estimate matches the Federal Opposition’s,

    No it’s the other way round. The opposition grabbed the agency’s figure.

    Please Aunty don’t go back to aiding and abetting the opposition because your masters tell you to.

  170. CU your excellent post leads on to why the Leader of the Tories the LNP called the press conference this morning to advise he had accepted Bernardi’s resignation. I suspect because it was pre arranged. Abbott has been in deep poos the last 2 weeks and his threats and bullying of women has reached the stage where it has threatened to bring him down.
    Enter Bernardi, throws a grenade in the Senate, repeats it next morning on radio. Abbott asks him to call into his office and have a chat. Not to sack him to ask him about his choice of words in the Senate. The evil turd Bernardi offers his resignation which Abbott readily accepts and the wanker flies out of the country hours later.
    Abbott fronts the media answers 3 questions including one where he let slip he had heard the original comment in the Senate but BUT when Bernardi repeated it on radio this morning he went too far and was summonsed.
    believe that scenario and you believe Hitler was proclaimed a saint and sits at the right hand of the Almighty.
    This setup is to cover Abbotts arse and his failing leadership. He and Bernardi are bosom buddies, think the same, share all the same evil traits.
    Go sit in a corner Cory and if I win Govt there will be a nice big fat Ministers job for you.
    Abbott has too much form to be believed ever.

  171. Does anyone know where Bernardi heading

    From the Oz CU:

    Senator Bernardi boarded a flight to London this morning to attend the European Young Conservative Freedom Summit.

  172. And how old is the Home Insulation Program?

    WIN News story last night about a stranger hero who walking down the street saw a house on fire and the desperate calls for help for a child trapped inside. Disregarding the intense heat and danger he went into the house and rescued the child who was sheltering under his bed. A few minutes more and the news story would have been about the death of that child.

    What stood out for me in this story was not the heroic rescue of the child by a stranger just walking down the street, as great as that was, was the very end bit where the reporter stated the fire was started by faulty wiring in the roof of an old house.

    One of the side benefits of the insulation scheme, one that may have saved an inestimable number of lives and property, is that as the insulation was being installed roof wiring was checked in the inspections as a result of the young installer who was killed by bad wiring in a roof.

    My sister’s house benefited from the insulation scheme but doubly benefited as the installer said the house wiring should be checked as it looked dodgy. My brother-in-law got the wiring checked and the old substandard and poorly installed wiring was a major disaster waiting to happen. The electrician told them that this was the case for a vast majority of older houses out there.

    So whilst the opposition and their media mouthpieces go on about the insulation scheme, and worse blame the four deaths on the Labor government, the one thing they will never be honest about is mention how many lives and property they have destroyed because their over the top unwarranted attacks on the scheme had it prematurely stopped.

  173. Fuck server maintenance just lost me a longish post on the insulation scheme and the secondary benefit that came out of it.

    Sorry not going to attempt to rehash it.

  174. Damn the post got published even though WordPress threw up a message saying it was under server maintenance and to go back and resend the posts, which it wouldn’t let me do. I’ll be stumped.

  175. ME. You are correct, thanks to the good work Garrett did, it is a much safer industry now. There were no regulations for at least fifty years before. People died and houses burnt down,

    There has been a great decease in both.

    Over a million homes were insulated.

  176. Got mine through. Was not easy. When this happens, I always select all and copy. Save losing it. Hate rewriting.

  177. Thanks Sue. They are sure liars. Still not bad report. Lots of ifs, to get where Hockey is at.

    If this is the worse they can dig up, their cupboard is sure bare. Today’s effort was pure desperation.

    Joe Hockey never even mentioned this possibility.
    SMALL SURPLUS
    Mr Tan is expecting a small surplus in the 2013-14 financial year.
    “It will be a relatively small surplus in 2013, but it should pick up in 2014 and 15 as we expect the global economy to pick up strength in those years and at the same time Chinese demand to come back from what we currently see now,” he forecast.
    ECONOMIST’S GUESSES
    And so we have two esteemed economists looking at the same data and coming to two diametrically opposed conclusions.
    One assumes that the Government will sit on its hands and allow the future to do its worst. Unsurprisingly, this is the view the Opposition takes.
    The second assumes that the Government will take action to protect, not only its surplus but also its AAA rating. The Opposition cannot see itself doing something like that and so assumes that the Government won’t do anything either! We know it won’t be easy but this Government has a record of succeeding in doing the hard things!

    http://archiearchive.wordpress.com/

  178. “Opposition cannot see itself doing something like that and so assumes that the Government won’t do anything either! “

    This is Abbott;s biggest problem. They judge the PM by what they would do. Also suspect, they do little reading of reports they read. Just cherry pick a sentence here and there, that fits in with what they want to believe,

    This is what they took out of the report. I should say, took out of context.

    Mr Tan says only a large economic rebound will bring a surplus this year. “If the economy were to rebound very strongly in the second half of this year, then that’s definitely achievable, but it would have to be a very strong rebound, something that is, in our view at the moment, not very likely.“
    Tony Abbott was fully supportive of that view.

    http://archiearchive.wordpress.com/

  179. Is that mother any worse than this lot, for allowing her son to hold up poster, by the way, neither her or her son knew what it said.

    I know we are all concerned about placards that might be construed as wanting someone dead.

    And I know we all support brave ‘Aussie values’ police in attacking demonstrators in Sydney a few of whom had stupid and reactionary placards reading ‘behead those who insult the Prophet’. One was carried by a child.

    This has provoked outrage across Islamophobia, the country formerly known as Australia.

    So let’s delve into how the police have treated others who have similar placards or posters or call for the death of someone because of their sexuality, politics or religious beliefs.,,,,,,

    http://enpassant.com.au/2012/09/19/evidently-right-wing-hate-is-ok/

  180. Watching 7.30
    Turnbull hates Bernardi.

    Bernardi hates Pyne.

    Maybe Pyne hates both,

    All so close and friendly. No problems in the Coalition.

    Abbott has warn all. I assume that includes Joyce.

    He now has a stronger team as a result of his actions.

  181. Cu, given that Abbott has shown no leadership whatsoever, it’s not surprising that some of his team have gone feral. They are probably thinking WTF, I thought it was laissez faire as long as it undermined the Gillard government.

  182. CU
    Standard and Poors have announced earlier report wrong , now saying Government on track for small surplus.

    Hockey and Abbott to apologise to swan (well they should but this bit is all my imagination)

  183. Min
    funny though hockey and abbott cannot take a trick. all that huff and puff about the baaaad govt and then S&P say the person giving the statement was wrong. could be more in that as well, either they were misreported or some miss reporting was happening.

  184. On insulation. Insulation has been compulsory in all new dwellings in Victoria since the mid 1970’s and as Cu states, in a largely unregulated industry.

    One thing which puzzled me was that if batts were such a dangerous product, why were they being sold DIY by distributors such as Bunnings.

  185. No it’s the other way round. The opposition grabbed the agency’s figure.

    And turns out, they were still wrong. Maybe they should stick with catering compamies?

    Global ratings agency Standard and Poor’s has moved to correct an earlier statement it made about the Federal Government’s prospects of returning to surplus.

    An S&P analyst originally told the ABC the agency was predicting a budget deficit of up to $25 billion this year.

    But S&P now says the analyst was referring to old figures from the last financial year.

    It says the Federal Government remains on track to deliver the predicted modest surplus in 2012-13.

    http://www.abc.net.au/news/2012-09-19/ratings-agency-moves-to-correct-deficit-report/4270818

    That seems to be a pretty major fuck up to me 😯

    I reckon Swannies already rubbing his hands together preparing to ‘correct’ the record for the libs in QT today 😉

  186. S & P plus Fitch and Moodies should all be in bloody gaol.

    They played a major role in the GFC, stamping those worthless bundles of mortgage backed securities as AAA investments.

    Look behind the ratings and you’ll probably find a bunch of spivs on the inside making bets against our dollar.

    You just can’t take it seriously.

  187. Min, I bought pink batts thirty years ago. With the help of the kids, we put them in the roof.

    Most, I believe at the time, were aware of the dangers from faulty wiring. That is true any time ones enters the roof cavity.

    It was not the insulation of the batts that was the danger. It was ignoring health and safety and plain stupidity and greed of some setting out to make a quick quid.

    What was noticeable, those charged were not fly by nighter, but establish firms. In one case, electricity. This man should have known better.

    It was one of Rudd’s biggest mistakes not to stick up for Garrett and the scheme

    One million homes not experience the results of those insulations. Most were successful.

    The death and fire rate in the industry are now much lower. I believe one can still buy and install themselves.

    PS. I still know if I could still get into my roof, I would need to be aware of electricity, putting my foot through the ceiling, and in my case, the danger of being cut by steel infrastructure.

    I feel it is also right to assume those in the trade, are also aware of the same dangers. That it is not the governments responsibility to be responsible if they ignore commonsense.

  188. It was one of Rudd’s biggest mistakes not to stick up for Garrett and the scheme

    It was Rudds biggest downfall I think, when the going got tough, he got going. Gillard appears to be made of sterner stuff. Or, it could just be that she is not as enamoured of the media, and trying to appease them, as Rudd did.

  189. Min
    The problem with batts has always been two fold in this country, in the first instance there has never been any requirement that wiring in ceiling spaces should be installed in conduits or even just cleated to the framing and vermin love to chew the insulation and this can cause fires. Secondly we have the popularity of “down lights” which have very hot running halogen bulbs in them If the insulation is not trimmed around such light fittings fire is a real possibility.

  190. Iain, I think regulation of the industry may go a long way to addressing fire and installer injuries and deaths. Let’s hope so.

  191. The performance of insulation in/under roofs is a poorly understood science.

    It is not an uncommon experience for homeowners to find that their homes are uncomfortably warmer at night (in summer) after installation of bulk insulation.

    At the senate hearings into the “pink batts” fiasco a Dr Richard Aynsley (formerly Prof of Architecture at James Cook) recommended that the installation of batts in the roof spaces of houses should be banned north of Port Macquarie.

    Some years earlier I recall Aynsley saying something similar but then it was the Brisbane line. He’s clearly made some allowance for climate change in the interim 😉

  192. Rudd cutting Garrett loose was piss weak Tom.

    For those who can be bothered to look, Garrett has since been vindicated.

    The other Rudd moment for me was when he announced he was for a ‘bigger Australia’. I’ve never thrown anything at a TV set, but on that occasion I came close.

  193. Mig it also indicates yet again Julia Gillards ability to appoint the person for the job, she is such a class administrator, there are big business world wide screaming for someone of her talent. We who support her and the Labor cause for our nation, are just so fortunate that day, when she decided enough was enough of Kevin Rudd, changed the direction of our country for the good.
    Just me saying would be of no importance, thankfully the world is recognising her statesmanship. ( sorry stateswomanship doesnt fit)

  194. A lot of dodger renovaters out there,… knocked out walls etc and replaced the wiring all the way up to the ceiling.. and no further….. so you have the situ of a whole lot of houses out there with 21st wiring set-ups at every power-point etc.. all the way up to the roof-space… and then its anywhere from 1930’s and beyond all the way to the powerbox…. f’n contractors….

  195. I wonder if this PM would remain unemployed as Costello and maybe Howard have, if she was to lose the election.

    I suspect not. Her skills would be very employable.

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