Say something, Tony

From the paper I hardly ever read comes this little hidden-away snippet.  (Excuse the obvious spelling mistakes. It is, after all, The Australian).

Australian authorities have performed a tense rescue north-east of Christams Island.

An asylum seeker has been brought ashore on a stretcher wrapped in silver thermal material following the intervetion of the authorities

HMAS Glenelg intercepted the vessel, thought to be carrying 144 passengers, after someone onboard called for help this afternoon.

HMAS Glenelg and ACV Triton provided assistance to the vessel at the request of the Australian Maritime Safety Authority.

Two children are among the asylum seekers brought ashore at the Australian territory so far this evening.

Does Mr Abbott know about this? If so, I’m wondering a couple of things.

  • Given that he is quick to blame the Government for the deaths at sea of asylum seekers, will he now give it credit for preventing some deaths?
  • Will he condemn the navy for rescuing asylum seekers from a perilous situation whilst his publicly announced preference is that they turn back boats?

Just askin’.

 

 

69 comments on “Say something, Tony

  1. No he will cheer everyday boat that takes off from other countries. He will rub his hands with glee at every .01 percent of rise in unemployment.

    What he cannot stand is good news.

  2. The cognitive dissonance would send Abbott into a Spin. (Pardon the pun).

    This is, after all, someone who can’t cope with anything more complex than a few syllables – as his routine of learned three-word slogans demonstrates.

  3. It’s disappointing that a goodish news story like this wasn’t given more prominence, after all, every boat is a headline these days. As it was I found it in Google rather than The Australian itself.

  4. Migs, if in fact he does say something, whats the odds that we have heard it all before!
    Original thought?……nothing to see here.

  5. Pingback: Phoney Tony! The No No Man! | polliepomes

  6. Abbott’s said something recently that we’ve heard before…

    Just what kind of “workers’ best friend” does Tony Abbott really intend to be?

    13 July, 2012 | Media Release
    If Tony Abbott really wants to be the “best friend” of Australian workers, he should immediately release in full his proposed industrial relations policy.

    ACTU President Ged Kearney said that Mr Abbott’s claim that “If the coalition wins the next election, the workers of Australia will find that I am their best friend” was outrageous given Mr Abbott’s history of attacks on workers and their rights.

    She said Mr Abbott could not be trusted, given his mentor, John Howard, had used virtually the same words before introducing WorkChoices without any prior warning.

    http://www.actu.org.au/media/mediareleases/JustwhatkindofworkersbestfrienddoesTonyAbbottreallyintendtobe.aspx

  7. like the curates egg this story is good in parts, its good that the Australian navy was able to render assistance but is it really good that they had to rescue people who have deliberately put themselves in harm’s way?
    To use a motoring analogy, do we praise the police if they remove a crowd of people who are playing on the freeway, or do we chide those who have put their own lives and the lives of their rescuers at risk in the first instance? Frankly I don’t see it as a dichotomy and we can do both without contradiction.

  8. The analogy falls extremely short..it would make a little more sense if the people who were “playing” on the freeway, were on the freeway in order to escape a natural or other catastrophe.

  9. One thing which to me stood out was the fact that the story actually mentioned children. Howard was the master at this, attempting to conceal the human face of asylum seekers to the general population, as it is far easier to try to instill hatred and resentment if the population has no human person which they can relate to.

    Howard made certain that there were no cameras allowed, however it was at Woomera that some supporters were able to conceal cameras and get close enough that photos of people could be made public.

  10. Migs, a more recent one was a story which included a fair dose of negativity aimed towards asylum seekers. The story was in the main part about unaccompanied minors, however the photo along side the article was that of a group unshaven 40yr old men.

  11. Just goes to prove what unworthy types they are..didn’t even have the decency to shave prior to being rescued..

  12. This piece from the Oz is most pertinent:

    “A growing number of us believe we could turn the boats around and then escort them back to be collected by the Indonesians,” said a serving navy crewman who contacted me. “The talk floating around of sailors unwilling to conduct these operations is not coming from up here, it must be coming from people based back in Canberra.

    “For every sailor up here who is unsure about turning boats back, there are five who want to do it.”

    The sailor, whose identity has been verified but who sought to remain anonymous for fear of disciplinary action, said he and his colleagues were becoming increasingly frustrated at the demands and futility of their work.
    He said crews agree with descriptions of their patrols as a water taxi service — joking about putting car seat covers and meters on the bridge. “All we do is watch them come from Indonesian waters, then meet them and bring them here. There has to be a better way,” the sailor said. “Otherwise we might as well get a cruise liner and just go over and pick them up.”

    The mission of the Darwin-based Armidale patrol boats, as described on the Royal Australian Navy website is unambiguous. “Our operations protect against unauthorised entry,” it says.

    Given what the sailors’ real role has become, it seems either that mission statement, or the mission itself, should change.

    The politics of this debate are transparent, with the government seizing on the turning back the boats argument to mock Tony Abbott’s alternative policy.

    Abbott was mistaken to over-emphasise this aspect of the suite of policies needed to provide an effective deterrent to the people-smuggling trade. He chose to elevate this tactic when it can only ever be one small part of an effective policy — along with offshore processing, strict assessment of claims and a temporary visa category.

    All the same, the government is wrong to reject it. Especially given it is a tactic that can be employed now, without legislative support. We know from past experience that if the occasional boat can be returned, it strikes a blow against the people-smuggling trade because it undermines certainty.

    Government duplicity is exposed by the fact that border control authorities have advised asylum-seeker boats calling for assistance to return to their Indonesian home ports. If Australia is prepared to tell boats to turn around, surely in the right circumstances we would attempt to persuade and assist them to do so. Otherwise we must have completely given up on border patrol.

    Criticism on human rights grounds is also spurious. A boat turnaround has people returning to whence they came without coming into Australian care, whereas the Malaysia Solution would take asylum-seekers into Australian custody and then deport them against their will, to a third country.

    The government has talked up antagonism from Indonesia, but Jakarta would never publicly welcome this tactic because that would involve implicitly accepting ownership of the problem.

    Importantly, in domestic politics, it would be seen as kow-towing to Australia.

    However, just as it has done before, Indonesia would quietly accept this eventuality. After all, given these would be Indonesian boats, with Indonesian crews returning to Indonesian ports, how could it resist? The test for Australian diplomacy would be to keep it low key to avoid rubbing Jakarta’s face in it, and our fevered political debate will make this difficult.

    The crucial question is safety. Former Navy and Australian Defence Force chief admiral Chris Barrie says turning back boats puts “people’s lives at risk and I think therefore it is not a very good policy”. This is an unusual intervention given he headed the ADF during the Tampa affair. Still, after being excoriated in the subsequent “children overboard” political scandal, Barrie could be forgiven for drifting to the comfortable side of what has become a morality play.

  13. The sailor, whose identity has been verified but who sought to remain anonymous for fear of disciplinary action

    Another one of these ‘sauces’ hey 😉

  14. Well Tom R at least the verification has the paper rather than the case of a contrary opinion being put forward by an anonymous blogger (Min).

  15. Is this the same paper who’s sibling is currently being dragged through the courts in the UK at the present time?

    Trust, who do ya’?

  16. Funny that, son thinks that he’s doing a good job.

    Yoohoo re anonymous, on more than one occasion I have put a face to the name…whereas I seem to be looking at an artistic interpretation of yourself. Actually it was son who thought up the name Min as in mini-mum..due to being vertifically challenged and the name has stuck with many, and not just people on the blogs. And the same with Migs, his FB profile at one time was used in one of the header pics..thank you Mobius. 😉

  17. I would say that there is a very big difference between having to deal with a boatload of panicked men, women and children and experienced sailors such as Somalian pirates..

    Admiral Barrie has said Abbott’s preferred course of action is highly risky and I would prefer his opinion rather than that of an anonymous sailor.

    Actually son as a lot of time for the Tamils, a good bunch of people..all they want to do is talk about cricket…

  18. if your cousin was a crim would that make you one too?

    If my cousin and I were both corporate entities existing under the same flagship of the broken murdoch empire, then I would sure be unwilling to take anything I said at face value due to the actions of my cousin.

  19. Min, why is it, the ones who are willing to put their names to it, are those opposed, all ltdnews can find is ‘sauces’.

    all they need to do is offer $70k for the story, it’s all it costs for a hookers perspective.

  20. Tom, plus of course with an anonymous sauce if the person is misquoted or selectively quoted then that person has no comeback to the newspaper whatsoever.

  21. Hockey now on ABC24 talking down economy. Predicting the end of mining boom. Did hear on the ABC this morning that ore went up last week.

    Cannot wait to rub their hands with glee. Maybe he needs to come clean.

    Come clean must be today’s slogan.

    By the way, I was under the impression that Labor is well aware that the mining boom will come to and end and have been trying to put infrastructure and training to deal with the future, By the way, I believe they are talking about 2014 onward.

  22. Hockey did not predict the end of the mining boom! He’s most probably quoting from an article.

    http://www.smh.com.au/business/mining-boom-forecast-to-end-in-two-years-20120722-22ibe.html

    I suppose the Libs are also talking down the building industry too?

    http://www.smh.com.au/business/industry-gradually-crumbling-20120722-22i8v.html

    Those right wing nuts at Fairfax just can’t stop talking down the economy. Or maybe they are just facing the economic realities? Unlike the economic retards that believe Swan’s rubbish!

  23. Thanks for that first link scaper

    He also said the carbon tax would have little economic impact. ”It is a far bigger issue politically than economically.”

    Did hockey repeat hat bit 😉

  24. And on the first sailor being injured or killed under Abbott’s flawed policy will have news stories of anonymous and verified sailors coming out and saying we were all saying the turn back the boat policy was dangerous.

    Nothing surer.

    And Iain on the first failure to turn a boat back will you be the first to put your hand up and say I was wrong and Abbott stuffed up, and will you personally apologise to the family of any military, police or PS injured or killed because you supported that flawed policy and voted to have it implemented? Will you then demand an immediate election be held because Abbott was voted in on false pretenses?

    Of course not, just like all Liberal supporters excuses will fly thick and fast, as they always do when the Liberals screw up, which is a lot.

  25. Min @ 10:07 am

    Yoohoo re anonymous, on more than one occasion I have put a face to the name…whereas I seem to be looking at an artistic interpretation of yourself. Actually it was son who thought up the name Min as in mini-mum..due to being vertifically challenged and the name has stuck with many, and not just people on the blogs. And the same with Migs, his FB profile at one time was used in one of the header pics..thank you Mobius. 😉

    My avatar picture is a self portrait Min and its quite a good likeness except that I now wear glasses That said I have always imagined you like Min banister form the Goons! Ying tang tiddle eye Po!
    Min @ 10:13 am

    I would say that there is a very big difference between having to deal with a boatload of panicked men, women and children and experienced sailors such as Somalian pirates..

    Why on earth would the be panicked any more than Somalian pirates? If you think about it realistically they would have less reason to be fearful that the parrot on the shoulder brigade given the far lower likely hood that our sailors would shoot them.

    Admiral Barrie has said Abbott’s preferred course of action is highly risky and I would prefer his opinion rather than that of an anonymous sailor.

    Frankly I go by what my late dad told me about the services (He served in the RAF) its the NCOs who know what is going on far better than the big brass.

    Actually son as a lot of time for the Tamils, a good bunch of people..all they want to do is talk about cricket…

    But lets not forget that they don’t have a civil war any more.
    Tom R @ 10:14 am

    If my cousin and I were both corporate entities existing under the same flagship of the broken murdoch empire, then I would sure be unwilling to take anything I said at face value due to the actions of my cousin.

    That is a total cop out Tom 🙄

    Tom R @ 10:16 am

    Min, why is it, the ones who are willing to put their names to it, are those opposed, all ltd news can find is ‘sauces’.

    I think that you miss the point of this sailor’s comments, namely that he is reporting that those men who are at the pointy end of our navy are far from unwilling to turn back the boats its only the top brass who are being wimpy here

  26. That is a total cop out Tom

    Why?

    It is closer to the actual state of play than your inept cousin remark (who, fyi, is not even sibling)

  27. I think that you miss the point of this sailor’s comments

    I think that you miss the point of this <b.alleged sailor’s comments

    Fixed it for ya 😉

  28. I think you miss the point Iain. One anonymous sailor is supposedly putting their point of view forward. The rank and experience of that sailor is unknown nor how many are of a like view.

    I have served with gungho sailors and they are not who you want to serve with in times of action. What is the view of a captain or XO, who have all the facts and information behind them, or senior officers, one who has already iterated the turning back of boats is dangerous, as was proven under Howard, and will have a failure rate as high if not higher now.

    You haven’t addressed that point. Most attempts to turn around the boats under Howard failed, so why would it be more successful under Abbott especially now the smugglers and asylum seekers will be better prepared for that contingency.

    And you haven’t addressed Indonesia, who have said they won’t take back a single boat.

  29. Möbius Ecko
    Indonesia are actaully obliged to take them back just as they are obliged to take back any seafarers who are “rescued” in their rescue zone

  30. I suggest putting a name up means nothing. One would need to give phone number, postal address and email.

    One can call themselves anything they like.

    Because of the nature of the internet and the cranks that show no respect for people, one is unable to put up their details.

    Personally, I have decided to take a rest from making comments. Cannot see why one has to open themselves to ridicule under the pretense of serious comment.

    I rather the elgordo and scaper of this world. They do not pretend to be what they are not.

    This is my problem. I am not interested in the games some play.

  31. PRIME Minister Julia Gillard says people can have confidence in the Australian economy, as other countries fight high levels of unemployment.

    Ms Gillard attended a ground-breaking ceremony in Darwin today for the start of a $34 billion LNG project by Japan’s Inpex, saying it was a “fantastic” opportunity for the Northern Territory and part of the resources boom that is changing the economy.

    “We can be confident about the Australian economy because there are so many investments like this one in the pipeline – more than $450 billion of investments,” she said.

    http://express-advocate-gosford.whereilive.com.au/news/story/gillard-says-jobs-1001-campaign-gives-aussie-unemployed-a-go/

  32. You are all missing the point, Iain is in complete control of this post. It is going nowhere.

  33. Catching up, Iain doesn’t have any/many visitors to his sandpit thus takes out his frustrations by coming to the Cafe to show how clever he is….

  34. Why should aslyum seekers be more panicked than Somalian pirates? Maybe because pirates are experienced sailors whereas a boat of one’s family including children who are either too young/or can’t swim might cause one a good deal of consernation.

  35. Iain, Indonesia is under no obligation whatsoever to take back any boats once they have travelled to international waters. Indonesia has made it quite plain, and on a number of occasions that they will not be taking any of Australia’s “returns”. We also have that the Minister is the legal guardian of any unaccompanied minors..therefore the issue of duty of care must also be considered.

  36. Iain, you are going by one unnamed source, I am going by about 10 sources. Son is a LS and a 10 year man..I tend to believe him.

  37. The post is about asylum seekers and so Iain’s comments are relevant. Abbott’s hypocrisy is the point in question. As Miglo states, he is quick to blame any deaths on the government but would he take responsibility for deaths which are likely to occur should the boats be turned around. Surely it’s not just a matter of turning them around to float off into the sunset, but once taken into custody it is Australia’s responsibility to ensure that the people arrive safely at their destination, irrespective of what this destination might be.

  38. On returning asylum seekers to Indonesia..

    TONY JONES, PRESENTER: Indonesian police have uncovered evidence that asylum seekers are subjected to a culture of violence and abuse at an immigration detention centre. They’re investigating immigration staff accused of torturing an Afghan asylum seeker to death last week. Thousands of asylum seekers detained en route to Australia are being held at centres across the country. This report from our Indonesia correspondent Matt Brown and it contains images which may disturb some viewers.

    http://www.abc.net.au/lateline/content/2012/s3449246.htm

  39. Catching up @ 12:26 pm

    You are all missing the point, Iain is in complete control of this post. It is going nowhere.

    Where precisely do you expect it to go CU?
    Pip @ 12:38 pm

    Catching up, Iain doesn’t have any/many visitors to his sandpit thus takes out his frustrations by coming to the Cafe to show how clever he is….

    I have enough visitors to my own blog thank you Pip so don’t assume that its frustration that brings me here at all 🙂
    Pip @ 12:39 pm

    Cu,…. and endeavour to re-educate us…

    I just want to bring light into the Darkness…
    Min@ 12:47 pm

    Iain, likewise a huge Goons fan.. 😉

    Well that is good news Min! I just hope that you don’t sound like the Minnie Banister Voice as done by Peter Sellers!

    Min @ 12:50 pm

    Why should aslyum seekers be more panicked than Somalian pirates? Maybe because pirates are experienced sailors whereas a boat of one’s family including children who are either too young/or can’t swim might cause one a good deal of consternation.

    I don’t think that follows logically at all Min especially as they would be expecting the Australian sailors to be their saviours.
    Min @ 12:55 pm

    Iain, Indonesia is under no obligation whatsoever to take back any boats once they have travelled to international waters.

    If the boat is from Indonesia, and crewed by their nationals how on earth could they deny them the right of return any more than we could deny the Manly ferry loaded with foreigners but crewed with Aussies the right to dock at circular quay?

    Indonesia has made it quite plain, and on a number of occasions that they will not be taking any of Australia’s “returns”.

    Under the laws of the sea if a vessel is “rescued” at sea rescuers are obliged to take the survivors to the nearest port, not to the desired destination of the passengers.

    We also have that the Minister is the legal guardian of any unaccompanied minors..therefore the issue of duty of care must also be considered.

    That only kicks in once they have landed on Australian soil, if a boat is turned around that does not apply.


    Min @ 12:59 pm

    Iain, you are going by one unnamed source, I am going by about 10 sources. Son is a LS and a 10 year man..I tend to believe him.

    No Min I am not just basing my opinion on this one sailor

    Robbie @ 1:17 pm

    The post is about asylum seekers and so Iain’s comments are relevant. Abbott’s hypocrisy is the point in question. As Miglo states, he is quick to blame any deaths on the government but would he take responsibility for deaths which are likely to occur should the boats be turned around.

    If turning a few boats around succeeds in deterring others from taking the same risky voyages then won’t there be less people in harms way? Because even blind Freddy can see that the Gillard impotence and the daily boats has to eventually lead to more people drowning.

    Surely it’s not just a matter of turning them around to float off into the sunset, but once taken into custody it is Australia’s responsibility to ensure that the people arrive safely at their destination, irrespective of what this destination might be.

    No I don’t think our obligations go anywhere near that far.

  40. Iain and Well that is good news Min! I just hope that you don’t sound like the Minnie Banister Voice as done by Peter Sellers! Which reminds me of..

  41. Iain, I really do believe that the fact that the Indonesians state and categorically that they will not be taking any returns is highly relevant.

    The fact that Admiral Barrie says that turning the boats around is fraught with danger is highly relevant.

    The fact that the Minister has a duty of care to unaccompanied minors is highly relevant.

    I find the current argument coming from the right highly hypocritical. Suddenly they are tugging at forelocks about people risking lives on the high seas yet without the blink of an eyelid would send them back to Indonesia for people to be imprisoned, tortured with more than one death from torture documented.

  42. Qld is doing really well lately (sarcasm alert)..the one that hit home was Newman denying paramedics meal breaks.. it’s on the Cafe Talk thread.

  43. I don’t know whether this reporter wants the reader to take this seriously or is just taking the mickey?

    “On his first visit to China in five years, Opposition Leader Tony Abbott is being feted in Beijing like a prime minister-in-waiting

    China is trying to impress Mr Abbott with an unusually high-powered line-up, beginning with the fourth-ranked Politburo member, Jia Qinglin

    Read more: http://www.theage.com.au/opinion/political-news/china-fetes-abbott-like-pminwaiting-20120723-22k9e.html#ixzz21Rsr8IV9

    Would that be as if Opposition leader of any country came to Australia , and got to meet, not the GG, not the PM, not the Deputy PM but who ever is next in line or not busy?

  44. More of the mickey

    “Yesterday, the Opposition Leader met a succession of senior Chinese leaders, who are keen to assess the politician who polls indicate is likely to soon become prime minister of one of China’s major strategic suppliers.

    Most top Chinese leaders are out of Beijing and at the seaside resort of Beidaihe”

    But this is the man the msm think so highly about
    “IN his first visit to China as Opposition Leader, Tony Abbott will today again defy the convention that politicians do not criticise their domestic adversaries overseas by lambasting the carbon and mining taxes that have drawn strong criticism from Chinese corporations.”
    http://www.theaustralian.com.au/national-affairs/abbott-breaks-protocol-in-beijing-to-slam-labors-levies/story-fn59niix-1226433359591

  45. Defying convention-yeah that’ll go down a treat with the Chinese. Another major coup by this clown.

    What’s the score so far? He’s insulted and bullied the Indonesians, ditto the Obama administration and now the Chinese. By the time we get to the election next year, we’ll have gunboat here from every nation treated to his half witted diplomacy.

    What a dickhead. Is it any wonder he gets no respect?

  46. Listening to the Shorten interview.

    It appears that Mr. Abbott is now saying that it is bad for government own entities to invest in Australia. I assume he has said this in China,

    Shorten was very careful in his answer. Pointed out that this ha not6 been Liberal policy up to now.

    Mr. Shorten it should not be who is investing but whether it is in Australia’s interest.

  47. “Abbott was hiding behind the door when subtlety and insight were being handed out.”

    That would be unusual for him, he normally runs away.

  48. What does this photo remind one of.

    Opposition Leader Tony Abbott has broken from bi-partisan tradition to urge China to embark on political reforms to match its “remarkable” economic transformation.
    “As prime minister I would hope for political reform to match China’s economic liberalisation, while acknowledging the government’s right to maintain order and respecting China’s growing place in the world,” Mr Abbott told a business breakfast in Beijing this morning.
    “We already have a strong relationship with China based on shared interests,” he said.
    “Over time, I hope it will be based more on shared values.
    Advertisement
    Mr Abbott’s pledge to “stand up for shared interests and values” risks challenging the Communist Party’s self-described “core interest” in maintaining its monopoly on power.
    Mr Abbott urged closer and more active engagement but also signalled a tougher stance on Chinese investment, saying that an Abbott government would “rarely” support a Chinese-government company taking over an Australian business.

    Read more: http://www.smh.com.au/world/abbott-to-china-time-for-reform-20120724-22maf.html#ixzz21WHgHZnl

  49. Yet another diplomatic coup fresh from the idiotic gob of the worst LOTO in history, who, if we’re very unfortunate, will go on to be the worst PM ever.

    And while we’re at it, anyone who dares criticise Latham’s handshake with the Rodent should have a look at the photo of the bully and the Chinese official.

  50. My god, Abbott invading the personal space of a foreign dignitary and a move that is an insult in most Asian cultures, along with doing a stand over bully move that is immature at the least and uncouth affront at the most.

    Abbott goes abroad to prove what a great representative for Australia he can be and yet again, three times now in a short period, he puts a big boot into a mumbling bumbling mouth and proves what a diplomatic dunce and bully he truly is.

    On top of that, and I’m glad this is being picked up though not given enough press, Abbott states two opposing things on these jaunts. He tells the foreign audience one thing and the Australian domestic one something else entirely. The thing is that he’s more than likely lying in both instances.

    Another proof of his cowardice.

  51. LOVO, love it!

    ME, spot on! Like a dog obeying two masters-he’s a coward AND a liar. And idiots like Tweed and Iain say he’s PM material. Give me strength!

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