Assange in prison…whilst war-mongers roam freely

Picture of Julian Assange during a talk at 26C3

Image via Wikipedia

It’s a jungle out there“…so goes the theme song from the popular series Monk.

And so it is.

And at this very time the war-mongering beasts that have chomped & chewed their way to the top…those who have sucked our rivers & lands dry of diverse life, nutrients, and their natural way…have created massive factory farms & feedlots straight out of a horror film…whilst raining bombs down on the children of the future in order to keep building more bombs, profiting from this obscenity by way of both the armaments and rebuilding of the very same infrastructure they levelled…those who have enslaved workers across the planet by way of exorbitant house prices and grotesque rental charges…and crashed, rigged economies that see pension ages upped, company pensions reduced drastically by way of bankruptcies & with the assistance of some large unions…and poisoned & fattened, like pigs before the feed, generations…those who hate to be regulated…and luv their tax contribution to be low…

these corporate aristocrats & their political & judicial puppets are now about to feed Wikileaks’ founder Julian Assange to their lions…in order to protect their interests. 

Some of these leaders of nation-states, corporate states, vigorously defend – by way of their too oft allied media – their aggressive tone…their desperate need to feed…some even their calls for “execution” of Assange, by casually throwing out words such as “traitor“. Distortions…lies. Hype.

But we the people know better…we who have observed the grotesque mismanagement of our so called democracies since the CORPORATIONS began running rampant like arrogant, gargantuan beasts…a newly introduced species stomping through the jungle since the heady days of corporate colonialism where the likes of the Dutch East India Company &  Hudson’s Bay Company made some very rich at the expense of many labourers & other species.

Thru the industrial revolution…and the Age of  Oil these corporations have bred like rabbits…providing many goods & services, but often undermining smaller competition, diversity, and attempts to lift the entire world out of poverty. They oft rely on poorer &/or developing countries in order to keep labour & transport costs down. For some of their customers to win…others must lose…or expect less.

And even as they grow, flourish…and compete with one another…occasionally collude…too oft demonstrating uncompetitive behaviour…they seek to influence, gain advantage…by way of mass media…and using political advisors, donating to parties and financially backing candidates. Even helping to create movements, such as the American Tea Party.

Now some of them…and their too oft political/judicial puppets…want Julian Assange silenced. To end Wikileaks. And it won’t stop there. Nor is this their first feast. But we all know that.

It’s about time WE stood up to them.

The likes of John Pilger, Ken Loach, Noam Chomsky, Julian Burnside, and many others who support Assange & Wikileaks in their endeavours, have been standing up to them for a good long time. And for the rights of the individual. And free speech. The right to know what the hell has been going on in our governments during these war times…these economically wobbly, volatile, too oft mismanaged & rigged times…these days where war criminals roam free…but the speakers for the dead are put behind bars.

This from renowned blogger Chris Floyd:

December 7, 2010

The Arrest of Julian Assange

Truth in Chains



Well, they got him at last. WikiLeaks founder Julian Assange, the target of several of the world’s most powerful governments, turned himself into British authorities today and is now at the mercy of state authorities who have already shown their wolfish – and lawless – desire to destroy him and his organization.

It has been, by any standard, an extraordinary campaign of vilification and persecution, wholly comparable to the kind of treatment doled out to dissidents in China or Burma. Lest we forget, WikiLeaks is a journalistic outlet – just like The New York Times, the Guardian and Der Spiegel, all of whom are even now publishing the very same material – leaked classified documents — available on WikiLeaks. The website is also a journalistic outlet just like CNN, ABC, CBS, Fox and other mainstream media venues, where we have seen an endless parade of officials – and journalists! – calling for Assange to be prosecuted or killed outright. Every argument being made for shutting down WikiLeaks can – and doubtless will – be used against any journalistic enterprise that publishes material that powerful people do not like.

And the leading role in this persecution of truth-telling is being played by the administration of the great progressive agent of hope and change, the self-proclaimed heir of Martin Luther King and Mahatma Gandhi, the winner of the Nobel Peace Prize, Barack Obama. His attorney general, Eric Holder, is now making fierce noises about the “steps” he has already taken to bring down WikiLeaks and criminalize the leaking of embarrassing information. And listen to the ferocious reaction of that liberal lioness, Sen. Dianne Feinstein, who took to the pages of Rupert Murdoch’s Wall Street Journal to call for Assange to be put in prison – for 2,500,000 years:

“When WikiLeaks founder Julian Assange released his latest document trove—more than 250,000 secret State Department cables—he intentionally harmed the U.S. government. The release of these documents damages our national interests and puts innocent lives at risk. He should be vigorously prosecuted for espionage.

“The law Mr. Assange continues to violate is the Espionage Act of 1917. That law makes it a felony for an unauthorized person to possess or transmit “information relating to the national defense which information the possessor has reason to believe could be used to the injury of the United States or to the advantage of any foreign nation.” … Importantly, the courts have held that “information relating to the national defense” applies to both classified and unclassified material. Each violation is punishable by up to 10 years in prison.”

So there you have it. Ten years for each offense; 250,000 separate offenses; thus a prison term of 2.5 million years.  Naturally, tomorrow the same newspaper will denounce Feinstein for being such a namby-pamby terrorist-coddling pinko: “Why didn’t she call for Assange to be torn from limb to limb by wild dogs, as any right-thinking red-blooded American would do!?”

Meanwhile, corporate America and its international allies continue to do their bit. Joining PayPal and Amazon, who had already cut off their services to WikiLeaks, most of the remaining venues through which the internet journal is funded are also freezing out the organization — MasterCard, Visa, and a Swiss bank that WikiLeaks used to process donations. All of these organizations are obviously responding to government pressure.

What is perhaps most remarkable is that this joint action by the world elite to shut down WikiLeaks – which has been operating for four years – comes after the release of diplomatic cables, not in response to earlier leaks which provided detailed evidence of crimes and atrocities committed by the perpetrators and continuers of Washington’s Terror War. I suppose this is because the diplomatic cables have upset the smooth running of the corrupt and cynical backroom operations that actually govern our world, behind the ludicrous lies and self-righteous posturing that our great and good lay on for the public. They didn’t mind being unmasked as accomplices in mass murder and fomenters of suffering and hatred; in fact, they were rather proud of it. And they certainly knew that their fellow corruptocrats in foreign governments – not to mention the perpetually stunned and supine American people – wouldn’t give a toss about a bunch of worthless peons in Iraq and Afghanistan getting killed. But the diplomatic cables have caused an embarrassing stink among the closed little clique of the movers and shakers. And that is a crime deserving of vast eons in stir – or death.

But before Assange was taken into custody, he fired off one last message to the world, in The Australian, a newspaper in his native land. With supreme irony, he tied WikiLeaks’ operation to the roots of the Murdoch media empire, which began by speaking truth to murderous and wasteful power – and now, of course, is one of the most powerful and assiduous instruments of murderous and wasteful power itself. Assange writes:

“IN 1958 a young Rupert Murdoch, then owner and editor of Adelaide’s The News, wrote: “In the race between secrecy and truth, it seems inevitable that truth will always win.” His observation perhaps reflected his father Keith Murdoch’s expose that Australian troops were being needlessly sacrificed by incompetent British commanders on the shores of Gallipoli. The British tried to shut him up but Keith Murdoch would not be silenced and his efforts led to the termination of the disastrous Gallipoli campaign.

“Nearly a century later, WikiLeaks is also fearlessly publishing facts that need to be made public. …  Democratic societies need a strong media and WikiLeaks is part of that media. The media helps keep government honest. WikiLeaks has revealed some hard truths about the Iraq and Afghan wars, and broken stories about corporate corruption.

“WikiLeaks is not the only publisher of the US embassy cables. Other media outlets, including Britain ‘s The Guardian, The New York Times, El Pais in Spain and Der Spiegel in Germany have published the same redacted cables.

“Yet it is WikiLeaks, as the co-ordinator of these other groups, that has copped the most vicious attacks and accusations from the US government and its acolytes. I have been accused of treason, even though I am an Australian, not a US citizen. There have been dozens of serious calls in the US for me to be “taken out” by US Special Forces. Sarah Palin says I should be “hunted down like Osama bin Laden”, a Republican bill sits before the US Senate seeking to have me declared a “transnational threat” and disposed of accordingly. An adviser to the Canadian Prime Minister’s office has called on national television for me to be assassinated. An American blogger has called for my 20-year-old son, here in Australia, to be kidnapped and harmed for no other reason than to get at me.”

These, of course, are the defenders of Western Civilization, that pinnacle of human progress, that bulwark against savagery like murder and torture, that bastion of temperance and reason. But in his piece, Assange once more gives the lie to the ferocious canards of Feinstein, Holder, Obama and Palin about the “great harm” the leaks have done:

“WikiLeaks has a four-year publishing history. During that time we have changed whole governments, but not a single person, as far as anyone is aware, has been harmed. But the US, with Australian government connivance, has killed thousands in the past few months alone.

“US Secretary of Defence Robert Gates admitted in a letter to the US congress that no sensitive intelligence sources or methods had been compromised by the Afghan war logs disclosure. The Pentagon stated there was no evidence the WikiLeaks reports had led to anyone being harmed in Afghanistan. NATO in Kabul told CNN it couldn’t find a single person who needed protecting. The Australian Department of Defence said the same. No Australian troops or sources have been hurt by anything we have published.”

Yes, how many thousands of people, how many tens of thousands, have been killed by our bipartisan Terror Warriors in the four years of WikiLeaks’ existence?  How many millions have been “harmed” not only by the direct operations of the Terror War, but by the ever-widening, ever-deepening violence, hatred and turmoil it is spreading throughout the world? (Not to mention the accelerating collapse of American society, which has been financially, politically and morally bankrupted by the acceptance of aggressive war, torture, elite rapine and authoritarian rule.)

But none of the perpetrators of these acts, past or present, are in jail, or have even been prosecuted, or investigated, or inconvenienced in any way. Yet Assange is in a British prison tonight –

More here.


I do not agree with what you have to say, but I’ll defend to the death your right to say it.
Indeed. Let the LIGHT SHINE.

106 comments on “Assange in prison…whilst war-mongers roam freely

  1. American Senator Dianne Feinstein has done some good things in her time…but:

    Feinstein supported the Iraq war resolution in the vote of October 11, 2002; she has claimed that she was misled by President Bush on the reasons for going to war. However, former UN Weapons Inspector in Iraq Scott Ritter has stated that Feinstein in summer 2002 acknowledged to him that she knew the Bush administration had not provided any convincing intelligence to back up its claims about the Iraqi weapons of mass destruction.

    In November 2007, Feinstein was one of only six Democrats to vote to confirm Michael Mukasey as Attorney General.

    In August 2007, Feinstein joined Republicans in the Senate in voting to modify the Foreign Intelligence Surveillance Act (FISA) by narrowing the scope of its protections to sharply alter the legal limits on the government’s ability to monitor phone calls and email messages of American citizens.

    Feinstein voted to give the attorney general and the director of national intelligence the power to approve international surveillance of the communications of Americans entirely within the executive branch, rather than through the special intelligence court established by FISA. Many privacy advocates have decried this law and Senator Feinstein’s vote in favor of it.

    In February 2008, Feinstein joined Republicans in the Senate in voting “Nay” to strike the provisions providing immunity from civil liability to electronic communication service providers for certain assistance provided to the Government.

    Feinstein was the original Democratic cosponsor of a bill to extend the USA PATRIOT Act. In a December 2005 statement, Senator Feinstein stated, “I believe the Patriot Act is vital to the protection of the American people.”

    Death penalty
    Feinstein is a supporter of capital punishment.

    Free Speech:
    In 2010 Dianne Feinstein voted in favour of unilateral US censorship of the Internet by voting in favour of COICA. Also in 2010, Dianne Feinstein said in reference to Cablegate, “Whoever released this information should be punished severely.”



    March 21, 07

    Feinstein Resigns
    Senator exits MILCON following Metro exposé, vet-care scandal

    By Peter Byrne

    SEN. Dianne Feinstein has resigned from the Military Construction Appropriations subcommittee. As previously and extensively reviewed in these pages, Feinstein was chairperson and ranking member of MILCON for six years, during which time she had a conflict of interest due to her husband Richard C. Blum’s ownership of two major defense contractors, who were awarded billions of dollars for military construction projects approved by Feinstein.

    As MILCON leader, Feinstein relished the details of military construction, even micromanaging one project at the level of its sewer design. She regularly took junkets to military bases around the world to inspect construction projects, some of which were contracted to her husband’s companies, Perini Corp. and URS Corp.

    More here:


  2. I am SO pissed about this right now. I count myself regularly among the harder of society in regards to the soft treatment of criminals and other associated idiots (read David Hicks) but this situation is absolutely inexcusable.

    Wikileaks as done nothing any other media outlet has done or would do in a heartbeat given half a chance. In fact, most major news outlets worldwide ARE printing the materials – and what of it? Are they being accused of ‘treason’, ‘espionage’, ‘terrorism’?

    Is Rupert Murdoch sitting in a jail cell while some farcical imagined crime is being crafted in order to silence him and his outlets?

    Hell, no, the hypocrisy of it is astounding.

    Every single person with a mouth and a breath to take should be outraged and coming out in defence of Assange. Its an absolute disgrace.

    But, I think Assange has comfortably proven his point and the reaction of the worlds so called ‘free’ society governments have disgraced themselves in confirming it for him. We’re living in a comfortably veiled neo-fascist world and the past couple of weeks have proven and defined it like two wars and several elections completely failed to notice…

  3. One rule for the FEW…another for the MANY:

    WikiLeaks cables:

    Saudi princes throw parties boasting drink, drugs and sexRoyals flout puritanical laws to throw parties for young elite while religious police are forced to turn a blind eye

    Heather Brooke,
    Tuesday 7 December 2010

    In what may prove a particularly incendiary cable, US diplomats describe a world of sex, drugs and rock’n’roll behind the official pieties of Saudi Arabian royalty.

    Jeddah consulate officials described an underground Halloween party, thrown last year by a member of the royal family, which broke all the country’s Islamic taboos. Liquor and prostitutes were present in abundance, according to leaked dispatches, behind the heavily-guarded villa gates.

    The party was thrown by a wealthy prince from the large Al-Thunayan family. The diplomats said his identity should be kept secret. A US energy drinks company also put up some of the finance.

    “Alcohol, though strictly prohibited by Saudi law and custom, was plentiful at the party’s well-stocked bar. The hired Filipino bartenders served a cocktail punch using sadiqi, a locally-made moonshine,” the cable said. “It was also learned through word-of-mouth that a number of the guests were in fact ‘working girls’, not uncommon for such parties.”

    The dispatch from the US partygoers, signed off by the consul in Jeddah, Martin Quinn, added: “Though not witnessed directly at this event, cocaine and hashish use is common in these social circles.”

    The underground party scene is “thriving and throbbing” in Saudi Arabia thanks to the protection of Saudi royalty, the dispatch said. But it is only available behind closed doors and for the very rich.

    More than 150 Saudi men and women, most in their 20s and 30s, were at the party. The patronage of royalty meant the feared religious police kept a distance. Admission was controlled through a strict guest list.

    More here:



  4. Migs,
    I, too find it strange that Mr Assange and his crew have not yet released any cables, say from the US or British governments, which detail the ubiquitous Mr Murdoch’s visits to the corridors of power in various countries. Nor has any mention been made yet, as far as I can ascertain, about any Conservative politician. Goodness knows there must be a wealth of material harking back to even 2 years and a bit ago, before Obama took office, that would incriminate Republican politicians and Administration officials in some very murky dealings. I mean, today we have a leak about Kim Beazley’s time as Opposition Leader, ferchrissake, yet the sound of crickets chirping about Howard, or Downer, or anyone else from the local conservative cabal. As Dr Julius Sumner Miller would say, “Why is this so?”
    I don’t know if I’m being paranoid, but I smell a bit of a rat(which makes no sense I know), as this furore has come just after conservative governments have been tossed out of the US and Australia(tho not so in the UK, but Blair was on their side), and this situation is causing those governments a world of pain. Not only that but it is serving to turn the staunchest supporters of social democracy, such as John Pilger, et al., around to bite the hands that have fed them. Professional Progressives turning on Progressive governments, and being gee’d up by conservatives, who are probably going to laugh all the way to the ballot box, as one of the upshots of this imbroglio will be that those same Progressive governments will probably agree to enact laws which will place tighter controls over our beloved internet, and give ISPs or the Security Services the right to snoop on us.
    I mean, why else would Rupert Murdoch allow his flagship Australian broadsheet to publish the Assange piece unless the Editor and probably Murdoch himself had given permission for it to be run? I mean, normally we progressives would have expected Murdoch’s minions to be champing at the bit to tear the guy apart, limb from limb, for upsetting the natural order of things.
    Something else interesting which I heard in passing was that Assange appears to be from a Queensland Pastoral family. Which suggests strong connections to the National Party for mine. Also the Opposition have been strangely silent in their condemnation of Assange, instead focussing their attacks on the substance of the cables, i.e. the government.
    Just sayin’.

  5. What a great job Bush, Cheney did by invading Iraq…and supporting Israel’s bombing of Lebanon:

    Leaks Suggest Iran Is Now Winning in the Middle East
    By Juan Cole (piece @ Information Clearing House)

    December 07, 2010 “Truthdig” — Iran is winning and Israel is losing. That is the startling conclusion we reach if we consider how things have changed in the Middle East in the two years since most of the WikiLeaks State Department cables about Iran’s regional difficulties were written. Lebanon’s Sunni prime minister, once a virulent critic, quietly made his pilgrimage to the Iranian capital last week. Israeli hopes of separating Syria from Iran have been dashed. Turkey, once a strong ally of Israel, is now seeking better relations with Iran and with Lebanon’s Shiites.


    From 2005 through 2006, Iran appeared to be on the retreat in the eastern Mediterranean. Pro-Western Sunnis and Christians took over in Beirut. Syria was expelled from Lebanon and there was talk of detaching it from Iran. The powerful generals of Turkey, a NATO member and ally of Israel, were reliably anti-Iranian. Now, Hariri is a supplicant in Tehran, Syria is again influential in Beirut, and a Turkey newly comfortable with Islam has emerged as a regional power and a force for economic and diplomatic integration of Iran and Syria into the Middle East. Iran’s political breakthroughs in the region have dealt a perhaps irreparable blow to the hopes of the United States and Israel for a new anti-Iranian axis in the region that would align Iran’s Arab and other neighbors with Tel Aviv.

    more here:

    Shakin’ yer head just doesn’t do it…

    And to think these war criminals and useless strategists…some of them corporate aristocrats who profit from conflict…are still roamin’ free.

    And Obama has done a deal w/ the Republicans to reduce the estate tax. And continue the tax cuts for the rich. Fck me!


  6. Feral:


    Guantanamo Bay procedures

    A copy of Standard Operating Procedures for Camp Delta–the protocol of the U.S. Army at the Guantanamo Bay detention camp–dated March 2003 was released on the WikiLeaks website on 7 November 2007.The document, named “gitmo-sop.pdf”, is also mirrored at The Guardian. Its release revealed some of the restrictions placed over detainees at the camp, including the designation of some prisoners as off-limits to the International Committee of the Red Cross, something that the U.S. military had in the past repeatedly denied.

    Sarah Palin’s Yahoo email account contents

    In September 2008, during the 2008 United States presidential election campaigns, the contents of a Yahoo account belonging to Sarah Palin (the running mate of Republican presidential nominee John McCain) were posted on WikiLeaks after being hacked into by members of Anonymous. It has been alleged by Wired that contents of the mailbox indicate that she used the private Yahoo account to send work-related messages, in violation of public record laws.

    BNP membership list

    After briefly appearing on a blog, the membership list of the far-right British National Party was posted to WikiLeaks on 18 November 2008. The name, address, age and occupation of many of the 13,500 members were given, including several police officers, two solicitors, four ministers of religion, at least one doctor, and a number of primary and secondary school teachers. In Britain, police officers are banned from joining or promoting the BNP, and at least one officer was dismissed for being a member. The BNP was known for going to considerable lengths to conceal the identities of members.

    Baghdad airstrike video

    Main article: July 12, 2007 Baghdad airstrike
    On 5 April 2010, WikiLeaks released classified U.S. military footage from a series of attacks on 12 July 2007 in Baghdad by a U.S. helicopter that killed 12, including two Reuters news staff, Saeed Chmagh and Namir Noor-Eldeen, on a website called “Collateral Murder”. The footage consisted of a 39-minute unedited version and an 18-minute version which had been edited and annotated. Analysis of the video indicates that the pilots thought the men were carrying weapons (which were actually camera equipment). When asked if they were sure that the men were carrying weapons, they answered in the affirmative. The military conducted an “informal” investigation into the incident, but has yet to release the investigative materials (such as the sworn statements of the soldiers involved or the battle damage assessment) that were used, causing the report to be criticized as “sloppy.”

    Afghan War Diary

    Main article: Afghan War documents leak
    On 25 July 2010, WikiLeaks released to The Guardian, The New York Times, and Der Spiegel over 92,000 documents related to the war in Afghanistan between 2004 and the end of 2009. The documents detail individual incidents including friendly fire and civilian casualties. The scale of leak was described by Julian Assange as comparable to that of the Pentagon Papers in the 1970s.

    WikiLeaks’ recent leaking of classified U.S. intelligence has been described by commentator of The Wall Street Journal as having “endangered the lives of Afghan informants” and “the dozens of Afghan civilians named in the document dump as U.S. military informants. Their lives, as well as those of their entire families, are now at terrible risk of Taliban reprisal.”

    When interviewed, Assange stated that WikiLeaks has withheld some 15,000 documents that identify informants to avoid putting their lives at risk. Specifically, Voice of America reported in August 2010 that Assange, responding to such criticisms, stated that the 15,000 still held documents are being reviewed “line by line,” and that the names of “innocent parties who are under reasonable threat” will be removed.

    Greg Gutfeld of Fox News described the leaking as “WikiLeaks’ Crusade Against the U.S. Military.”

    John Pilger has reported that prior to the release of the Afghan War Diaries in July, WikiLeaks contacted the White House in writing, asking that it identify names that might draw reprisals, but received no response.

    Iraq War Logs

    Main article: Iraq War documents leak
    In October 2010, it was reported that WikiLeaks was planning to release up to 400,000 documents relating to the Iraq War. Julian Assange initially denied the reports, stating: “WikiLeaks does not speak about upcoming releases dates, indeed, with very rare exceptions we do not communicate any specific information about upcoming releases, since that simply provides fodder for abusive organizations to get their spin machines ready.” The Guardian reported on 21 October 2010 that it had received almost 400,000 Iraq war documents from WikiLeaks. On 22 October 2010, Al Jazeera was the first to release analyses of the leak, dubbed The War Logs. WikiLeaks posted a tweet that “Al Jazeera have broken our embargo by 30 minutes. We release everyone from their Iraq War Logs embargoes.” This prompted other news organizations to release their articles based on the source material. The release of the documents coincided with a return of the main website, which had been offering no content since 30 September 2010.

    The BBC quoted The Pentagon referring to the Iraq War Logs as “the largest leak of classified documents in its history.” Media coverage of the leaked documents focused on claims that the U.S. government had ignored reports of torture by the Iraqi authorities during the period after the 2003 war


    Wikileaks Data: US War Crimes Policy, Command Failure Under VP Cheney

    August 1, 2010 Talking Points Memo

    Wikileaks has come under attack by Liz Cheney for disclosing information about US operations in Afghanistan.

    Unfortunately, for the former Vice President’s daughter, the wikileaks disclosures strengthens the connection between Vice President Cheney and alleged war crimes after 2001.

    more here:

    What I’d like to know Feral is why are the likes of Cheney & Rove still walkin’ free…and why some top Democrats have hindered the cause of justice?

    I think we know why.

    Sometimes partisanship can blind us. Or make us look the other way.


  7. Agreed FS. I haven’t noticed any of those evil corporations suffering so far from Wikileaks. The Obama administration and our own government here and Kevin Rudd in particular seem to be suffering most from the current media frenzy in the English language press. Wikileaks is depending very much on masthead media selectivity to achieve what Assange somewhat unrealistically describes as ‘harm minimisation’ distribution.’ but by the inevitable filter down process to lowest common denominator outlets huge damage is being done not to profit making warmongers and the those political parties who were the perpetrators of war but to those more recent administrations who are working on peace initiatives and exit strategies.

    The Wikileaks uproar could give the Right just what it needs to swing back into power here and elsewhere. Just heard Downer on the ABC commenting gloatingly on it all. I can imagine him silently thanking Assange, Robertson, Pilger et al for helping things along so nicely.

  8. Feral @3.09pm, once again in lockstep. I haven’t commented on the wikileaks furore because I know sod all about it. However, if heaps of CIA secret documents could be easily accessed, how come the Rodentochracy and in particular the Murdochracy’s shady deals and corruption haven’t seen the light of day?

    Nas’ @3.50pm it seems at odds with recent reports that most Middle Eastern countries would like Iran to be taken out. Are we being fed very large doses of bullsh!t, do you think?

  9. Jane, Patricia & Feral…the info I provided above related to Wikileaks also damages the Busheviks & other war-mongers if ya read it.

    Don’t forget…the media will spin the leaks as they see fit…as suits THEIR purposes.

    I found this an interestin’ read:

    Wikileaks and the Media

    Instead of deriding Wikileaks as “not telling us anything we didn’t know” before, perhaps the alternative media should use the popularity and momentum of Wikileaks to take from it the documentation and analysis that further strengthens our arguments and beliefs. This will allow for others, especially new audiences of interested people worldwide, to place the Wikileaks releases within a wider context and understanding. The reports from Wikileaks are ‘revelations’ only to those who largely adhere to the ‘illusions’ of the world: that we live in ‘democracies’ promoting ‘freedom’ around the world and at home, etc. The ‘revelations’ however, are not simply challenging American perceptions of America, but of all nations and their populations. The fact that these people are reading and discovering new things for which they are developing an interest is an incredible change. This is likely why the corporate media is so heavily involved in the dissemination of this information (which itself is a major source of suspicion for the alternative media): to control the interpretation of the message. It is the job of the alternative media and intellectuals and other thinking individuals to challenge that interpretation with factual analysis. The Wikileaks releases, in fact, give us more facts to place within and support our interpretations than they do for the corporate media.

    We must ask why the Wikileaks releases were ‘revelations’ for most people? Well, it was surprising simply for the fact that the media itself has such a strong hold on the access, dissemination and interpretation of information. They are ‘revelations’ because people are indoctrinated with myths. They are not ‘revelations’ to the alternative media because we have been talking about these things for years. However, while they may not necessarily be ‘revelations’, they are in fact, ‘confirmations’ and ‘vindications’ and bring more information to the analysis. It is in this, that a great opportunity lies. For since the leaks support and better inform our perspectives, we can build on this concept and examine how Wikileaks adds to and supports critical analysis. For those who are newly interested and looking for information, or for those who are having their previous perceptions challenged, it is the alternative media and critical voices alone who can place that information in a wider context for everyone else. In this, more people will see how it is the alternative media and critical perspectives which were more reflective of reality than say, the mainstream media (for which Wikileaks is a ‘revelation’). Thus, more people may soon start turning to alternative media and ideas; after all, our perspectives were vindicated, not those of the mainstream media (though they attempt to spin it as such).

    We are under a heavy propaganda offensive on the part of the global corporate and mainstream media to spin and manipulate these leaks to their own interests. We, as alternative media and voices, must use Wikileaks to our advantage. Ignoring it will only damage our cause and undermine our strength. The mainstream media understood that; so too, must we. Wikileaks presents in itself a further opportunity for the larger exposure of mainstream media as organized propaganda. By ‘surprising’ so many people with the ‘revelations’, the media has in effect exposed itself as deeply inadequate in their analysis of the world and the major issues within it. While currently it is giving the mainstream media a great boost, we are still immersed in the era of the ‘Technological Revolution’ and there is still (for now, anyway) Internet freedom, and thus, the tide can quickly turn.

    Like the saying goes, ‘the rich man will sell you the rope to hang him with if he thinks he can make a buck on it.’ Perhaps the mainstream media has done the same. No other organized apparatus was as capable of disseminating as much material as quickly and with such global reach as the mainstream media. If the leaks initially only made it into alternative media, then the information would only reach those whom are already reading the alternative press. In that, they would not be such grand ‘revelations’ and would have had a muted effect. In the mainstream media’s global exposure of Wikileaks material (never mind their slanted and propagandistic interpretations), they have changed the dynamic and significance of the information. By reaching wider and new audiences, the alternative and critical voices can co-opt these new audiences; lead them away from the realm of information ‘control’ into the realm of information ‘access’. This is potentially one of the greatest opportunities presented for the alternative and critical voices of the world.

    Wikileaks is a globally transformative event. Not simply in terms of awakening new people to ‘new’ information, but also in terms of the effect it is having upon global power structures, itself. With ambassadors resigning, diplomats being exposed as liars and tools, political rifts developing between Western imperial allies, and many careers and reputations of elites around the world at great risk, Wikileaks is creating the potential for an enormous deterioration in the effectiveness of imperialism and domination. That, in itself, is an admirable and worthy goal. That this is already a reality is representative of how truly transformative Wikileaks is and could be. People, globally, are starting to see their leaders through a lens not filtered by ‘public relations.’ Through mainstream media, it gets filtered through propaganda, which is why it is an essential duty of the alternative media and critical thinkers to place this information in a wider, comprehensive context. This would further erode the effectiveness of empire.

    With the reaction of several states and policing organizations to issue arrest warrants for Julian Assange, or in calling for his assassination (as one Canadian adviser to the Prime Minister suggested on television), these organizations and individuals are exposing their own hatred of democracy, transparency and freedom of information. Their reactions can be used to discredit their legitimacy to ‘rule’. If policing agencies are supposed to “protect and serve,” why are they seeking instead to “punish and subvert” those who expose the truth? Again, this comes as no surprise to those who closely study the nature of the state, and especially the modern phenomenon of the militarization of domestic society and the dismantling of rights and freedoms. However, it is happening before the eyes of the whole world, and people are paying attention. This is new.

    This is an incredible opportunity to criticize foreign policy (read: ‘imperial strategy’), and to disembowel many global power structures. More people, now, than ever before, will be willing to listen, learn and investigate for themselves. Wikileaks should be regarded as a ‘gift’, not a ‘distraction.’ Instead of focusing on the parts of the Wikileaks cables which do not reflect the perspectives of the alternative media (such as on Iran), we must use Wikileaks to better inform our own understanding not simply of the ‘policy’ itself, but of the complex social interactions and ideas that create the basis for the ‘policy’ to be carried out. In regards to the diplomatic cables themselves, we are better able to understand the nature of diplomats as ‘agents of empire,’ and so instead of discounting the cables as ‘propaganda’ we must use them against the apparatus of empire itself: to expose the empire for what it is. Wikileaks helps to unsheathe and strip away the rhetoric behind imperial policy, and expose diplomats not as ‘informed observers’, but as ‘agents of power.’ The reaction by nations, organizations and institutions around the world adds further fuel to this approach, as we are seeing the utter distaste political leaders have for ‘democracy’ and ‘freedom of information’, despite their rhetoric. Several institutions of power can be more widely exposed in this manner.

    A recent addition to this analysis can be in the role played by universities not in ‘education’ but in ‘indoctrination’ and the production of new ‘agents of power.’ For example, Columbia University is one of the most “respected” and “revered” universities in the world, which has produced several individuals and significant sectors of the political elite (including diplomats). In reaction to the Wikileaks releases, Columbia University has warned “students they risk future job prospects if they download any of the material,” which followed “a government ban on employees, estimated at more than two-and-a-half million people, using work computers and other communication devices to look at diplomatic cables released by WikiLeaks.” The University “emailed students at the university’s school of international and public affairs, a recruiting ground for the state department.” Good for Columbia! What do they think university is for, ‘education’ or something? How dare students take education into their own hands, especially students who will likely be future diplomats. This university reaction to Wikileaks helps call into attention the role of universities in our society, and specifically the role of universities in shaping the future ‘managers’ of the imperial apparatus.

    MUCH MORE here:

    If we choose to bury our heads in the sand then we cannot complain as the bulldozer crushes us.


  10. Augustus…LOL

    The leaks become like the Bible…all down to interpretation…context…and spinnin’ them the way the interpreter sees fit. As in fittin’ their agenda(s).


  11. Well then, I believe it’s simply Karma that is besetting Israel. They should’ve done a deal with Yasser Arafat instead of killing him. Then Iran would not have had the psychological leverage over other Middle Eastern States that it now has. Give a little, gain a lot.

  12. Top advice from Joseph Stiglitz:

    December 7, 2010

    Why the Special Interests Would Block It

    A Five Point Plan to Cut the Deficit and Repair Economic Damage


    it is relatively easy to formulate a deficit-reduction package that boosts efficiency, bolsters growth, and reduces inequality. Five core ingredients are required.

    First, spending on high-return public investments should be increased. Even if this widens the deficit in the short run, it will reduce the national debt in the long run. What business wouldn’t jump at investment opportunities yielding returns in excess of 10 percent if it could borrow capital—as the U.S. government can—for less than 3 percent interest?

    Second, military expenditures must be cut—not just funding for the fruitless wars, but also for the weapons that don’t work against enemies that don’t exist. We’ve continued as if the Cold War never came to an end, spending as much on defense as the rest of the world combined.

    [Third] Following this is the need to eliminate corporate welfare. Even as America has stripped away its safety net for people, it has strengthened the safety net for firms, evidenced so clearly in the Great Recession with the bailouts of AIG, Goldman Sachs, and other banks. Corporate welfare accounts for nearly one-half of total income in some parts of U.S. agro-business, with billions of dollars in cotton subsidies, for example, going to a few rich farmers—while lowering prices and increasing poverty among competitors in the developing world.

    An especially egregious form of corporate special treatment is that afforded to the drug companies. Even though the government is the largest buyer of their products, it is not allowed to negotiate prices, thereby fueling an estimatedincrease in corporate revenues—and costs to the government—approaching $1 trillion dollars over a decade.

    Another example is the smorgasbord of special benefits provided to the energy sector, especially oil and gas, thereby simultaneously robbing the treasury, distorting resource allocation, and destroying the environment. Then there are the seemingly endless giveaways of national resources—from the free spectrum provided to broadcasters to the low royalties levied on mining companies to the subsidies to lumber companies.

    [Fourth] Creating a fairer and more efficient tax system, by eliminating the special treatment of capital gains and dividends, is also needed. Why should those who work for a living be subject to higher tax rates than those who reap their livelihood from speculation (often at the expense of others)?

    [Fifth] Finally, with more than 20 percent of all income going to the top 1 percent, a slight increase, say 5 percent, in taxes actually paid would bring in more than $1 trillion over the course of a decade.

    A deficit-reduction package crafted along these lines would more than meet even the most ardent deficit hawk’s demands. It would increase efficiency, promote growth, improve the environment, and benefit workers and the middle class.

    There’s only one problem: It wouldn’t benefit those at the top, or the corporate and other special interests that have come to dominate America’s policymaking. Its compelling logic is precisely why there is little chance that such a reasonable proposal would ever be adopted.

    More here:



  13. Pingback: Assange in prison…whilst war-mongers roam freely « Café Whispers | World Media Information

  14. “The USA live in a democracy, don’t they?”

    Some think so Eddie…but is it functioning?

    How many don’t vote? How many corporates donate? K-Street…lobby groups.

    The crappy electoral college system.

    Some refer to it as a republic. Rome style.

    “I think there should be more Wikileaks”

    Yes, but also far more focus on the info that’s already out there that our MSM are too oft willin’ to ignore or distort. Or not get off their butts and search for.

    That info…such as the stuff on Plamegate…the Downing Street Memo…damaged the Busheviks.

    We must be FEARLESS. And wide in our searches.


  15. Feral @5.12pm, I think it was Arafat who wouldn’t come to the party for various reasons.

    There is plenty of speculation about the cause of his death, AIDS (which has been discounted), poisoning (also discounted), liver disease, a stroke etc. etc. However, it seems to be generally agreed that he died of natural causes.

    His widow wouldn’t allow a post mortem, so no one really knows what killed him. I don’t know whether it’s traditional Muslim practice not to have a post mortem, but I think people are supposed to be buried within 24 hours of their death; a very sensible practice considering the climate.

    The USA live in a democracy,don’t they?

    So they keep saying, Eddie.

  16. Rudd is currently killing ’em with a combination of humor and logic on Ch10 re Assange’s arrest and the leaks.

  17. jane,
    My point still stands. If both the Jews and the Palestinians had come to the table and both dropped their innate antagonisms towards each other, a deal could have been reached which would have forestalled the rise of Iran. Iran have fed off Middle Eastern resentment about the Palestinian situation to aid their rise to power there. In this way Israel has suffered, and will continue to suffer into the future as more countries around them affiliate with Iran.

  18. Wow! I am very glad that my son was listening to music instead of reading the Fairfax Press online. Otherwise he would have read how Julian Assange did virtually no formal schooling, yet has risen to a position where he is destabilising the world order. I just want my baby to do his homework! So Shhh! Nobody tell him, OK?

  19. Found the following interesting related to Mark Arbib & the Wikileaks:

    From Yank in the ranks by Philip Dorling
    December 9, 2010, SMH:

    He warned that it would be ”a tough struggle for the Labor Party to win the federal elections in 2007” but that he thought Mr Beazley, because he was the opposite of the volatile Mark Latham, was the right man to lead the ALP at the present time.

    Well, Arbib was wrong there. I’m glad that some of us pushed hard for Rudd & Gillard. I like Beazley, but I don’t think he woulda made it across the line. And what a disaster that woulda been…think WorkChoices. Rudd & Gillard did a superb job durin’ that election campaign.

    Senator Arbib also told embassy officers that, unlike Mr Beazley, he supported Australia’s military commitment in Iraq ”as well as the war on terrorism in general”.

    Bit of a Bushevik/Neo-Con eh? Now wonder he’s on the Right of the party. Iraq was a strategic & financial disaster.

    In October last year, as Mr Rudd’s popular support began to sag, Senator Arbib openly canvassed leadership tensions within the government, telling diplomats Mr Rudd wanted ”to ensure that there are viable alternatives to Gillard within the Labor Party to forestall a challenge”.

    So, it didn’t take long for Arbib to get scared over polls…bit fickle & lackin’ perserverence I reckon. Ya get hit hard ya defend yer PM no matter what, especially when ya know some in the media have vested interest in creatin’ chaos, character assassination… in the early stages of a government when things can be wobbly in trainin’ wheels mode ya expect some murmurs of criticism from advisors & cabinet members…and even fronting up to the leader & tellin’ hard truths yes…but workin’ behind the scenes to undermine them the moment ya smell bad polls kinda comes across as pathetic.

    But that’s politics…a hard game.

    I don’t like the thought that Arbib was underminin’ the Rudd leadership whilst collaboratin’ w/ the Americans…it could possibly be seen as workin’ for others rather than the good of yer own nation.

    I’ve always wondered if it was the “War on Terror” supporters, those associated w/ the big miners & media moguls who decided to take him down. Makes ya wonder if some of the reasons he was taken down were slightly or more exagerrated & distorted.

    Seems to me their was an oddball alliance of assassins that worked together, occasionally reluctantly, to do the dirty deed.

    Reminds me of the oddball alliance of characters involved in the Iraq War invasion.

    I don’t blame Julia Gillard…she’s a dynamo & has the right to jockey for the leadership…keeps a leader on their toes. It’s to be expected. As would Rudd’s attempt to ensure he kept his job by promotin’ other leadership potentials. What’s new about that? Look at Abbott. It’s just about natural survival instincts comin’ to the fore by way of political tactics…in a highly competitive framework.

    Senator Arbib said Mr Rudd still appreciated Ms Gillard’s strengths, while another unidentified adviser to Mr Rudd told diplomats that ”while the PM respects Gillard, his reluctance to share power will eventually lead to a falling-out, while Gillard will not want to acquiesce in creating potential rivals”.

    Not unusual. Blair & Brown in the UK.


  20. All companies having been co-opted by the jack-booted storm-troopers are today getting pwned by Assange’s hacking fraternity. Love to see what they’re going to do about that – given that actually, there’s fuck-all they can do lol

  21. I will say that I’ve been very impressed w/ Bill Shorten’s performance of late…Q&A…the way he dealt w/ that dudd Peter Dutton SKY this morn.

    I was pretty pissed w/ him after the Rudd axing…but he’s come a long way in my estimation. He’s been diplomatic about the issue…puttin’ the party first…not fartin’ on like some…that includes Barry Cassidy.

    I reckon Shorten could be a real candidate for PM down the line. I’m more impressed the more I see him of late. He knows how to compose himself & get over the hurdles.

    And take it to the opposition.


    Dutton came across as a NEGABORe & bumblin’ Abbott copycat fool…again…this morn. Nothin’ to offer. He needs to pick up his game. He was outplayed by the articulate & quick thinkin’ Shorten.


  22. Publish and Be Damned?

    So, has Julian Assange
    Begun to understand
    How ‘freedom of the press’
    Is now licence to oppress?
    News Limited’s “The Times”
    Is exploiting his crimes
    As an alleged ‘raper.’
    With every other paper
    They own. These juicy bits
    Will get millions of hits;
    Does his Wikileaks fame
    Give protection from shame?
    Will what’s considered a crime
    Not be thought one this time?
    Is he really at fault
    In this case of assault?
    Can the Swedish vice squad
    Nab this man who played God?
    Any hope for this story
    To be headlined with glory
    By the heir of his hero,
    Sir Keith, would be zero,
    Except Rupert wants blood
    From Obama and Rudd
    In his media war
    On all they stand for.
    Assange should be wishing
    All that dirt he’s been dishing
    Was leaked – not from a democracy
    But from the dark heart of Murdochracy.

  23. Damo, it’s certainly a new world. The corporate aristocracy will learn that if they stomp on people…or are complicit in other’s stompin’ actions…they will also be stomped on.

    There’s been far too much bullyin’ by corporates for far too long.

    Some have limited liability…they reap the benefits…but are not willin’ to share them enuff…apart from big shareholders…and then expect to be bailed out in Socialist-like fashion when they fail or things go wrong economy-wide.

    But they’re oft quite willin’ to support politicians & measures that crush or diminish the entitlements of the workers & general customers.

    And do the biddin’ of governments when it comes to protectin’ their own interests. Even at the expense of individual rights. They can be a law unto themselves. W/ mighty lawyers.

    I’m of the view that if yer fed up w/ a company’s behaviour…then stop buyin’ their product…change yer loyalties…and ya shouldn’t be afraid to inform people as to why. Too oft these companies/corporations have no trouble pissin’ on each other…stealin’ one another’s ideas/info/designs in order to get ahead…

    even media dump on one another (look at Fox goin’ at CNN in the past…or the Murdoch’s goin’ after the ABC)…

    we can’t allow one rule for them and another for us.

    A democracy is about THE PEOPLE…not just corporations actin’ like all-consumin’ jungle beasts.

    I’m of the belief that if a company does well by you…then you should also let people know. The providers of goods & services can thrive from the positive views of those trusted by others.

    It shouldn’t just come down to who can afford the most advertising, biggest ad budgets, owns or has privileged access to the main megaphones.

    For instance, I was gonna dump Foxtel at one point due to the Murdoch empire’s unrelentin’ attacks on Rudd & Labor…but I thought it unfair on the other shareholders…

    After close scrutiny I assessed that SKY NEWS was bein’ fairly balanced much of the time (tho, they do have their “kowtow to their own biases” days)…

    and I do enjoy channels such as UKTV, Comedy Channel, TV1, Showcase, movie stuff, Sci-Fi Channel (where’s the bloody HD version tho?…I’m havin’ to watch Stargate Atlantis on free-to-air now…so where’s my money’s worth there?)…

    and I like gettin’ access to various news channels (shame the ABC 24 doesn’t have the digital multi-screens)…and so on.

    And I like the IQ2 recordin’ system. Handy.

    So I weighed it up & thought, nah…don’t let Murdoch ruin yer enjoyment. My wife felt the same.

    But I refuse to buy the Murdoch papers.

    And now I’m thinkin’ of changin’ from my Mastercard due to the Assange episode.

    Their comes a time when we say, enuff is enuff.


  24. Given Arbib’s involvment in this I don’t think that Gillard will have any option but to sack him and for the reason that Nas’ has provided “I don’t like the thought that Arbib was underminin’ the Rudd leadership whilst collaboratin’ w/ the Americans…it could possibly be seen as workin’ for others rather than the good of yer own nation”.

  25. Thnx for the useful link Pip.

    Min, I reckon this is the biggest piece of poo I’ve read all day…self-justifyin’, self-spruikin’ from the great character assassins themselves, The Australian:

    Time for the really big story behind WikiLeaks

    I expected no less from the Murdoch empire.

    Not only a misleadin’ headline…but also full of sh*t & hyperbole.

    Any Laborite who pissed on Rudd to this lot should be ashamed of themselves.

    Now, Bushevik diplomats…that’s not unexpected. The Bush lot were always devious & dobby.


  26. For anyone interested, (cut and paste from Pilgers Home Page)

    In two ABC Radio Australia interviews, John Pilger asks Australians to break their silence and rally round compatriot Julian Assange, the editor-in-chief of Wikileaks. John Pilger’s new film, ‘The War You Don’t See’, due to be released in Australia in 2011, will feature an interview with Queensland born Assange.

    First interview – Breakfast (3 Dec) | Second interview – Late Night Live (6 Dec)

    Details of protests in Australia to defend Julian Assange are below…


    5.30pm, Brisbane Square, Top of Queen St Mall, Brisbane
    Facebook event:



    12pm, DFAT (Department of Foriegn Affairs and Trade) 245 Ann St, Brisbane
    Facebook event:


    4.30pm, State Library as part of the World Human Rights Day rally
    Facebook event:


    1pm, Sydney Town Hall. Speakers include Antony Lowenstein, the Pirate Party & others
    Facebook event:

    5.30pm, Sydney Town Hall. The Human Rights Day speak-out.
    Facebook event:

    6pm, outside Wesley Church, corner of Hay and William Streets, Perth city. ‘Support the work of Wikileaks, support freedom of speech’ at the Vigil for Human Rights
    Facebook event:



    12 Dec 1pm, Parliament House, North Terrace

  27. Thank you for the link Nas’. One thing that stands out is that the OO immediately forges ahead with a good dose of self-justification but then proceeds to admit,

    But the WikiLeaks “scoops” should be seen in perspective. In the main, the cables contain low-level intelligence bordering on high-class gossip.

    Therefore the conclusion would be that their description of Rudd being “an abrasive, impulsive control freak as prime minister…” is likewise no more than “high-class gossip”.

  28. Nasking I see that Crikey are running details of Overington’s glimpse of how Rupert and the Right will be coming out in support of Assange and Wikileaks in the OO. Howard has joined him too. It sickens me to think of how it will all be used against the Left.

    I’ll be editing my ‘pome’ above slightly to reflect Murdoch’s stance here. But I still think this Wikileaks saga is the worst thing that could happen to governments on the left right now. Timing is everything, I guess.

  29. Pip, from the New Yorker article ya linked to:

    Assange, despite his claims to scientific journalism, emphasized to me that his mission is to expose injustice, not to provide an even-handed record of events. In an invitation to potential collaborators in 2006, he wrote, “Our primary targets are those highly oppressive regimes in China, Russia and Central Eurasia, but we also expect to be of assistance to those in the West who wish to reveal illegal or immoral behavior in their own governments and corporations.” He has argued that a “social movement” to expose secrets could “bring down many administrations that rely on concealing reality—including the US administration.”

    In regard to revealing “illegal or immoral behavior in their own governments and corporations”…I say, go for it!!!



  30. Thnx for the info Augustus.

    Therefore the conclusion would be that their description of Rudd being “an abrasive, impulsive control freak as prime minister…” is likewise no more than “high-class gossip”.

    LOL Min. Spot on. Tho, I reckon there’s plenty of low-brow, sewer-ridden stuff that come thru the Murdoch empire too.

    I understand yer concerns but I’m not as worried. I reckon Murdoch the Opportunist & Howard the Bush licker will have their hands bitten soon enuff.

    Smiles & smirks can vanish pretty quickly these days.

    Labor just needs to tough it out…and remember who is really givin’ them the hardest time. Payback.

    Great poem BTW.


  31. Speakin’ of corporate aristocrats…imagine havin’ the money Rupert Murdoch & this lady do…and bein’ able to buy parts of the MEGAPHONES that speak to millions?:

    Life according to Gina: mining magnate brings an axe to Fairfax

    by James Thomson

    Gina Rinehart’s $50 million investment in Fairfax Media would seem to confirm one of the theories regarding her sudden interest in the media sector, and blow up a few others.

    For example, it now seems unlikely that the main motivation for buying into Ten Network was to make money by supporting James Packer’s turnaround strategy for the broadcaster.
    Instead, by buying into Fairfax so shortly after she spent $170 million on her Ten investment, Rinehart appears to be underlining the message that she wants a bigger audience for her pro-mining sector views.

    More here:

    Yer average Aussie is lucky to be heard…that’s one reason we start up blogs…and sites that link to useful blog sites, like Mig’s Australian Blog Sites:

    It ensures that WE THE PEOPLE have a voice too…

    not just those who are fortunate (?) enuff to be born into a mega-rich dynasty…or inherit money, contacts & reputation…the corporate aristocracy.

    Time for a real change.


  32. Assange bein’ in an English jail got me for some reason thinkin’ of this great film:

    In the Name of the Father – Bono & Gavin Friday

  33. Assange said my frinds you are all missing the point
    I will be treated like royalty while I sit in the joint
    You see my friends this has all been before
    The Pentagon papers My Lai Watergate and more

    You see folks nothing will change for you and me
    No long winded fine words about democracy
    Life will go on we will keep getting fooled
    Only the rich and powerful are really schooled

    They are schooled in the art of avarice and vice
    I know that is well known and not very nice
    But as we discuss analyse and pontificate
    The domocracy we all dream of will have to wait

    When does the footy start?

  34. “I’m predicting that my team’s season will be over by round 10. ”

    Mine (Fremantle Dockers) should go close to a Premiership me thinks. But I will wait for the Wiki cable before I commit.

  35. “My team is Port Adelaide. Shhhhh.”

    Ahhhh Port Adelaide I worked there in the seventies on the tugs. And I do mean floating tugs, not tugging.

    Great place.I bet its changed a lot. Many a good piss up at the Exchange.

  36. Gettin’ back to Wikileaks…a found this disturbin’…considerin’ the info we’ve received from Sri Lankans fleein’ their land:

    WikiLeaks and Sri Lanka: Who are the real criminals?
    by K. Ratnayake

    (December 09, Colombo, Sri Lanka Guardian)

    Among the hundreds of secret diplomatic cables so far released by WikiLeaks, one sent from the US embassy in Sri Lanka has confirmed that the Obama administration was well aware of the war crimes committed by President Mahinda Rajapakse and his associates during the final stages of the war against Liberation Tigers of Tamil Eelam (LTTE) in early 2009. The document highlights the fact that who is deemed a criminal, or not, is determined entirely by the US and its allies according to the requirements of their economic and strategic interests.

    The cable, transmitted by the US Ambassador to Colombo, Patricia A. Butenis in January this year, stated the prospect of any investigation into war crimes in Sri Lanka had been “complicated by the fact that responsibility for many of the alleged crimes rests with the country’s senior civilian and military leadership, including President Rajapakse and his brothers and opposition candidate General Fonseka.”

    The Obama administration and its allies are relentlessly hounding WikiLeaks and seeking to criminalise its founder Julian Assange, whose only “crime” has been to help expose to the world the dirty intrigues and crimes carried out by US imperialism. WikiLeaks has performed a decisive service in allowing ordinary people internationally to gain a glimpse of the secret diplomacy of Washington and its partners, including throughout the Indian sub-continent, from Afghanistan and Pakistan to Sri Lanka.

    As a result of US pressure, Assange is now behind bars in Britain, fighting extradition to Sweden on trumped-up charges. By contrast, President Mahinda Rajapakse, who is directly responsible for war crimes, is free to roam the world, and was last week welcomed in London by the British government. Washington has never publicly named Rajapakse, his brothers or former Army Commander Fonseka as being responsible for the atrocities in Sri Lanka, despite a mountain of evidence in the public domain.

    The UN has estimated that at least 7,000 Tamil civilians were killed between January and May 2009 as the security forces repeatedly attacked civilians trapped in the government’s own “no-fire zone”. The International Crisis Group compiled evidence of the killing of an estimated 30,000 to 75,000 civilians, with hospitals deliberately targeted for bombardment. Across Sri Lanka, hundreds more people, including journalists and politicians, are known to have disappeared at the hands of pro-government death squads that operated with impunity.

    The US was complicit in these crimes and helped cover up who was responsible for them. In 2006, the US and other major powers effectively backed the Rajapakse government when it restarted the war against the LTTE, even though Rajapakse brazenly violated a 2002 ceasefire. Only once it became clear that the LTTE would be defeated did Washington voice reservations about “human rights violations”, but only as a means to pressure on Rajapakse to fall into line with Washington.

    In the post-war positioning for influence over the strategically-located island, the Obama administration’s prime concern was that China had used the war to build close relations with Colombo. Beijing had provided the Rajapakse regime with weapons and funds to fight the war, in return for economic and strategic concessions, including naval access to a major new southern port being constructed at Hambantota.

    The State Department issued a vague call last year for an international probe into “human right violations”—as if they were committed by individual soldiers or middle-ranking military officers—while also blaming the LTTE for atrocities. It is now documented that Washington was fully aware that the major crimes were committed under Rajapakse, who is not only president, but also the defence minister and commander in chief of the armed forces.

    The US dropped the “human rights” pretence when it became clear that it was not assisting in the effort to woo or coerce Rajapakse, but instead was proving counter-productive. Butenis’s cable took the same approach as last December’s US Senate Foreign Relations Committee report, which highlighted the danger to US strategic interests of China’s growing influence in Colombo. The report declared that the US could not afford to “lose Sri Lanka”. A preoccupation with “human rights” would “shortchange US geostrategic interests in the region,” it stated.

    More here:

    Pragmatism. No justice. Shame.

    Assange in prison. Sri Lankan war criminals roam free.


  37. Seems the Chinese have “no morals” when it comes to competin’ w/ the USA in Africa, accordin’ to this US embassy cable:


    16. (C) What is the status of America’s influence in Africa and how does it compare to China, Fawthrop queried? The influence of the United States has increased in Africa, the A/S countered. The United States’ reputation is stable and its popularity is the highest in Africa compared to anywhere else in the world. Obama has helped to increase that influence. “We must manage the expectations of the Obama administration” offered the A/S.

    The United States does not consider China a military, security or intelligence threat.

    China is a very aggressive and pernicious economic competitor with no morals. China is not in Africa for altruistic reasons. China is in Africa for China primarily.

    A secondary reason for China’s presence is to secure votes in the United Nations from African countries.

    A third reason is to prove that Taiwan is not an issue.

    There are trip wires for the United States when it comes to China. Is China developing a blue water navy? Have they signed military base agreements? Are they training armies? Have they developed intelligence operations? Once these areas start developing then the United States will start worrying.

    The United States will continue to push democracy and capitalism while Chinese authoritarian capitalism is politically challenging.

    The Chinese are dealing with the Mugabe’s and Bashir’s of the world, which is a contrarian political model, A/S Carson stated.

    More here:

    And yet it seems America is willin’ to look the other way when it comes to war crimes committed by their own top level people (Abu Graib etc.)…or if the competition w/ China necessitates it (see Sri Lanka above).

    Sad days indeed. HOPE runs down the drain.

    But then, it often does…because humanity is oft willin’ to drop principles to get ahead. Our governments are really merely reflections of our own survival instincts.

    And corporate aristocrats lookin’ for the next place to plunder.


  38. Nas.

    I don’t want to put a dampener on your excellent posts, but I think this will all blow over in a few weeks. If people really cared about the revelations of Wiki, we would be marching in the streets.Remember it is nearly Xmas and the homage must be paid to the Gods of capitalism. The bright lights of Xmas trees and store nativity scenes have everyone in an hypnotic state. One catchword like ‘bargain’ and the plebes will relieve themselves of their cash.It is like an incurable disease.

    It will take a bit more than a few leaked embassy cables to stir the beast. At the end of the day, me/you are talking to the converted. Sure we are roughly 50% of the true believers, we know what is going on, but if we can’t convince the other half wits that believe the man is all goodness and light. What’s the point?

    You don’t need a PhD in philosophy to know we are getting screwed. Go over to some of the more intellectual sites like L.P. these pseudo lefties are the problem. They really do think the mums and dads trying to pay their mortgage and feed their kids give a flying F#%* about all this.They don’t.

    When in a few months, a couple of years maybe when the country is in the right royal shit house, both financially and morally, we may just get the great un-washed out of their comas.

    Until then do like I do. Just take the piss out of conservative half witted dorks.It wont change F.A. but it makes one feel wonderful.

  39. “What’s the point?”

    End of segregation in the USA & Apartheid in Sth Africa. End of slavery in the USA.

    Universal & affordable public health, education & childcare.

    Stronger rights for workers, improved conditions, better wages.

    Pursuance of equal rights for gays & lesbians.

    The franchise/voting rights for those who are not just wealthy landowners or men.

    Bringing end to wars such as Vietnam & Iraq.

    Ensurin’ people can interpret texts for themselves…and not leave it to patriarchs, fanatics & zealots preachin’ from the pulpit.

    Exposin’ problems w/ palm oil.

    Gettin’ compensation for victims of toxins, poisons, whilst exposin’ negligent & deceitful companies.

    Building the internet…connecting people, organisations & communities.

    The list goes on.

    Some above have been achieved thru history…some are still in progress.

    Plenty of people ARE marching. Creating & signing petitions. Participating in class actions. Taking MSM to task.

    Many use the internet to spread information…empower…use the abilities they have.

    There are some good people on Lavartus Prodeo who also march…and provide useful ideas & information, like many blogs.

    Thnx for the compliment…but I don’t require it…and unfortunately yer cynicism is misplaced. Not unlike that of so many in the Murdoch empire. And those who remain silent.

    That’s yer choice.

    We do what we do.

    It’s as simple as that.


  40. What will it take to rid Italy of Berlusconi’s corrupt leadership?:

    A week ago:

    WikiLeaks cables: Berlusconi ‘profited from secret deals’ with Putin…Russian PM allegedly promised Italian leader a cut of energy contracts, leaked US dispatches say

    Rob Evans, Luke Harding and John Hooper, Thursday 2 December 2010

    Wikileaks cables reveal allegations of corrupt financial links between Italian prime minister, Silvio Berlusconi, and Russian leader Vladimir Putin.

    US diplomats have reported startling suspicions that Silvio Berlusconi could be “profiting personally and handsomely” from secret deals with the Russian prime minister, Vladimir Putin, according to cables released by WikiLeaks.

    Exasperated by Berlusconi’s pro-Russian behaviour, American embassy staff detail allegations circulating in Rome that the Italian leader has been promised a cut of huge energy contracts.

    The two men are known to be personally close, but this is the first time allegations of a financial link have surfaced.

    More here:


    9 December 2010

    Could Puglia governor Nichi Vendola be ‘Italy’s Obama’?

    By Rosie Goldsmith

    BBC News

    Next week the Italian Prime Minister Silvio Berlusconi faces a vote of confidence in parliament. If the result triggers an election, could Nichi Vendola be the man to challenge him?

    Watching Nichi Vendola perform in front of thousands of supporters, it strikes me that he and Silvio Berlusconi are a bit alike. They are both charismatic speakers with big personalities. They are the rock stars of Italian politics. And they are both short.

    But that’s it. In all other ways, they are opposites. Mr Vendola, the left-wing, openly gay governor of the southern region of Puglia, is campaigning to become Prime Minister, whereas Mr Berlusconi, the man who has dominated Italian politics for 15 years, is struggling to remain in the job.

    Mr Berlusconi used to be admired for his energy, optimism and business acumen. Even his gaffes were tolerated. No longer.

    Many believed the Prime Minister was targeting Mr Vendola when he joked on television: “It’s better to love beautiful women than to be gay.”

    Mr Vendola immediately retaliated with a YouTube statement. “The time for jokes is over,” he said. “Your jokes can’t amuse a country that’s exhausted, impoverished, scared, insecure and abandoned.”

    Italy’s Obama?

    Mr Vendola, who is based in Bari, the capital of Puglia, campaigns tirelessly via the internet. If Mr Berlusconi controls the media, Mr Vendola’s team explains, then they will use the web.

    More here:

    Italy, time for a change. Some fresh air.


  41. Another reason we need to balance public & private interests…not let the corporate aristocrats push our governments around…but recognising that regulating them appropriately can lead to better outcomes than just nationalising everything that moves:

    WikiLeaks cables: Oil giants squeeze Chávez as Venezuela strugglesAmerican diplomats say president is now desperate to attract foreign partners after nationalisation frightened many away

    Rory Carroll in Caracas, Thursday 9 December 2010

    WikiLeaks cables reveal that all is not well at Venezuela’s state-owned oil company PDVSA.

    Venezuela’s tottering economy is forcing Hugo Chávez to make deals with foreign corporations to save his socialist revolution from going broke.

    The Venezuelan president has courted European, American and Asian companies in behind-the-scenes negotiations that highlight a severe financial crunch in his government.

    Venezuela’s state-owned oil company, PDVSA, is the engine of the economy but buckled when given an ultimatum by its Italian counterpart and has scrambled to attract foreign partners, according to confidential US embassy cables released by WikiLeaks.

    The memos depict an unfolding economic fiasco and suggest some of Chávez’s key allies – Argentina, Brazil and Cuba – are gravely concerned at Venezuela’s direction. “President Chávez, for his part, is acutely aware of the impact the country’s general economic trajectory has had on his popularity,” says one cable.

    With a recession, underfunded infrastructure and 30% inflation, Venezuela’s economic woes are no secret. But the government has insisted PDVSA, the country’s golden goose, is thriving and capable of funding Chávez’s vision of “21st century socialism”.

    Chávez took over the company and declared it a revolutionary instrument after defeating a management-led strike in 2003. He nationalised and expropriated swaths of the oil industry and said PDVSA would fill the slack left by departing foreign companies, declaring a triumph for sovereignty and socialism.

    Analysts have suspected all is not well, citing corruption, broken rigs and unpaid suppliers, but the foreign oil companies still in Venezuela stay largely silent lest they anger the government and find themselves locked out of the western hemisphere’s biggest energy reserves.

    However, in separate private conversations with the ambassador, Patrick Duddy, industry figures detailed the parlous state of the industry. A senior manager from Chevron estimated the state oil company’s output at 2.1m to 2.3m barrels per day, well below official declarations of 3.3m.

    Chevron was funnelling profits to the US and no longer investing in Venezuela, the manager said. An executive at oil exploration company Baker Hughes Inc said the firm had a similar strategy and “received a congratulatory message from BHI corporate headquarters for not growing the business (and increasing its risk exposure)”.

    A director of Mitsubishi in Venezuela was quoted as saying Chávez’s executives were struggling to attract investment. “[The businessman] stated that privately, senior PDVSA leadership is extremely upset with the failure of international companies to register bids. He added that Mitsubishi sent a letter to PDVSA explaining why the conditions offered by Venezuela were insufficient and what would need to be changed to make a bid commercially viable.”

    Italy’s ambassador to Caracas, Luigi Maccotta, told his US counterpart that Italian oil company ENI squeezed PDVSA over an Orinoco belt deal in January this year knowing it had no one else to turn to.

    The Italians delayed the signing by two days to reinforce the Venezuelan government’s “need for ENI”. Paolo Scaroni, the company’s CEO, then faced down Venezuela’s oil minister, Rafael Ramirez, over changes to terms and conditions.

    “Thirty minutes before the ceremony was supposed to begin Scaroni told Ramirez: ‘Take it or leave it, I can get on my plane and move on.’ Ramirez apparently used that half an hour to convince President Chávez to accept all of ENI’s proposed changes or risk losing the deal,” according to the US cable. The Italians said they would not pay PDVSA a standard signing bonus because the company already owed them $1bn.

    Venezuela’s oil minister, who is the head of PDVSA, travelled to Moscow and Beijing hoping for solidarity deals with allies, only to find the Russians and Chinese as profit-minded as western companies.

    Venezuela’s oil travails, combined with rolling power blackouts, decaying infrastructure and expropriations, have worried its other friends. Jorge Taiana, Argentina’s foreign minister, told a US envoy that Cristina Kirchner’s government did not agree with Chávez’s assault on the private sector. “Taiana said [former president] Péron had already gone through a nationalisation phase in the 1940s and the country had learned its lesson.”

    More here:

    Certainly we can expect some anti-Chavez rhetoric from the likes of Chevron…but we also know that Chavez has been turnin’ in desperation to some less than democratic global characters…and all is not well w/ the revolution.

    Anyone who has witnessed communism & over-the-top socialist practices knows there have been many failings.

    The same can be said for rampant capitalism. GFC is case in point.

    Let’s hope Chavez’s vision & pride & desperation doesn’t take Venezuala down a path of bad alliances & severe restrictions that creates more of a mess than before he took over…and leads to an extreme shift in the opposite direction later to redress the problems.

    I hope Chavez WAKES UP.


  42. “What’s the point?”

    Hey lighten up I’m on your side.I was at the anti Vietnam demonstrations, the wharfs at Fremantle, been on strike, donated to labor causes, international freedom from hunger, and am a paid up member of the Greens party. I have also chained myself to a tree and been arrested. Oh I have also wiped the arses of kids in wheel chairs, broke some fuckers nose for throwing ice cream on one of them, and I feed the odd stray cat.

    I am talking about Wiki leaks.

    Apart from comment here, what have you done?

    I stand by my comments the people are in a coma, nothing is going to change.The media has control of the masses and to deny that salient fact is bordering on delusion.

    While the intellectuals pontificate about where we are headed, time is running out.

    It may have passed by your attention, we have just had an election, the Labor party came with in a few votes of getting slung out. That happened not over a period of fifty years of natural progression, but in three short years. We came close to being saddled with a right wing zealot who would have made John Winston Howard, look like a social worker. So I wonder, why did that happen if we are making such great progress?It may still happen yet, so don’t hold your breath.

    My so called cynicism has another word it’s called realism. And please don’t lump me in with Murdoch, I find that nearly as offensive as your cheap history lesson.

    Slavery still exists in the States its called Walmart. In Africa its called Nike. The discrimination of people is alive and well. We still have more Indigenous people die in custody here than anywhere else in the world. They still put blacks and the poor in the electric chair in the U.S. The Iraq-Afghanistan war is still going strong, and let me know if and how, you’ll stop the immanent war with Iran that’s being ginned up.

    What can I do? Keep taking the piss, because logic just don’t cut it with right wingers.

  43. “Apart from comment here, what have you done?”

    I was a lad, early teen durin’ the Vietnam War…but I did demonstrate in Brissie against Pauline Hanson, I’ve been on strike, I raised money for African causes & pushed support in a small town back in the 80s for the NDP…I’ve helped educate poor migrants…worked w/ the disabled for 4 years and part of my duties were the same as you described. I worked for a number of years in a public school doin’ plenty of volunteer work.

    Durin’ the Iraq War I posted links & info regularly to politicians, blogs & serious current affairs shows.

    And now I’m givin’ you an opportunity to express yerself. 🙂

    In all seriousness, I was wonderin’ if you were a troll. Some I’ve come across are crafty & pretend to be what they’re not…and use cynical words & images to try & undermine blog & blogger support…attemptin’ to slowly undermine said blog/blogger…divert attention away from the topic…and attempt to put visitors off by statin’ “It’s a waste of time” etc.

    Glad to see you appear to be bona-fide Lynot.

    “So I wonder, why did that happen if we are making such great progress?It may still happen yet, so don’t hold your breath.”

    I agree, that was worryin’…but when ya have a dominatin’ media empire who seem determined to damage a government…and plenty of copycats…and a number of extremely wealthy individuals in the mining & other private industry sectors backing the attacks to the hilt & even funding their own ad campaigns…followed by the execution of a PM, it is to be expected that it would be a close call.

    However, the Greens have got the balance of power in the senate from July…which should please you as a paid up member…and they at least have a voice in the lower house now. All is not lost. Change is usually you know.

    And in the meantime more money flows into the public hospitals…and schools like my wives have received a morale boost due to renovations, new technology & funding for other maintenance, materials & resources.

    The Americans are gradually leavin’ Iraq after that train wreck…and Afghanistan will see troops leavin’ soon enuff…providin’ some essential education and protection for women, children & other innocents is important as we workout how to get the hell outa there.

    “My so called cynicism has another word it’s called realism. And please don’t lump me in with Murdoch, I find that nearly as offensive as your cheap history lesson.”

    I can fully understand why you would be offended…I retract that comparison. I imagine it must be similar to bein’ referred to as a Fascist…or privileged corporate aristocrat. As for the cheap history lesson…see it as “realism” too…a reminder…and a motivation for me…that social changes/revolution does occur.

    Yes, many jobs are exploitin’ labour power…and Walmart has done so on a number of occasions…but they’ve also had to back down in circumstances…and I don’t believe are comparable to the type of slavery witnessed in America & in the treatment of Aborigines here…nor young people in Africa driven to kill by insane rebel leaders…or beaten to death or into an obedient state as they are forced to work in mines, includin’ diamond ones.

    But yes, there’s alot more work to be done to ensure that the distribution of income & assets benefits the many…and not just the few. I concede that.

    A long way to go.

    And as students protest & rebel in the streets of London…and the populace in Greece & Ireland…Haiti…and many other places…as the bankers/ financiers and other corporate aristocrats are bailed out and ensure that some so called “progressives” & “liberals” become traitors to their causes & voters by turnin’ on the poor & less privileged to pay for their misdeeds & cons…we are reminded of the first days of the street battles & resistance in France in the 60s…and elsewhere…

    and wonder where all this will take us.

    Interestin’ days. When we are more concerned about a car of the royal family…rather than the hardship put on a younger generation tryin’ to get an education to compete w/ the privileged.

    And so the fires begin to burn…


  44. I’m merely sayin’ that this thread provides Lynot w/ an opportunity to express his view on the issues…as does the blog created by Migs & mates.

    As others on Road to Surfdom, Lavartus Prodeo, Troppo Armadillo, Huffington Post and elsewhere did for me in the past.

    It’s effort, believe it or not. Because I give a sh*t.

    So what are you doin’ TB? Apart from expressin’ bitterness and callin’ for Assange to be arrested & Wikileaks to be stopped.


  45. …expressin’ bitterness …

    rather … express a difference of opinion … when given the opportunity …

  46. Anna Ardin, one of the two complainants in the rape and sexual assault case against WikiLeaks editor-in-chief Julian Assange, has left Sweden, and may have ceased actively co-operating with the Swedish prosecution service and her own lawyer, sources in Sweden told Crikey today.

  47. Greetings everyone. Where to start? thanks for all the links.

    Link to article about one of Assange’s accusers.

    Assange Case: Evidence Destroyed Over and Over Again.,01.shtml

    Anger at “slave trader” Assange: wikileaks loyalists decide to break away.

    for info on Sri Lanka try International Crisis Group

    PS, I’ve been wondering whether those companies who have re-published the wikileaks are cherry-picking the juicy Labor Party gossip and whether they will eventually report any goss about the COALition ?? and will these companies face any of the heat now being directed at Assange ?? Not likely..

  48. PS, I’ve been wondering whether those companies who have re-published the wikileaks are cherry-picking the juicy Labor Party gossip and whether they will eventually report any goss about the COALition ?? and will these companies face any of the heat now being directed at Assange ?? Not likely..

    Very unlikely.

  49. Thnx Min…I fixed one link but missed the SMH one.

    Apparently, the screens turn black in China when overseas-based stations refer to Nobel Peace Prize winner Liu Xiaobo, accordin’ to BBC World News today.

    9 December 2010

    China blocks foreign websites ahead of ceremony

    China has blocked several foreign news websites, including the BBC and Norwegian broadcaster NRK, on the eve of the Nobel Peace Prize ceremony.

    Some Nobel-related reports on CNN were also reported to be inaccessible.

    A furious China has denounced the Nobel award honouring activist Liu Xiaobo – who is serving a 11-year prison term for subversion – as an “obscenity”.

    The Nobel Foundation has praised Mr Liu for his “long and non-violent struggle” for political reform in China.

    Beijing has criticised Norway, which is hosting Friday’s Nobel ceremony, and suggested that Western nations are trying to impose their values on China.

    In a statement, the BBC said: “We can confirm that all BBC sites, not just news, are blocked to users in China. We are not alone. It is the same for many other sites belonging to international news organisations.

    “We are disappointed that our audiences in China are denied access to our impartial and editorially independent journalism.”

    There has been no comment from Beijing.

    More here:


    Wikileaks: China made example of Nobel winner Liu

    MADRID | Fri Dec 10, 2010

    Reuters) – China chose to make an example of Nobel Peace Prize winner Liu Xiaobo by jailing him for 11 years last year during a wider crackdown on dissidents, Spain’s El Pais newspaper said on Thursday, citing U.S. diplomatic cables obtained by WikiLeaks.

    China has called the award to dissident Liu “an obscenity”, while the Nobel Peace Prize panel defended the decision, saying it was based on “universal values”.

    The cables reported Beijing increased pressure on dissidents last year due to concerns of renewed civil unrest coinciding with the 20th anniversary of the Tiananmen Square protests and the 50th anniversary of the occupation of Tibet.

    More here:

    How pathetic. The Chinese authorities are so worried about protectin’ their & their family’s interests & privileges they are willin’ to undermine any goodwill towards their country w/ such immature acts.

    To think that such a great nation w/ such an amazin’ history has yet again started to erect a wall…and insulate itself from truth, justice & world views…

    in a time where Chinese companies are benefittin’ from new technology & global trade…it truly makes ya yearn for the rise of a new generation of leaders who understand the needs of the people NOW…not just the needs of THE FEW.


  50. Just for the record … and my opinion …

    While Wikileaks (and Julian Assange) may seem like the saviours of free speech … in the Western World democracies, at least … they have probably done more to hinder the future of OUR free speech than many seem to see … in the heat of the moment …

    Governments around the world need only one excuse (that they have now been given) to start controlling the internet (Stephen Conroy must be giggling in his beer!).

    And before the “believers” start! Anything in our world can be controlled … anything … there is always more than one way to skin a cat …

    While the G7 and G20 groups supposedly only discuss economic development one would be naieve in the extreme to think other topics are not discussed … ie control of the internet … for it only needs a combined effort from our governments … along with royal/dictatorial regimes … to take our world back to the 1960’s and beyond (I’ve been there, you don’t want to go! Early sixties perhaps and The Beatles 🙂 ).

    Wikileaks may, in fact, have put democracy as we know it at serious risk. The documents being released do not in themselves contain information that is terribly damaging or not readily available to most Google savvy individuals.

    However …

    … the frank, private and personal exchanges between the nations’ gatherers of information … will now go further underground … and anyway what happened to privacy …

    Very few here put up their real names …

    … and who cares what the USA thinks of Kevin Rudd … its one individual’s opinion …

    Quite frankly, putting the sort of comments I’ve read, into text, is really most unprofessional and demonstrates the incompetence of those public servants and politicians who have been “revealed”. Something I certainly would not do, nor tolerate in any of my management team.

    If Wikileaks really wanted to make a difference (and quite frankly I’m not sure what Wikileaks’, “real” agenda, is) …

    … then they should be targetting the real controllers … the major banks, royalty (particularly Saudi and British), the central banks, oil companies, oligopolies of any kind … and capitalist control of health, education, power, water, transport etc.

    Wikileaks – I suspect – has one agenda “how to make money” … what they do is get someone to steal information and then release it slowly … wow!

    … and also for the record … when the “real” revolution begins, the guillotine is sharpened and ready, just bring your own tumbrills …


    Nasking, repeating the word “bitterness” to try and make the mud stick and denigrate my posts is something that you harangue others about (Murdoch, Abbott and Co et al) … repitition doesn’t make it so …

    It would be nice (for you) if all Labor supporters agreed with everything you write, cut and paste – we don’t …

  51. “It would be nice (for you) if all Labor supporters agreed with everything you write, cut and paste – we don’t …”

    I don’t expect you to TB…but that’s obviously the perception you would like to create…as you have been doin’ for quite some time now.

    but I do expect more than the kind of short mocking comments you too oft throw out these days.

    That’s why I’m pleased to see a longer, more thoughtful comment…even tho I disagree w/ the premise that WikiLeaks has put democracy at risk.

    The very fact that people across the world are comin’ together and showin’ a new or renewed interest in global affairs & issues off the back of these leaks demonstrates it’s had some positive effects.


  52. Speakin’ of corporate aristocrats (see original post)…it seems that Obama has annoyed plenty in his own party w/ a compromise offer that will ensure a number of rich will pay far less on their estates than they would of:

    Obama’s Huge Would-Be Gift To The Scions Of The Super-Rich

    Dan Froomkin (Huffington Post)

    WASHINGTON — Millionaires and billionaires would reap big rewards if President Obama’s tax cut deal becomes law, but thanks to the agreement’s estate-tax provisions it’s their heirs who will make a real killing.

    The Obama concession that’s getting most of the attention in the media is the one that would extend the Bush income tax cuts even for households making over $250,000 a year. That’s a gift to your average millionaire of $139,000 a year for the next two years.

    But it’s the estate tax cut which, despite its relatively lower public profile, has proven even harder for congressional Democrats to swallow. Obama’s deal would free an estimated 40,000 of the biggest estates in the country each year that would otherwise have been subject to the tax from paying a single penny.

    And the approximately 3,500 estates that would remain subject to the tax at all — consisting of the top 0.14 percent of all U.S. estates each year — would pay at a much lower rate.

    Compared to current law, that would amount to a gift in 2011 averaging about $3.5 million for each of the thousand or so estates worth $20 million or more…

    More here:

    I enjoy readin’ the comments at Huff Post. Some get real feisty.


  53. Asher Moses has a story today in the Sydney Morning Herald which encapsulates for me the huge reservations I have about Assange and what he has done at Wikileaks and still thinks he has the right to do. He is an anarchist pure and simple. He is a one man band resistant to advice even from those few self selected individuals who work with him.

    Freedom of information and open government are to me obviously ideals torwards which any democratic society should strive. But undermining democratically elected governments, whatever their faults, hoping to short circuit a path to achieve those ends seems crazy to me.

    I’ve been following very dense and intense threads on Assange and Wikileaks at Larvatus Prodeo and the comments here too and from there finding my way to other threads worldwide. Astonishingly very few comments on posts and articles express serious reservations about how Neo Cons in the States and the right in general in places like Oz will exploit both the information released and the general disruption caused to existing social democratic governments.

    Everything I read there and also watching the selective use of the leaked material by media outlets causes me real concern. I can understand how you feel, TB of Queensland. My gut reaction to this recent Wikileaks saga has been one of deep reservation and concern. Murdoch must be chortling with glee. As the major media player internationally he can do with all these leaked documents what he will; trivialise important issues or blow up gossipy exchanges to damage people like Rudd and others on the left. Assange and his human rights champions like Geoffrey Robertson and Pilger should be focussed on the machinations of entrenched media giants not on the known failings of fallible but democratically elected governments who are ultimately accountable to their electorates.

    To whom is Julian Assange accountable?

  54. Thanks, pwa, I was feeling very lonely out there … and I agree – ’tis but a “gut feeling” …

    … but …

    … and its a big BUT … a gut feeling based on over four decades of watching these bastards play us … particularly when they hold all the cards – and that’s exactly what Wikileaks has done – told the enemy what cards we hold!

    Like it or not there will be losers and winners in this – and I doubt Wikileaks and Assange will be losers … but I suspect we will be …

    The French Revolution produced Napoleon … the English – Cromwell – who suffered … chuckle …

    History MUST be a compulsory subject in a National curriculum … its not hard, it just keeps repeating itself!

  55. I feel that Patricia and TB might be right about all this in one aspect, in that Big Brother just might become more zealous in his watch.

    Earlier in the year the FBI was proposing that every internet service provider in the country keep a record of all the sites that their subscribers visit, for security (of course). It wasn’t supported by the Obama administration.

    But who knows what the thoughts are now?

  56. “And now I’m givin’ you an opportunity to express yerself.”

    Thanks Nas.Yes I’m bona fide, trouble is today I’m too pissed to bone anything. Will be back to slay the conservative dragon as they say, another day. There’s two things I hate in this world and conservatives are both of them. Especially dumb conservatives.

    Let’s hope Wiki keeps churning it out. You know I don’t know about you Nas I feel F&*(%$# great. All those years of telling the man and the dumb Conservatives that support him, we had their number, and were on to them. To be labeled as Marxists and commies.

    2010 in the year of our Lord no matter what goes down, we’re going to get the last laugh.

  57. “a gut feeling based on over four decades of watching these bastards play us … particularly when they hold all the cards”

    Who is “they” TB?

    “told the enemy what cards we hold!”

    TB, are these the same people as THEY…or another enemy? Not havin’ a go…just curious.

    If yer referrin’ to the War on Terror then the enemy is apparently al-Qaeda & affiliated/related groups, the Taliban & so on. Some might add Hamas, Hezbollah, Lashkar-e-Taiba, Jemaah Islamiyah. Even the Iranian regime & Iranian Revolutionary Guard. The list goes on…dependin’ on your perspective.

    To think this lot haven’t got high level supporters/funders in the Saudi, rest of Gulf States, Turkish, Pakistani etc heirarchy would be kiddin’ ourselves…who have mighty influence in America…by way of lobby groups, shares & so on. I doubt there’s little that would’ve surprised them in these releases.

    And as I stated before, I do think it’s important that certain information be scrutinised & redacted if it puts covert operations, soldiers, collaborators etc. lives at risk. This is one reason some have broken away from WikiLeaks to form OpenLeaks.

    But then, you might consider the Chinese our enemies…North Korea…Cuba…or the Russians…I’m not certain about who you are referrin’ to by way of that abstract usage.

    I do know you have expressed fears about asylum seekers arrivin’ on boats who might be enemies tryin’ to infiltrate this country. I imagine yer experience in Vietnam has coloured yer view on this…fair enuff.

    As for the HISTORY comment…I think you’ll find there are plenty of teachers who know their stuff…and have been teaching a rounded and in-depth analysis of history…but oft due to the domination of THE BOX & other infotainment promotin’ technology the messages & information can be drowned out.

    “The French Revolution produced Napoleon … the English – Cromwell – who suffered … chuckle …”

    In actual fact, the Napoleonic era also produced positives…even tho their were dreadful outcomes…and in no way shape or form do I think we are headin’ in that direction…nor do I see Wikileaks contributin’ to anythin’ but more participation by the people in civil discussion & policy development down the road.

    Similar appeared post-the Vietnam War even tho secret war documents had been leaked (see Pentagon Papers).

    Plenty of conservative thinkers & worry warts also flew off the handle about that situation. It helped motivate journos & news establishments:

    Pentagon Papers

    On June 13, 1971, The New York Times began publishing the Pentagon Papers, a documentary history tracing the ultimately doomed involvement of the United States in a grinding war in the jungles and rice paddies of Southeast Asia.

    They demonstrated, among other things, that the Johnson Administration had systematically lied, not only to the public but also to Congress, about a subject of transcendent national interest and significance.

    The Government sought and won a court order restraining further publication after three articles had appeared. Other newspapers then began publishing. They, too, were restrained, until finally, on June 30, 1971, the United States Supreme Court ruled, by a vote of 6 to 3, that publication could resume.

    The fight over the top-secret papers, whose compilation had been ordered by Robert S. McNamara when he was Defense Secretary, became a pivotal moment in the ages-old struggle between the Government and the press. But few would have guessed at the time how much it would change the news media, how much it would change the public view of the news media and the Government and how little it would change the way the Government conducts its business.

    Opponents of the Vietnam war, including Daniel Ellsberg, the onetime hawk turned dove who played a key role in making the papers public, hoped that doing so might persuade President Richard M. Nixon to change his policy on Vietnam. It did not. Less than a year after publication, Haiphong Harbor was mined, and the war dragged on.

    The Pentagon Papers prompted the first attempt ever made by the Federal Government to impose a prior restraint on the press in the name of national security. In his new book, “The Day the Presses Stopped” (University of California Press), David Rudenstine argues that some of the papers (though not the ones printed) could indeed have compromised national security.

    Few if any of the main players in the drama share that view. But even if it is correct, that only makes the precedent stronger; the Constitution, in the Court’s view, makes prior restraint impermissible even if there is some danger to national security.

    Victory emboldened the news media, and the contents of the Pentagon Papers themselves guaranteed, at least for the generation of journalists directly involved, that every Government utterance would be subject to skeptical (and too often cynical) scrutiny. The Nixon Administration responded by creating the Plumbers unit (so called because they were to deal with leaks like that of the papers). That step in turn led to the Watergate scandal and ultimately to Nixon’s resignation. — R. W. Apple Jr., June 23, 1996

    More here:

    Gettin’ back to the Napoleonic era:

    The Napoleonic Code — or Code Napoléon (originally, the Code civil des Français) — is the French civil code, established under Napoléon I in 1804. The code forbade privileges based on birth, allowed freedom of religion, and specified that government jobs go to the most qualified. It was drafted rapidly by a commission of four eminent jurists and entered into force on March 21, 1804. The Napoleonic Code was not the first legal code to be established in a European country with a civil legal system — it was preceded by the Codex Maximilianeus bavaricus civilis (Bavaria, 1756), the Allgemeines Landrecht (Prussia, 1794) and the West Galician Code, (Galicia, then part of Austria, 1797). But it was the first modern legal code to be adopted with a pan-European scope and it strongly influenced the law of many of the countries formed during and after the Napoleonic Wars. The Code, with its stress on clearly written and accessible law, was a major step in replacing the previous patchwork of feudal laws. Historian Robert Holtman regards it as one of the few documents that have influenced the whole world.(Wikipedia)

    As I said on The Political Sword & here previously:

    I’m thrilled that at least people are gettin’ a renewed interest in global affairs…and some who had little or none before.

    AND becomin’ politically active.

    This is not just about anarchy. That’s oft the fear of the settled. And/or financially privileged. And/or those who have children in the military. Understandable.

    But social change sees all kinds of participants…anarchists just one part.

    Just sayin’


  58. “Thanks Nas.Yes I’m bona fide, trouble is today I’m too pissed to bone anything.”

    Cheers Lynot, I hope to join ya soon. Got me bottle of red & a few beers waitin’…just about to put together a late curry.

    Now all I need is some music. 🙂

  59. Ahhh Nas! My favorite how did you know? I started drinking at lunch time I’m F&^%$#.

    Ahhhhhhhh Wiki leaks you came far to late
    Where the fuck were you in nineteen fifty eight
    That’s when we needed the absolute bloody truth
    All those wasted votes in the electoral polling booth

    But I may be a dreamer a total gullible fool
    And I play to much with my worn out tool
    But unlike conservatives I ain’t that naive
    These poor fucks still believe in Adam and Eve.

    Yea I know it’s lame, but I’m pissed. 🙂

  60. After a “couple” of rough reds, it obvious to me (and possibly me alone) that TB & Nas are actually arguing from the same position most of the time… Some history between them has caused a bit of bad blood, suspicion, mistrust, whatever, so now neither is listening (IMOVEO*).

    TB said “a gut feeling based on over four decades of watching these bastards play us… particularly when they hold all the cards – and that’s exactly what Wikileaks has done – told the enemy what cards we hold!

    To me, the “they” TB is referring to is “teh Robber Barons” he’s so passionately condemned for a very long time across the blogosphere.

    Nas, what is your take, IF that’s actually what TB meant, rather than “al-Qaeda & affiliated/related groups, the Taliban & so on“?

    IMOVEO* = In My Obviously Very Excellent Opinion 🙂

  61. Bacchus,
    LOL. If TB & I are arguing from the same position then I must be hearin’ his English & translatin’ into Swahili. But then, my ear canals are like long & windin’ roads. 🙂

    As for the robber barons as TB refers to them…me corporate aristocrats/new aristocrats for many a year, at least since 2004 on blogs…perhaps earlier…there are a specific few that I have referred to over the years that I find are havin’ a somewhat deletarious effect on our society. Some not to the same degree. Too many are a pain in the arse for the rest of us.

    Anyway, I’m presently pissed & floatin’ on a sea of red & hops…probably not unlike yer good self & Migs. Consequently, any further discussion will probably devolve into incoherent & random patterns that might see me implode.

    So I wish thee a good nite. My wee grey cells are wavin’ as they prepare to shrink ever further…as my brain shrivels to the size of a peanut and rolls out my left ear…in all probability about 5am. 🙂


    BTW, Lynot, cool poem…got me chucklin’ Apt.

    Migs, I wouldn’t share either…the likelihood of poisonin’ by way of inferior wine is a great possibilty considerin’ yer teeny duck liver. 🙂


  62. “I’m thrilled that at least people are getting’ a renewed interest in global affairs…and some who had little or none before.

    AND becoming’ politically active.”

    I agree Nas. As much as I am having a chuckle over the exposure by Wiki of some of our leaders as being the rat bags, we always thought they were. I am not an anarchist and would like to see an orderly change what ever that is, come through the ballot box. Both major parties have failed miserably, maybe it’s time for the Greens and independents?

    I would like to live long enough to see Bob Brown as P.M. but sigh…… that ain’t gonna happen.

    As you have said in reference to the problems of Afghanistan, Iraq, It’s our baby now and we are responsible for its future, no matter how tenuous the reasons for our involvement in both wars were… The other problems will fix themselves on the alter of greed. That is the nature of the beast unfortunately.

    I would really like to know what’s in this for Assange?

    I certainly haven’t seen a bright star over Bethlehem of late, you would be battling to find three wise men any where in the M.E. and donkeys are in short supply, apart from Canberra of course. He doesn’t strike me as being a Saviour, and he does like the earthly pursuit of pleasures of the flesh. As indeed do I.

    Interesting times ahead.

  63. Nasking

    In the interests of our moderators I will not enter into a discourse on your innuendo, half-truths and misinterpretation of my posts. Enough people have read my contributions over the past few years to know pretty well where I stand and why, on most subjects.

    The following statement though, must be corrected …

    I do know you have expressed fears about asylum seekers arrivin’ on boats who might be enemies tryin’ to infiltrate this country. I imagine yer experience in Vietnam has coloured yer view on this…fair enuff.

    FYI, I have never set foot on Vietnam soil … nor would I claim to … I have friends who are V Vets … it may also surprise you, that not all protesters against the war in Vietnam were on the “outside looking in” … 😯


    To the moderators … thank you for your indulgence …

    I shall be otherwise engaged this weekend … enjoy! 😉

  64. “I have never set foot on Vietnam soil … nor would I claim to … I have friends who are V Vets …

    Apologies TB, I meant to write “yer experiences related to the Vietnam War”.

    “it may also surprise you, that not all protesters against the war in Vietnam were on the “outside looking in””

    Why would it surprise me? I might’ve been young durin’ the Vietnam War but I did study it at school & uni & have taught units on it…I also lived in Canada durin’ much of the early 70s & we had access to American news & we’d get soldiers who went AWOL comin’ to Canada.

    I’m well acquainted w/ Vietnam Veterans Against the War…and wrote about such durin’ the Kerry run for Presidency.

    Furthermore, I’m not sure that we should assume that people visitin’ this blog are au fait w/ much of our previous contributions, comments, posts.

    Anyway, nuff said.


  65. Reflectin’ on the “Winter Soldiers” got me thinkin’ about an anti-war song I wrote in 2005, recorded w/ a mate in 2007 & put up on YouTube in 08…I took it down awhile back…but decided it might be useful again now.

    Note: The winter tree at the end of the vid is meant to represent the winter soldiers.

    The comments just before some of the end credits talks about “those who came home”.

    The vid is pretty abstract…dealin’ w/ war, homelessness (many vets after Vietnam War went thru this sadly…as have others from other wars…and those affected by corporate corruption & irresponsibility – think GFC)

    Look for the BEAR at the end. 🙂

    dear jesse – greenobservesblue

  66. Well, well, well …

    Domscheit-Berg, who during his time with WikiLeaks often went under the pseudonym Daniel Schmitt, said he quit the project after falling out with Assange over what he described as the lack of transparency in the group’s decision-making process.

    “If you preach transparency to everyone else, you have to be transparent yourself. You have to fulfill the same standards you expect from others, and I think that’s where we’ve not been heading in the same direction philosophically anymore,” he said in the documentary.

    Read more:

    Apology, accepted …

    I’m not sure that we should assume that people visitin’ this blog are au fait w/ much of our previous contributions, comments, posts.

    Then I will gladly explain my position … personally, thank you. 😀

  67. TB, what do Domscheit-Berg’s views have to do w/ WikiLeaks motivatin’ people to become interested in global affairs again?

    Noone I know is holdin’ Assange & the WikiLeaks crew up as pure as driven snow…it’s about motivatin’ people to get back to focus on the complexities of governance & global affairs…an insight for some into alliances & how things are run. And the state of our democracies…and views on other nations revealin’ totalitarian characteristics & behaviour.

    Noone who is a foundin’ member & driver of a group that tries to alter global outlook & push walls down is goin’ to be beyond criticism from plenty of outsiders & ex-“insiders”.

    Envy can also play a part. Just another human trait that can lead to abandonment of a cause/group. And difference of opinion on approach related to principle & ethics.

    You’ll find Patricia has a useful link above. And I mentioned the followin’ at 9:19 pm yesterday:

    “I do think it’s important that certain information be scrutinised & redacted if it puts covert operations, soldiers, collaborators etc. lives at risk. This is one reason some have broken away from WikiLeaks to form OpenLeaks.”

    Ya see TB…now we have more projects sproutin’ up…born from WikiLeaks…refinin’ their approach…learnin’ from previous mistakes…but still wantin’ to hold governments & corporates accountable…it goes on & on.

    Just as The Pentagon Papers & Daniel Ellsberg could be seen as the progenitors (tho, in fact there have been plenty of leakers thruout history)…Assange & WikiLeaks will be seen as motivators in a long line of those who pursue accountability, free speech and exposure of BS & wrongdoin’ & empowerment of the citizenry.

    I dig journalist Seymour Hersh too.

    Mortals, merely mortals…imperfect…but motivators.


  68. TB my reaction is to say what Domscheit-Berg says is true but my instinct tells me that anything that comes out against Assange now from any source now matter how credible must be suspect.

    Two US senators, one the highest law in the land, have said they will do whatever it takes and use whatever means to silence Assange.

    So anybody who speaks against Assange at this time must be sus, especially since they have now locked Assange away in isolation so he cannot talk to anyone.

  69. I see there has been a comment about being misquoted.

    Well i am also upset at being misquoted. Adrian of Nowra made this comment

    “So Mark Arbib and a couple of his cronies were the source of the ALP leaks and has been snitching on Rudd and ALP machinations to the US embassy for a few years now.

    Another in a long line of things Neil has gotten wrong as he said many times Rudd was the source of the ALP leaks.”

    I have never ever stated that Rudd leaked about himself to the Americans that he was a manicial control freak and that he is a total arsehole unfit to be in govt.

    What i did say was that he leaked against Gillard during the last election and has stuff on her that he will dump if he is not given the Foreign Affairs portfolio.

  70. “What i did say was that he leaked against Gillard during the last election and has stuff on her that he will dump if he is not given the Foreign Affairs portfolio.”

    Neil, and you had lunch w/ Laurie Oakes…when? 🙂


  71. The indications are Arbib leaked Neil. Arbib told the Americans of a Rudd spill months before it happened and he didn’t want Gillard as PM but ended up backing her.

    Since you’re into making things up how about this conspiracy theory?

    Arbib wanted Labor to lose the last election, he certainly did things that indicated that, running a very terrible campaign for instance and his Q & A no show. The reason for doing this was to place himself to challenge for the leadership at the end of the Coalition’s first term. Rudd was gone because of his machinations, he didn’t want Gillard there so losing a election everyone thought they would win would finish her and the result would be a lame duck leader in place until the right time for Arbib to step up.

    My point was that you keep saying Rudd leaked with absolute certainty and make accusations about things you have no idea about.

    You’re a blind ideological zealot Neil and everything you say is tainted by that. Your unadulterated adoration of Howard is ample proof for it.

  72. Another in a long line of things Neil has gotten wrong as he said many times Rudd was the source of the ALP leaks.”

    I have never ever stated that Rudd leaked about himself to the Americans that he was a manicial control freak and that he is a total arsehole unfit to be in govt.

    Odd. Very odd.

    I seem to recall the odd comment from Neil that Rudd was the leaker. On a zillion other occasions Neil blamed public servants. I took offence to the latter, but remained silent. Recent admissions have shown that Neil was wrong. He’ll never admit it, but he doesn’t have to admit it. He was wrong, and we all know it.

    And the bit about Rudd being unfit to be in govt is also odd. He accuses some people in Labor of getting rid of Rudd, yet on the other hand he reckons Rudd shouldn’t have been there in the first place.

    Neil. you certainly lack the ability to compose rational thought.

  73. “I seem to recall the odd comment from Neil that Rudd was the leaker.”

    Yes, I said that Rudd was the one leaking the things that went on in Cabinet before the last election which embarrassed the ALP. The leaks stopped after the meeting with gillard when some deal was done.

    I never stated that the source of the leaks to the US State dept that Rudd was a nutjob was Rudd himself.

    Please show me where I said the Rudd was the source of the leaks to the US State dept.

  74. Please show me where I said the Rudd was the source of the leaks to the US State dept.

    What the hell are you talking about? I was referring to this, and you know it, which was in the same comment you posted above:

    Yes, I said that Rudd was the one leaking the things that went on in Cabinet before the last election which embarrassed the ALP.

    By your first comment (I quoted above) you have confirmed to me that you are nothing but a pathetic troll who repeatedly attempts to put words into other people’s mouths.

  75. “By your first comment (I quoted above) you have confirmed to me that you are nothing but a pathetic troll who repeatedly attempts to put words into other people’s mouths.”

    Migs you butted into an accussation that Adrian made about me.

    ““So Mark Arbib and a couple of his cronies were the source of the ALP leaks and has been snitching on Rudd and ALP machinations to the US embassy for a few years now.

    Another in a long line of things Neil has gotten wrong as he said many times Rudd was the source of the ALP leaks.””

    I never stated that Rudd was the leaker who was leaking to the US state dept. It was Arbib.

    I did state that Rudd was leaking during the last election campaign about things that went on in cabinet.

  76. Migs, Neil sees absolutely nothing wrong with continually averring that Rudd was the leaker during the election campaign. A fallacious statement that, like many of his other small handful of attack points, he repeats as often as possible and will still be repeating for a very long time to come.

    He won’t produce any evidence, any sources or any concrete proof, just make the innuendo over and over hardly ever prefacing it with “in my opinion” or “though I have no evidence I believe” etc.

    And again he hijacks a topic and turns it into being about him.

  77. Neil, I’m allowed to butt in; it’s my blog site. And further, I’ll always stand beside Mobius in whatever he says. He has credibility.

  78. “Migs, Neil sees absolutely nothing wrong with continually averring that Rudd was the leaker during the election campaign.”

    Thank you. That is what i said. I did not say that Rudd leaked about himself to the US Embassy that he was a control freak.

    Mark Arbib did that.

    “Neil, I’m allowed to butt in;”

    Yes but you butted in and made an incorrect statement.

    “And again he hijacks a topic and turns it into being about him.”

    You made an incorrect statement about me and I was just correcting your error.

  79. Hang on Neil, you keep making incorrect statements about Rudd, and about many other Labor politicians and about the Labor party itself but you never acknowledge a correction or the facts, yet now get uppity about one statement that could be just as true as any you’ve ever made?

    Arbib could have been and is more likely to be the source of the leaks during the election than Rudd, yet you usuriously blame Rudd as a statement of absolute fact when anyone of several people could have been the source, even non Labor people as has been pointed out to you previously.

  80. “Arbib could have been and is more likely to be the source of the leaks during the election than Rudd,”

    The election leaks mentioned some things that happened in Cabinet. Things Like Gillard opposed Labors parental leave scheme in Cabinet discussions.

    I do not think that Arbib would have access to Cabinet discussions.

  81. Thnx for the link Feral.

    As for Assange…certainly a paranoid man, not unexpected. And hypocritical…but then, how does one unearth & communicate the secrets of governments & large corporations w/out protectin’ themselves from interference…ensurin’ ya can’t be got at? Underminin’ yer own beliefs…that contradiction…is bound to occur.

    I did find the end of the piece from the The Age worth reflectin’ on:

    On reflection, Lowenstein approves of what Assange has made of his talents.

    ”Considering his manifesto about privacy, I’m sure he will feel fine about me passing on this conversation,” he says.

    ”I definitely had admiration for what his skills were and certainly have admiration for what he has ended up doing with them … What he’s doing is a great thing.”

    He said many early hackers had sold out their values as soon the world wide web became a valuable commodity.

    ”A lot of them were bought off by corporate jobs and are working at [securing commercial] computer systems.

    ”I’m actually impressed that he didn’t go that way.”

    Assange doesn’t sound to me like someone whose out there to make the big bucks. Rather, he’s driven by other goals…and beliefs that lie beneath.


  82. patricia & TB, I share your reservations about Assange and wikileaks and they are fuelled by the support from the likes of the Murdochracy. It makes me deeply, deeply suspicious of Assange’s and wikileaks motives.

    I too can’t understand why they haven’t published anything about the Rodentochracy or Bushistan; there is plenty to leak about.

    Speaking of duck liver, I had to sit between two people today who had duck livers as an entrée.

    Just thank your lucky stars you’re not a goose, Migs. Lol!

  83. THE Howard government urged the United States to force the collapse of the North Korean regime by denying it aid, despite advice that the country had a growing nuclear arsenal and could unleash an artillery barrage on South Korea’s capital at a moment’s notice.

    ”Let the whole place go to shit, that’s the best thing that could happen,” the foreign affairs minister, Alexander Downer, told the commander of US and United Nations forces in South Korea at a meeting in Canberra in 2005…

    ”If US officials wanted to hear the ‘bleeding hearts’ view of ‘peace and love’ with respect to North Korea, Downer joked, they only had to visit his colleagues in New Zealand. Mr Downer said he personally agreed with George Bush that tyranny had to be ended,” the cable says.

    The US report says Mr Downer ”chuckled” at the thought that US forces might strike North Korea first.


Leave a Comment

Fill in your details below or click an icon to log in: Logo

You are commenting using your account. Log Out /  Change )

Google photo

You are commenting using your Google account. Log Out /  Change )

Twitter picture

You are commenting using your Twitter account. Log Out /  Change )

Facebook photo

You are commenting using your Facebook account. Log Out /  Change )

Connecting to %s